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AoD forces you to play certain roles?

Andhaira

Arcane
Joined
Nov 25, 2007
Messages
1,868,956
So then rename merchant to something else; such as Guild Member. See the thing is the word Merchant makes one thingk about...a fucking MERCHANT.

Merchants buy/sell stuff.
 

galsiah

Erudite
Joined
Dec 12, 2005
Messages
1,613
Location
Montreal
Andhaira said:
Merchants buy/sell stuff.
Absolutely - potentially including lives.
Your point hasn't been that they're not buying and selling, but rather that they're not doing it in the manner you'd expect. They are merchants, since they are in the business of trade. They're just not doing it in a stereotypical friendly-street-trader style. Hiring an assassin both is trade, and supports the organization's trading efforts.

If the merchants of AoD didn't trade, you'd have a point. That's not the case. They just don't consistently trade the goods you expect in the style you expect. You have the right to expect a decent explanation of the setting and background before you pick it. You have no right to expect a perfectly reasonable name to be changed simply because it conflicts with your generic-merchant-in-generic-fantasy associations.
 

Lumpy

Arcane
Joined
Sep 11, 2005
Messages
8,525
Andhaira said:
So then rename merchant to something else; such as Guild Member. See the thing is the word Merchant makes one thingk about...a fucking MERCHANT.

Merchants buy/sell stuff.
[succumb to trolling]Yes, you buy a contract killing.[/loss of dignity]
 

inwoker

Arcane
Glory to Ukraine
Joined
Apr 27, 2007
Messages
15,432
Location
Kyiv, Ukraine
IT IS TOTALLY IMPOSSIBLE TO AVOID KILLING PLAYING MERCHANT IN AOD

On serious note: kingcomrade spam this thread already!!!!!!!
 

MetalCraze

Arcane
Joined
Jul 3, 2007
Messages
21,104
Location
Urkanistan
Mech said:
Ivy Mike said:
Hey look, someone is drawing the wrong conclusions from the wrong facts. Well done kid.

Then maybe you should inform him instead of being a jackass? Oh I am sorry that would take effort.

he is andhaira.
resistance is futile.
 

Durwyn

Prophet
Joined
Oct 29, 2006
Messages
1,132
Location
Erewhon
Thread:
fail-24.jpg
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
Jan 7, 2003
Messages
28,024
Andhaira said:
Why the fuck can't I play as an honest trader who wants nothing to do with bloodshed? Thats just stupid.
Or why the fuck can't you play as a monk or wizard? That's just stupid. Or maybe it's not that kind of game. Food for thought for "slow and methodical thinkers".

AoD is not a trading RPG like Golden Lands and our "merchant" profession isn't a class. It's not what you do, it's who you work for. I've stated many times that AoD's merchants guild is similar to Star Wars' Trade Federation and that it's not a guild of "honest traders".

If you are not interested in playing such a character, pick another profession or pick none. If playing an honest trader is very important to you, than AoD isn't for you. Try Golden Lands or a space trader with RPG elements or Oblivion. I hear you can play all kinds of characters in that game.

elander_ said:
Section8 said:
At the end of the day, you're choosing a profession, and as such you're subject to the orders of your employer. If you don't want to be beholden to such whims, don't choose an employer. You can still create a character skilled as a merchant without being a part of the merchants guild.

What about the map the player needs to get from the merchant he murders. Some people say the player needs to get that map for the story to progress. That's why you are forced to do those quests if i understand correctly how it works.
Each profession, including "None", has its own way of acquiring the map.

Andhaira said:
But see, picking most of the other professions leads to doing something directly RELaTED to that profession. For example when you select an assassin, you have to kill the merchy. No matter how you do it, the end result is the same and it makes ense because you are an ASSASSIN.

When you play a merc you are PAID to PROTECT the merchant. See, you are a MERCENARY, so it makes sense.

But when you pick a fucking MERCHANT, you are forced to hire an assassin to kill someone...that is NOT something a merchant does!!
Ever heard about the East Indian Trading Company?
 

elander_

Arbiter
Joined
Oct 7, 2005
Messages
2,015
Vault Dweller said:
Each profession, including "None", has its own way of acquiring the map.

OK that sounds better. Being lose in the world without any compromises is my favorite play style.
 

Andhaira

Arcane
Joined
Nov 25, 2007
Messages
1,868,956
AoD is not a trading RPG like Golden Lands and our "merchant" profession isn't a class. It's not what you do, it's who you work for. I've stated many times that AoD's merchants guild is similar to Star Wars' Trade Federation and that it's not a guild of "honest traders".

The Star Wars trade federation was a bunch of bumbling idiots who were being led astray by a powerful lord of evil. So you are saying if you play a merchant you are an unknowing spawn of evil?


If you are not interested in playing such a character, pick another profession or pick none. If playing an honest trader is very important to you, than AoD isn't for you. Try Golden Lands or a space trader with RPG elements or Oblivion. I hear you can play all kinds of characters in that game.

I don't want an honest trader; all I want is that my merchant's vignette have something merchanty in it! If the DEFINITION of merchant in AoD is different (i.e. merchants are killers) then rename them into somethingmore approp[riate so that rpg enthusiasts who play AoD with the intention of ptaking a non-violent dialogue heavy path wont mistakenly select MERCHANT as their background;and be utterly shocked when they find out the MERCHANT is actually just a murderer and thug.

Maybe rename MERCHANT to BUTCHER, and the merchants guild into the butchers guild. It seems it will be more appropriate for the gameworld and decieve people less.


Each profession, including "None", has its own way of acquiring the map.

What if I don't want a map? I mean in arcanum, you could toss away that ring after the first cutscene and play the game as you chose. I dislike having cliches shoved downmy throat. I dont want a map. This is supposed to be a post apoc rpg, not an indiana jones remake!

Ever heard about the East Indian Trading Company?[/quote]

Yes. Have you?

My point still stands.
 

luckyb0y

Scholar
Joined
Apr 25, 2005
Messages
355
Why do you have to be such an annoying daft cunt? I think you understand the whole merchant guild thing perfectly well, you just can't give up the silly trolling.
 

Andhaira

Arcane
Joined
Nov 25, 2007
Messages
1,868,956
^^ You are the troll...ALT!

Grow some balls, reveal thy true self and THEN we shall debate!
 

Lumpy

Arcane
Joined
Sep 11, 2005
Messages
8,525
Andhaira said:
What if I don't want a map? I mean in arcanum, you could toss away that ring after the first cutscene and play the game as you chose. I dislike having cliches shoved downmy throat. I dont want a map. This is supposed to be a post apoc rpg, not an indiana jones remake!
Really? Pray tell, how did you get to Caladon without doing the main quest?
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
Jan 7, 2003
Messages
28,024
Andhaira said:
The Star Wars trade federation was a bunch of bumbling idiots who were being led astray by a powerful lord of evil. So you are saying if you play a merchant you are an unknowing spawn of evil?
They also had a droid army. So you are saying that if you play a merchant you'll be able to command a droid army? Hmm?

I don't want an honest trader; all I want is that my merchant's vignette have something merchanty in it!
Then find another game to play.

Maybe rename MERCHANT to BUTCHER, and the merchants guild into the butchers guild. It seems it will be more appropriate for the gameworld and decieve people less.
FALSE ADVARTISAMENT!!!

What if I don't want a map?
Then find another game to play.

I mean in arcanum, you could toss away that ring after the first cutscene and play the game as you chose.
Ok, remember when I said that AoD is actually Arcanum 2? Well, I lied.
 

inwoker

Arcane
Glory to Ukraine
Joined
Apr 27, 2007
Messages
15,432
Location
Kyiv, Ukraine
Andhaira said:
The Star Wars trade federation was a bunch of bumbling idiots who were being led astray by a powerful lord of evil. So you are saying if you play a merchant you are an unknowing spawn of evil?

No, he is saying that you're idiot. Very annoying idiot.
 

Mareus

Magister
Joined
Apr 5, 2008
Messages
1,404
Location
Atlantis
Crap. How can you guys not see what Andhaira is talking about? I have been reading this debate and although I know I will get my ass thrashed I have to agree on some points with Andhaira.

1. If a merchant is supposed to be such a devious character, I hope there will be a very detailed explanation of who the merchants actualy are before starting the game. (That is a must, because I don't want to start the game and finding out after 30 minutes that I am a murderor and not be allowed to do anything about it.)

2. If VD is really trying to make a game where you have multiple choices, I think there should be an option to chose a different path, just for the sake of choice. I mean even if the merchants are kind of mafia, there could always be other ways to get the map. Why not paying a thief to steal the map? Why assasination? It doesn't even make sense, because hiring a thief should cost less then hiring an assasin to kill someone, and it raises a lot less questions. Does playing a merchant mean I have to be a murderer from the beggining? Now that is what should be changed and I agree there with Andhaira. There are so many ways to avoid killing the guy with the map that I really don't understand why VD chose murder (the most wicked and extreme solution) as the only way. Or if it has to be murder, at least make it a bit more personal like revenge for the other merchant killing your brother or a girl. Something that will not put so much weight on your concience from the start of the game.

3. Maybe someone would want to play a merchant that doesn't agree with the merchant guild, so he wants out. He doesn't want to kill, because he decided to change his way of life for better or worse, so he decided to blackmail the other merchant with something. From stealing, blackmailing, buying VD chose murder just to get the map. Wrong choice if you ask me. Here are some other options you could have. Meeting with the map merchant and negotiating for the map. Intimidating, bribing... Maybe even setting a trap -> capturing him and then stealing the map. So many other options, but no... it has to be murder.WHY??

I m just saying the merchant murdering a guy for a map may be a bit too extreme for the start of the game. It really puts weight on your conscience. No one is saying the game will suck because of it, I am just saying that a less extreme choice would be a lot better for the start of the game until you decide what kind of character you want to play and it wouldn't even take much effort to implement some of the other choices in it. So VD please do not tell me you do not see logic in my words.
 
Joined
May 14, 2008
Messages
17
Exactly Maerus! I like you already, and welcome you to Codexia with open arms. More thoughtful people such as your good self will eventually make this (aka Codexia!) the shining beacon to guide all other rpg websites floundering about in the darkness that I know it can be.

All your points are poignant and irrefutable; in the end one has to admit that it is simply a programming flaw. (which can still be rectified by simply allowing the merchant class to have different ways of achieving the first quest of getting the map)
 

Mareus

Magister
Joined
Apr 5, 2008
Messages
1,404
Location
Atlantis
Master_of_teh_Obvious said:
Exactly Maerus! I like you already, and welcome you to Codexia with open arms. More thoughtful people such as your good self will eventually make this (aka Codexia!) the shining beacon to guide all other rpg websites floundering about in the darkness that I know it can be.

All your points are poignant and irrefutable; in the end one has to admit that it is simply a programming flaw. (which can still be rectified by simply allowing the merchant class to have different ways of achieving the first quest of getting the map)

Heh, I m not actually new to the codex and like I said many times. I may have a bad attitude but I know what makes the games great. Let's just hope VD listens to our suggestion.
 

Noceur

Liturgist
Joined
Mar 23, 2006
Messages
199
Location
Tar Pits
Heh, one would think Age of Decadence would give away a few hints on what state the game world is in.
 
Joined
May 14, 2008
Messages
17
One would think that Merchant would give some hint as to what the class/career does!
 

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