Butthurt publisher lackey or Codexian Cassandra? You decide

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POV? We were talking about the people who spent the money on them.
What does google say to this:
"Donation, a gift given, typically to a cause or/and for charitable purposes"
Makes sense. Thank you Mr. Google.

Of course. They expect a game. That's why I said it's preordering a game and not about being a shareholder.

Then he's seriously comparing kickstarter founding with real investments as a shareholder!

You know the kind of shareholder who expects earning real money with his investment and not earning "digital downloads" or "potatoes" (which really means "fun" and "entertainment").

Don't be like him.

Those types of shareholders also exert a constant pressure for gaming industry to be more and more dumbed down, FYI.

They don't need help planning their shit. Most adults are financially responsible enough to handle a budget under $100k, so the prospective developers can ask their parents for help if they're not confident enough in their planning capability. Nobody needs a publisher for laughably small budgets like that. And, again, they don't need help planning their development. A publisher won't tell a developer how much work implementing a new character class for their turn-based tactical RPG on the iOS is going to require, the developer needs to be able to figure it out for themselves. The reason a lot of indie projects don't make their release date, is that figuring this out isn't easy without a ton of experience making games, and by "making games", I don't mean "writing design docs".

The only thing a publisher does is give a developer further incentive to meet milestones. Honestly though, indie developers don't fail at meeting milestones because they're lazy.

Did this person delete all their posts or something? I can't see this Oedipus Raper that people are talking to.

Those are things said by the blogger on his site, copy pasted here.

This blogger is a German "professional" btw...

first off this isn't directed at the rest of your post just this

actually bro I really don't have much reason to have faith in the general ability of people to consistantly away from the banal shit boring


one example: I have seen this first hand by experiencing how reddit's r/gaming changed from something vaguely tolerable to a piece of shit subsection based on upvoting shitty reposted humor, copies of a copy of a copy of successful picture memes, valve is awesome, bethesda is awesome, hey guys remember this underrated gem/look at what I found in a garage sale for 1.99 (picture of Super Mario World/Zelda LTTP/Chrono Trigger cartridge), the AAA gaming flavor of the week, checkout what my girlfriend made, check out this nintendo/valve related franchise reference I crafted, check out this picture I took of mario made from post-its or colored biscuits etc etc etc forever and ever onwards

http://www.reddit.com/r/Gaming
see for yourself the frontpage is all picture posts, all the time

that's what you get when the voice of the subreddit becomes a million strong, and that's just the submissions, the posts are equally horrible and I really don't have the time to rant about those

in the end the moderators stopped giving their constant party line of 'these are on the frontpage because it's what people want, we can't stop that because this is supposed to be how upvoting works, and the most people upvote this kind of stuff' and made seperate subs for news-only posts or 'intelligent discourse'
Teepo knows what I'm talking about
And you know how many subscribers the 'informative content' spinoff has now?
http://www.reddit.com/r/Games/
80k. Compared to 1.3 million.
also the posts in that one are quite stupid as well, lots of apologist middle of the level crap gets upvoted because of how inoffensively they're worded

and that's the supposedly enlightened nerd internet gamer minority, not your casual console fan ready to have his eyes opened to the truth and what have you

PS "No one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American public."

awww yeah vote with your wallets

(also pokemon is family friendly, has a lot of cute monsters to capture and aggressive merchandising, note I haven't said that it's shit at all I just haven't gotten into it yet, and I really would like to see how well tactical games like Fire Emblem do in the US versus other genres)

I wonder what kind of legal recourse all these people funding have? I mean, if some 3 million project fails, can there be some class action suite against the project leaders?

There was some project mentioned here that raised $10,000 and never delivered and the project leader simply never responded back, so what gives with that?

see, what I thought you meant by 'people' and referring to pokemon and publishers and such, is that the entire market in general is actually quite smart in some subversion of the 'don't underestimate the intelligence of gamers' line from whichever dipshit said it in response to dumbing down of features

and the majority of the market is what they want to aim for on behalf of their investors, so dragon age becomes dragon age 2, because the amount of core fans aren't superior to the call of duty market numbers. It doesn't matter they have the oldest fan base, it isn't enough. And so D&D 3.5 becomes D&D 4.
And you see a lot of discussions like this on reddit as well, whenever something that doesn't need fixing gets dumbed down or streamlined, if you don't get the 'it's a good idea shut up' type reply you get the 'well it's good business sense so deal with it ps I for one have an open mind and look forward to the x-com fps'. You probably agree with this already.

Luckily for paradox fans their ceo seems to know that their niche genre will not survive if they try to water it down since it doesn't have the necessary bolt-on possibilities for mainstream success unless maybe they turn the countries and their sub-territories into anthropomorphic little girls and their respective gangs or something and have the global battlefield as a high school and you can date them maybe I've said too much

Ok thx. People were slapping a name on the quote so it confused me.

Which reminds me, just some days ago my brother comes with this friend who has an iPad that I always told them never to buy and he wants to watch some images or films, or circumvent some Apple DRM I forgot what it was, I just remember he bought an USB stick + adapter for 80 Euros and couldn't use it.
My brother said great that I have degree in IT and he should ask me. I just tell them to download IrfanView and Mediaplayer Classic and the issue is solved in five minutes.
To which they actually lecture me it's only possible on "Windows" like I am some retard, and then they realize what retards THEY are. I just shrugged my shoulders and told them I can't help them with Apple.
They spent two more hours and I didn't even give a shit if they accomplished anything.
No, in fact I was feeling great about it

I don't know, but paradox is also on my shit list, together with matrixgames. With Paradox the last straw was Steam in all their upcoming garbage, and the way they ruined AGEOD.

My hope is that with kickstarter such substitute drugs as paradox and matrix will die.

Crusader Kings 2, Victoria II and Hearts of Iron 3 now have mandatory shitty steam DRM on Gamersgate? Really?

Because according to the site they are DRM-free. And I only buy their DRM-free games.

Not sure if the publisher should be blamed in the case of third-party developers who got their games published by Paradox, because considering they don't shove DRM into the games they develop, it would make no sense for them to force developers whose games they publish to use one.

Thing is, some people will indeed want shorter games. I don't know what sort of people those are, but then, say with books, you can have a novel and you can have a comic book and someone might want to only read the comic books. That's cool. Someone might not like films and stick to Mexican soap operas. That's cool too. What's uncool is when the market is flooded with comic books and soap opera.

Did the book publishers stop reprinting Shakespeare, Tolstoy and Cervantes because what's popular today is the Mutant Teenager types of comics? Did publishers stop accepting/publishing novels? Fuck no. Do novels still take longer to produce than comic books? It probably is the case with most. Yeah yeah, games aren't books, but what prevents people from re-publishing their IPs as parts of "Golden Age Collectibles" and have smaller, "junior" semi-indie studios doing classic/avant garde shit? (Also fuck avant garde but still, why the fuck not?)

So yeah, it's fine to have some amount of short games on the market, but the entirety of AAA? Fuck thAAAt.

No. I didn't want so spread false information, sorry. CK2 fans seem to be really happy with their game. I just had a look at two new games (Arctic War and Mashter of Arcane) and both will force steam on the user, Naval War even on their fucking demo.

I can recognize CK has a lot polish. But as to the famous Clausewitz engine, unfortunately I hate that stuff with a passion. You may call me a tbtard, and a butthurt AGEOD fanboi. But forcing one of the best turn based games in recent history into the Clausewitz real time style is a huge fucking crime. A compromise with them using the Clausewitz engine for a turn based game would have been the only right option. After that decision it doesn't even matter to me that the graphics look absolutely terrible too.

hahaohwow.jpg


Well, financially responsible people are by default able to manage money, but a whole lot of people aren't. I have seen people mangle 2k$ budgets badly, so no your faith in peoples ability to manage money is touching and completely misplaced.

Yeah and they can help with shit like distribution and shit like scope and to have an idea what is needed and so on.

There is a reason why so many games are made by publishers. They fill a function.

What is your hangups with comparisons anyways? To compare things doesn't mean you say they are the same thing. To compare is to examine in order to note the similarities or differences of something. In this case we have the kickstarter funding which is similar to investments in that they provide funding, and dissimilar in that they don't give you any rights to hold the people spending money accountable, and they give you no slice of the profits. See how some people can see this as problematic?

And when they don't get the game, they are alike an investor in that their are screwed out of their moneys worth.

No they don't, but the boxed copies have steam.

Investors who lose money don't get butthurt though, they blame themselves for misjudging the value of the investment, then move on.

Obvious slippery slope is obvious.

My time as a Paradox customer will last until they decide to shove steam on all available copies of their games for sale, including the ones on Gamersgate. Afterwards I can only hope they will regret it dearly soon and that Kickstarter will deliver enough finished and good games.

WTF Paradox? The people who buy most of the types of games they develop and/or publish aren't ADHD 12-year old retards who will only buy a game because there is no pirate version at release date or before.

From reading the Paradox forums I got the impression that Steam is primarily about pushing DLC and simplifying patching rather than DRM. Once installed the games don't even require Steam to run, you can zip the game dir up and play it on a different computer if you want to.

I don't have Steam, but it's a misconception that you need to be On-line to play Steam-bought games? No DRM?

The level of DRM on Steam varies from game to game. Some require you to be online constantly, others just need the Steam application to be running, and a few have no DRM.

/r/gaming is where I go for all my game related content. The reason I come here is to make myself feel better by flaming the fuck out of people.

I'm kidding btw. I never look at /r/gaming. Feelings like I'm getting swarmed by thousands of Hoopy's when I post there. I'm afraid it'll leave me permanently retarded.