Carmack accused of stealing Zenimax's tech for Oculus VR

[Ranselknulf]

I'll take your word on it, I'm not exactly an expert on Carmack.

 

[DalekFlay]

If he really did work for both at the same time and signed a typical corporate contract with Zenimax where they own everything he created while an employee... well... could get interesting.

 

[Sceptic]

If he really did work for both at the same time and signed a typical corporate contract with Zenimax where they own everything he created while an employee... well... could get interesting.

Pretty sure that with these types of contracts they only own what he creates on company time and/or company computers. There's no way they can own what he creates at home, on his personal computer, in his spare time.

 

[DalekFlay]

If he really did work for both at the same time and signed a typical corporate contract with Zenimax where they own everything he created while an employee... well... could get interesting.

Pretty sure that with these types of contracts they only own what he creates on company time and/or company computers. There's no way they can own what he creates at home, on his personal computer, in his spare time.

I've heard of some pretty crazy contracts that try and do just that, actually. And either way he would have to prove he never worked on that stuff on company time, or that Occulus never used what he did work on. And Zenimax say they have a written confession of the opposite, so... like I said, could get interesting.

 

[chestburster]

Fuck IP rights. And fuck Zenimax.

http://www.vg247.com/2014/05/01/joh...axs-intellectual-property-with-him-to-oculus/

ZeniMax has filed a legal notice against id Software founder John Carmack, accusing him of taking “ZeniMax’s intellectual property with him to Oculus,” according to The Wall Street Journal.


The firm claims Carmack took software he was developing while at id Software with him when he left the firm he co-founded for Oculus VR.

Carkmack took to Twitter to state that while ZeniMax may “own the code” he wrote, “no work ever done has been patented.

“No work I have ever done has been patented,” he said. “Zenimax owns the code that I wrote, but they don’t own VR.”

While Oculus is denying the claim, ZeniMax sent a formal legal notice to the firm asking it to draw up a licensing agreement with it, or ZeniMax will take the company to court.

The claim also states that Oculus VR boss Palmer Luckey was aware of property owned by Zenimax was in-house and acknowledged said property in writing.

A spokesman for Oculus told the Wall Street Journal that the situation was “unfortunate, but when there’s this type of transaction, people come out of the woodwork with ridiculous and absurd claims.”

“We intend to vigorously defend Oculus and its investors to the fullest extent,” Oculus continued.

It is unknown at present whether Facebook was aware that ZeniMax was in the process of seeking compensation for its intellectual property developed with the Oculus Rift by Carmack when it made the $2 billion deal.

ZeniMax issued a statement to WSJ noting it had “sent formal notice of its legal rights,” and that it “believes it is necessary to address these matters now and will take the necessary action to protect its interests.”

According to the report, ZeniMax has been seeking compensation from Oculus since August 2012, after Carmack was sent an early prototype of Oculus Rift by Palmer Luckey.

Carmack has demonstrated his modified version of the headset earlier that year during E3 that year, which ZeniMax claims was the “template for Oculus’s Rift headset,” according to the WSJ. Carmack mentioned at the convention that he created new software for the headset in order to make it a “workable product.”

In February 2014, ZeniMax requested that Carmack to disclose any VR inventions created while working at id. Come April 18, ZeniMax contacted Oculus’s lawyers as well as Facebook’s general counsel, Colin Stretch stating: “It was only through the concerted efforts of Mr. Carmack, using technology developed over many years at, and owned by, ZeniMax, that Mr. Luckey was able to transform his garage-based pipe dream into a working reality.”

Carmack became CTO at Oculus VR back in August 2013, before leaving id Software in November 2013 after attempting to convince ZeniMax to develop games for virtual reality and was turned down.

 

[Erzherzog]

Is anyone surprised? Think of how many lawsuits Zenimax files and it's always when they know they'll make a good payday. Just like with the Minecraft guy, the Fallout MMO, now this.

 

[Spectacle]

If he really did work for both at the same time and signed a typical corporate contract with Zenimax where they own everything he created while an employee... well... could get interesting.

I doubt Carmack would have signed a contract like that since it would potentially allow zionmax to mess with his rocket business that he was running alongside ID when they were acquired by ZM. He's a smart guy and very important to ID so he would have been able to negotiate the contract he wanted.

It sounds like Carmack was playing around with VR and wrote some code for it on company time, and that's what's got zionmax's jimmies rustled. Oculus can probably get around it by simply replacing any code that carmack brought with him, can't be too hard.

 

[Gord]

Well, in patent law at least (but that may differ from country to country), if you invent something that might result in a patent while you are working for some company and said company has any reasonable proof that your invention is the result of your work there or has been done using company resources, you are at their mercy.

However, this seems not to be a patent case but "only" IP? Anyway, lets get out the popcorn and see what comes out of it.

 

[Davaris]

Is anyone surprised? Think of how many lawsuits Zenimax files and it's always when they know they'll make a good payday. Just like with the Minecraft guy, the Fallout MMO, now this.

They probably have a full time staff of lawyers with nothing better to do but troll.

 

[Infinitron]

A comment from RPS:

It sounds more like Zenimax thought that by landing Carmack’s talent to Oculus, they would be able to become a major shareholder and thus make money off Oculus’s VR tech. Note the comment on “equity ownership”. They basically expected to partially own Oculus Rift via Carmack’s involvement in the project.

Instead Carmack got excited about all the new tech and ran off from Zenimax to Oculus. The result is that instead of making money off shiny new VR tech, Zenimax lost one of the greatest programmers in the world.

All things considered, that is a major reason for extreme butthurt. No idea if they actually have the legal grounding to get back at Oculus, though, or if they’re just whining in public.

 

[Metro]

Oculus is going to be DOA, why bother?

 

[agris]

It's basically like working on a job and earning experience while doing it. Then leave the company and get sued for using your experience on a new job

This is the basis of that employer-employee relationship known as the "post-doc".

EDIT: also, remember that ZeniMax's board is staffed by a lot of Entertainment (w/ a capital E) and Hollywood bigwigs, and litigious is often their middle name. The MPAA suits through the early to mid 2000s show how butthurt the studios and principle investors can get.

 

[zwanzig_zwoelf]

Fuck Zenimax. And fuck Bethesda. Fuck both of them in the ass with the emergent dildo.
This makes me think that one of these days I'm gonna get sued by a bunch of faggots only because I decided to disclose some information about Fallout 3.
I bet Todd Howard laughs his ass off reading my posts, thinking 'Long time no see, Ingvar, enjoy looking like an idiot, when me, Bethesda team and Zenimax guys are done laughing, we'll get to you'.

Wait.
Shit.

 

[Destroid]

Somehow I doubt one of the co-founders of Id gave himself a shitty industry standard contract.

 

[Whisky]

Fuck Zenimax. And fuck Bethesda. Fuck both of them in the ass with the emergent dildo.
This makes me think that one of these days I'm gonna get sued by a bunch of faggots only because I decided to disclose some information about Fallout 3.
I bet Todd Howard laughs his ass off reading my posts, thinking 'Long time no see, Ingvar, enjoy looking like an idiot, when me, Bethesda team and Zenimax guys are done laughing, we'll get to you'.

Wait.
Shit.

Two essential-tagged lawyers are now enroute to your location.

Thank you for confessing.

 

[sea]

Interesting, to say the least. Depending on Carmack's contract he could indeed be screwed here - it's very common in technology-related industries for contracts to prevent work outside of the company for commercial gain, especially work that falls in that same category. It's actually quite possible that Carmack acted in the wrong here - though I agree that perhaps Zenimax's actions here are, ahem, specious.

 

[Abelian]

I agree that perhaps Zenimax's actions here are, ahem, auspicious.

Fixed for shameless monetization and profiteering.

 

[:Flash:]

A comment from RPS:

extreme butthurt.

RPS is using Codex slang now?

 

[Davaris]

Interesting, to say the least. Depending on Carmack's contract he could indeed be screwed here - it's very common in technology-related industries for contracts to prevent work outside of the company for commercial gain, especially work that falls in that same category. It's actually quite possible that Carmack acted in the wrong here - though I agree that perhaps Zenimax's actions here are, ahem, specious.

Don't forget he also had his rocket company. There's no way he would agree to a condition like that.

 

[Black]

Silly Carmack, one does not simply leave his jewish overlords.

 

[sea]

Don't forget he also had his rocket company. There's no way he would agree to a condition like that.

Maybe it wasn't covered because it wasn't gaming-related. Sometimes the clause is only non-competitive and I doubt his rocketeering venture could be considered a competitor to Zenimax.

 

[deuxhero]

Two of the worst companies duking it out. Whoever loses, we win.

 

[FeelTheRads]

Whoever wins, we lose.

Fixed.

 

[Spectacle]

Oculus is going to be DOA, why bother?

Preserving this quote for the future, once the Rift takes off I'll put it in my .sig

 

[evdk]

Oculus is going to be DOA, why bother?

Preserving this quote for the future, once the Rift takes off I'll put it in my .sig

If you want to embarrass Metro, you can just randomly quote mine his "Build me a PC" thread. In any case, I hope he is right.