CYOA - Problems and rarity

[Karwelas]

Hello, Codex CYOA community members.

I create this thread to discuss about problems and hopes of your subforum. Like everyone reading this thread probably know we are pretty big but closed community - not by our own fault, but rather that CYOAs on our forum are pretty unique in whole meaning of 'playing' in this... Uh... Genre? Well, our CYOAs are complex, mosty, there are variety of themes and many other things that make us one of few communities scattered all around internet forums. There are some sites like 4chan or Bay12, but they are, to be honest - nowhere near some levels of works. They prefer rather some simple (but not worse!) text adventures or multiple player characters sessions.

For me, there are teo main problems - almost no new blood among us and no communication between other communities. Sometimes people appear, but they either vote two times or make small CYOA only to abandon it. It is also hard to find these communities - there aren't many of those out there.

What do you think?

 

[Nevill]

I think this could be partially solved by visiting those other communities and participating in their CYOAs if we find something decent. When communities become aware of each other, some kind of diffusion will naturally happen.

I made a thread about this half a year ago. I had this idea to list some good CYOAs on other forums for people to read. They might become invested enough to check other ongoing works and let us know if they stumble upon something exceptionally good.

I found a few directions and a pair of good CYOAs, but then I was left to dig on my own. After finding too many duds, I just kind of stopped looking.

It is also a problem (for me) that Codex quickly becomes one of the very few forums I visit. I don't know what exactly makes me avoid other places, but an excess of political correctness is high on the list of suspects.

So my proposal would be to create a dedicated thread for non-Codexian CYOAs and maybe trying to maintain a list of ongoing ones. Get people interested in other communities. Once we are more active there, it is only a matter of time before people come over to check out our stuff.

Not sure how many of us would be interested in that, though.

 

[lightbane]

Well, IMO the problem of these community CYOAs is that they're a real niche: they require a lot of hard work from the writer, along with constant interest and dedication from both the creator and the viewers/participants in order to survive, which explains why they're somewhat rare. There is also stuff like the threat of RL stuff impeding or halting the advance of these games at some point, along with the tyranny of the majority, which means that there will be always someone disappointed that their chosen option didn't win out at the end, a fact which may en up with some participants losing interest in these kind of threads.

There's also the issue that our community has a kind of a "special" reputation, which could be the cause why there's little communication with other websites. Nevertheless, I understand your point of view, Karwelas. I believe you can find webpages with the content you wish if you look hard enough. For example: Giant in the Playground should have CYOAs for sure. The Gaming Den has some as well IIRC, but that one is filled to the brim with permanently butthurt posters who in comparison make the average Codexer seem normal.

 

[Karwelas]

Nevill lightbane I have an idea to create little CYOA on Spacebattles forums as community there is huuuge as fuck. There are some good players and storytellers around.

It is connected to my project on Dex and would be something I call "mini adventure", kind of background project on less strict rules and more closed story, like last hospital adventure from treave. Those mini adventure(s?) would have impact on some elements of Known World setting, but nothing touching main plots or world as whole thing. Yet, I still think if it is good idea. I don't want to scare shit out of them with my style and grammar. If it will... well... work maybe they would be interested with other our CYOAs.

 

[Nevill]

In the meantime, I'll be repurposing my old thread and actually linking to the interesting CYOAs on other forums.

Might be a bit of a slow process, but hey. One man can only read so much.

 

[Cheesecake]

The reason I found the Codex was 'cause of Gobblecock PMing me on Bay12 that there was a Lordship game on this site (I missed the original Lordship back in Bay12 ). Before I found Codex, I thought Bay12 and 4chan were the only places who did things like these, but fortunately I was wrong.

I agree though that we should expand and contact other communities, getting involved in there stuff and hope they get involved in stuff here.

 

[wjw]

Codexia. First of the underground domes. The one that survived the blast of decline. The one that still stands proud. It's entryway hidden under thick layers of dust and political incorrectness. Old commander Karwelas moves to the communication transmitter after this morning's funeral. "Codexians! This is your commander speaking. As we all know, today the population counter has gone to a two digit number. Our last decree, the allowance of incest and inbreed has not aided the population crisis. That's why I command every firstborn to pick up his or her stuff and leave this shelter, leave through the gates of Lead, and come back after making contact with sentient humans, interested in our way of CYOA".

You are:
1. The newborn, the last kid in Codexia. You are young, that's your main advantage. However your gene pool is not very diversified.
2. A middle-aged guy. Great voice acting skills.
3. The one who lives underneath the dome on a secret level, unbeknownst to the other dwellers. For years now, you are working on a prototype golden super-baby.

What do you do:
A. You listen to old Karlewas and move towards the RPGwatch, a closeby village created after the uprising 17 years ago.
B. You use the last fuel in the dome to build a ship and fly towards Spacebattles', the flickering lights in between the stars.
C. You reboot the sonor-scanner. It's damn slow, but something new might start blinking.
D. You speed up the creation of your pet project. You are confident that fixing those last pesky bugs, will solve all existing incest problems.

 

[Breakfast 4 Dinner]

It is also a problem (for me) that Codex quickly becomes one of the very few forums I visit. I don't know what exactly makes me avoid other places, but an excess of political correctness is high on the list of suspects.

Not sure if posting here is okay since I'm new, but since the rules didn't say "new members post HERE", I'm thinking I'm okay. In any case, I only recently got into CYOAs/SGs, and the first forum I signed up for had a surplus of PC on it. Not to mention, a hard lean on one spectrum of thinking versus another. I don't think this permeates as many sites as it seems, but I can see why you'd avoid 99% of them and make Codex your mainstay. The reason why I signed up for Codex was because of Treave's Legend CYOA. Since I'm a big fan of wuxia, martial arts and eastern fantasy in general, I figured I'd make an account and read, while also learning from people who write leagues better than I do. All in all, Codex seems pretty chill, which is a good sign.

There is also stuff like the threat of RL stuff impeding or halting the advance of these games at some point, along with the tyranny of the majority, which means that there will be always someone disappointed that their chosen option didn't win out at the end, a fact which may en up with some participants losing interest in these kind of threads.

In my experience, it's not so much the tyrannical majority as it is certain SG addicts flooding the next move with their opinions, and new members being ignored. It's pretty disheartening to not even be acknowledged in a game you're trying to be part of. I've seen this on other forums with a SGs in their fabric. The writer/GM, in my opinion, should do his best to include the little guys and prevent the veteran/regular circlejerk from drowning out other interesting options. I intend to do that with my SG.

There's also the issue that our community has a kind of a "special" reputation, which could be the cause why there's little communication with other websites. Nevertheless, I understand your point of view, Karwelas. I believe you can find webpages with the content you wish if you look hard enough. For example: Giant in the Playground should have CYOAs for sure. The Gaming Den has some as well IIRC, but that one is filled to the brim with permanently butthurt posters who in comparison make the average Codexer seem normal.

I haven't heard any "special" information regarding Codex. I haven't seen anything yet in the time I've been lurking OR have joined as a legitimate member. Gaming Den? Are we talking about the same Gaming Den? I have yet to have any problems with the members there, which is quite rare for me on forums these days.

All in all, a lot of good perspectives were brought to this thread. Like I said, I joined because of the Legend wuxia CYOA and because this site seems more chilled than the one where I first got into this kind of game. I'm actually thinking of trying an SG based on a verse I made as a child. I think I'll make a light interest check thread or something before I go full-blown SG thread though.

Sidebar: I really can't wait to get enough posts to make my own avatar.

 

[Nevill]

Welcome to the Codex, Breakfast 4 Dinner!

In any case, I only recently got into CYOAs/SGs, and the first forum I signed up for had a surplus of PC on it. Not to mention, a hard lean on one spectrum of thinking versus another. I don't think this permeates as many sites as it seems

I am mainly frequenting Sufficient Velocity now, and I have to say, the place if full of it. Yesterday they cracked down on 'creepiness culture' on their forums (with an admin notice to every user, no less), and while there were some legitimate concerns raised, a lot of it amounted to witch-hunts on 'problematic' content. Then again, their admin and server are in Canada, and they have to comply with Canadian laws on this issues, which are only a step behind Sweden.

Made me really appreciate the Codex more.

What does SG stand for? Story-Game?

In my experience, it's not so much the tyrannical majority as it is certain SG addicts flooding the next move with their opinions, and new members being ignored. It's pretty disheartening to not even be acknowledged in a game you're trying to be part of. I've seen this on other forums with a SGs in their fabric

Guilty as charged.

You'll probably find it here as well. Sometimes I get too invested in a certain development, especially if it's something I wanted to pursue since early game, to give other options a fair shake.

 

[lightbane]

I haven't heard any "special" information regarding Codex. I haven't seen anything yet in the time I've been lurking OR have joined as a legitimate member. Gaming Den? Are we talking about the same Gaming Den? I have yet to have any problems with the members there, which is quite rare for me on forums these days.

Well, I was referring to the kind of shit you can find in General Discussion and the politics subforum. It's full of crazy (and drama) here. Also, IIRC some Bioware devs who used to post here used the RPGCodex as a "bad example" of sorts whenever they could. And some Codexers have a bad reputation for their close-minded opinions. Lastly, perhaps I was exagerating a bit about the Gaming Den, but I remember reading some of their reviews threads and the users here seemed to be extremely vitriolic, especially one who supposedly is some kind of doctor IRL, whose hatred for White Wolf and Apocalypse-related products has no bounds.

Sidebar: I really can't wait to get enough posts to make my own avatar.

Unfortunately I do not believe that's not possible, at least not yet. They're still working on that, allegedly.

 

[hello friend]

I'm actually thinking of trying an SG based on a verse I made as a child. I think I'll make a light interest check thread or something before I go full-blown SG thread though.

Just go ahead, man. Either people like it and follow it, or you get some writing practice. Plenty of shit threads around here. I mean, you'd be amazed.

 

[Breakfast 4 Dinner]

Got a lot of replies, so I'll just use @ symbols now.

Nevill: It seems that you lot don't let SJW dogma affect the overall content or enjoyment of your community, which is nice. I mean, with thousands of forums, it's as simple as not viewing/visiting the few that don't sit well with you. I can understand when people use "inflammatory" content with the pure intent to incite negativity and drama (trolling), but someone who's using less-than-socially-acceptable elements in a game for the sake of story should be allowed to flex their creative muscle to bring content that we can all enjoy. Personally, I might get a bit crazy myself, but I don't do it for drama. I do it because I create a lot, and want to interact with my creations in a fluid way. Basically, if you guys focus on fun over feuding, I'd say I'd grow to enjoy what the Codex has to offer. SG stands for "Suggestion Game". Basically, another way of saying CYOA, with less letters that are easier to type quickly.

Be careful of that circlejerk! I'm making sure that everyone gets some kind of attention in the CYOA I'm running off-site. It doesn't have too much interest, but I just got done with the first update, so hopefully it catches on quickly!

lightbane: Oh, I don't venture out into politics. That's a recipe for Pretty Little Liars Syndrome. I have enough of that on another site where teenagers think they can comprehend real world issues like Israel-Palestine, or communism, or nationalism/imperialism and such. To the point where they put their 'views' in their signatures. Again, I'm not too familiar with the Codex despite my lurking, so I'm hoping that what you've experienced doesn't come my way. And no custom avatars at all, or just for new members?

hello friend: Really? The ones I've seen are on a higher tier than my own writing, so if your worst SGs are better than my best, that's plenty to worry about. I'm still going to give it a go, of course, and I do appreciate the encouragement.

 

[Baltika9]

Not sure if posting here is okay since I'm new,

No one really gives a shit here, which is the best part about the Dex. Looking forward to your LP, bro. Welcome aboard.

 

[Breakfast 4 Dinner]

Suggestion Game. A far better type of interaction between the GM and the players, but not something that Codex does well. I'd be willing to give Breakfast an active participant if he gets an interesting SG off the ground. I largely failed in my attempt and wound up pimping a misnamed CYOA.

Some other gaming forums do talk a lot of shit about the Codex, not because there's any truth to the accusations, mind you, but rather because those people are being paid to astroturf and spread malicious lies against us by their masters, the various Jews and niggers that comprise the Zionist elites.

I was under the impression that SG and CYOA were the same. I'm not seeing the difference. In any case, I appreciate having you interested in my SG when I get it up. I was considering bringing the Breakfast Wars here, but I'm not sure if it'll gain traction.

No one really gives a shit here, which is the best part about the Dex. Looking forward to your LP, bro. Welcome aboard.

It's always a good sign when a community doesn't take itself too seriously. Thank you.

 

[Cheesecake]

Breakfast Wars? You run that on Bay12 don't you, Breakfast 4 Dinner?

 

[Baltika9]

Breakfast Wars

Breakfast Wars?

With a name like that, Imma need some links.

 

[Cheesecake]

Breakfast Wars on Bay12

 

[treave]

I was under the impression that SG and CYOA were the same. I'm not seeing the difference.

SGs are respectful of the interplay between writer and reader and take into account as many suggestions as feasible to construct, collaboratively, a good game.

On the other hand, CYOAs are run by dictatorial author fiat and involve infinite butthurt produced by a cycle of constant antagonistic strife over the limitations of choices between writer and reader.

 

[Baltika9]

As treave points out somewhat tongue-in-cheek but mostly fair enough, the feel between the two game styles is very different, and SGs are simpy more fun for everyone involved, more interactive, and less work for the author because he isn't the one that has to anticipate and think up one billion interesting options for his readers.

On the other hand, if your audience is of a more Codexian stock, you get stuck with some crazy plans and you're all like, 'fuck, what do they do in response to that?' There are benefits and drawbacks to both approaches. CYOAs are much more structured for both parties and allow for more forward planning on the GM's part, as they can make fairly detailed forward plans, since they have a good idea as to where the branching paths will lead. On the other hand, we have yet to play as a pigeon, asshole.

 

[Nevill]

On the other hand, we have yet to play as a pigeon, asshole.

You are in luck, for they have made a game just for you.

Spoiler

I think we even had an LP of it here somewhere.

 

[Baltika9]

If I wanted a dating sim, I'd play that. I was looking forward more towards a CYOA that lets me pick whose head I get to poop on.

 

[Cheesecake]

Where would an SG go on the Codex? Are they similar enough to CYOAs to be in the same subforum or should it be taken to the Codex Playground?

 

[Nevill]

CYOA section. Some of them are already hybrids anyway, since authors often accept freeform choices which are suggestions by another name.

 

[hello friend]

hello friend: Really? The ones I've seen are on a higher tier than my own writing, so if your worst SGs are better than my best, that's plenty to worry about. I'm still going to give it a go, of course, and I do appreciate the encouragement.

Well, a lot of the CYOAs here are pretty good, I'm talking more in general. The Codex is a place of extremely variable standards. And there's only one way to git gud, after all.

 

[Breakfast 4 Dinner]

I was using both nomenclatures interchangeably. I apologise. So, CYOA is structured, choose from a list of options. Suggestion Game is more freeform, and has write-in votes to move the game along. Got it. You won't be seeing me mix 'em up again, though I suppose it comes down to personal taste, as I've seen plenty of SGs with elements of CYOA. You get a list from the author, OR you can write-in.

To the people asking: Yes. I run Breakfast Wars on Bay12, and I should probably get to posting the next update now that I have free time!