Demise: Ascension - is anyone else here playing it?

[mondblut]

Oh yeah, the "expansion, from what I recall you'll HAVE to spend ALOT of time just getting to it, as AFAIK it starts at the old last level + 1, which was INSANELY hard to get to...

Nope, you're speaking of Revelations which was +1 level stacked at the bottom. Ascension has quadrupled all levels to the north and east of the original square to 90x90.

Having said that, I find the new areas pretty horribad as far as levels 1-5 are concerned. Something an amateur modder would throw together in a matter of hours. At least one occasion of ripping an entire portion out of the original dungeon and copypasting it into a new area (the library).

 

[Overboard]

Yeah the new areas are shit, it's not as if there isn't enough grinding/frustrating shit to encounter in the game without having to jump through hoops to get to new sekrit areas.

 

[Zeriel]

What's the consensus on Ascension, then? Worth it over the original? I'm... kind of in a weird situation. I have the original on my hard-drive, but it won't work on W7 due to pixel format invalid errors. I'm not even that confident the new version will fix that, considering all the horror stories I've heard from people not able to get support for the game if it doesn't work.

 

[Yeesh]

Oh yeah, the "expansion, from what I recall you'll HAVE to spend ALOT of time just getting to it, as AFAIK it starts at the old last level + 1, which was INSANELY hard to get to...

Nope, you're speaking of Revelations which was +1 level stacked at the bottom. Ascension has quadrupled all levels to the north and east of the original square to 90x90.

Having said that, I find the new areas pretty horribad as far as levels 1-5 are concerned. Something an amateur modder would throw together in a matter of hours. At least one occasion of ripping an entire portion out of the original dungeon and copypasting it into a new area (the library).

Hmmm, I'd had the same impression as CJ. I'm glad to sort of hear things are better than that, but on the other hand I can't imagine wanting levels 1-5 to be any bigger anyway since you get the XP you need out of them pretty fine in the original game.

I played a lot of Demise, but not enough to get down to the basement. I found it to start being a real slog when I had some classes over 100 and was at the 2.5 XP penalty in some cases - it felt like the stuff I could handle down on level (IDK, 15? 17?) wasn't actually giving me enough XP to pin, while the lower levels needed more firepower than I had available. I found the Tea Room and had a teleport macro and whatnot, but it still felt like I was taking way too much time for too little feeling of progression. So I'd be interesting in hearing whether Ascension might make those middle levels less tedious.

And also whether they fixed that fucking bug where casting spells from the front row meant you couldn't affect more than 2 groups of monsters or somthing like that. Oh and I also really wished you could get your active character's swings sped up the way they are for the non-active characters. Stuff like that might seem minor, but there's a massive amount of repetition in the game and once you have 5 or 6 swings X 200+ rooms per run, well fucking christ.

All in all, Demise felt really fun in the beginning, and for me it kept being fun for a really long time. But it's true that much of that fun comes from exploration (which you can only do so much of with a fixed map) and progression (which seemed to dry up after a while). Still, I got A LOT of hours of enjoyment out of the whole thing. I do wonder if Ascension has what it takes to recapture the fun.

 

[Stabwound]

Try as I might, I get burned out on this game so quickly. I don't think there's been another game I wanted to like more than Demise other than maybe Diablo 3. Everything about it is so mechanical and grindy.

 

[Dorateen]

I used to wonder why Demise: Ascension does not get more recognition around here. I first read about this game in an Ascension specific thread some time ago. I picked it up back in May 2011, and played for about a year. I have gotten deep, but still not finished yet. Plan to get back to the dungeon again.

I was struck by how massive this game is, and how intricate. Sometimes that translates into features that frustrate and discourage gamers, but all those little quirks seem to have an endearing old-school charm to me.

Back in 2000, I had other cRPGs to play, so I completely missed the original Demise and Mordor before that. So the Ascension expansion in all its 90 x 90 grid glory was a breath of fresh air. I love how punishing the combat is. Adventuring with a 4 person party was a blast, and managing a roster of additional characters for separate quests was the first time I did something like that since Might & Magic II.

There is a lot of depth here, that just is not found in RPGs anymore. And the fact that it is an independent studio makes it all the more special. I even put it in the Top 50 list.

Anyone who is looking for a very old school dungeon romp that is a cross between the ancient Wizardries and Might & Magics, ought to try this out right away.

 

[Yeesh]

Try as I might, I get burned out on this game so quickly. I don't think there's been another game I wanted to like more than Demise other than maybe Diablo 3. Everything about it is so mechanical and grindy.

I used to wonder why Demise: Ascension does not get more recognition around here. [...]
There is a lot of depth here, that just is not found in RPGs anymore. And the fact that it is an independent studio makes it all the more special. I even put it in the Top 50 list.

Anyone who is looking for a very old school dungeon romp that is a cross between the ancient Wizardries and Might & Magics, ought to try this out right away.

I'm a fan of this sort of gameplay myself, but I can't disagree with Stabwound's characterization. Even taking into account the exploration aspect and the (very) occasional quest and story text, Demise is at least 95% pure grind. Like it could be in the Textbook of Grind. And the combat is pretty simplistic as well. I know that focusing on those shortcomings is pretty much missing the point of the game, but I can see how Demise doesn't jibe too well with the codex's sensibilities. Even for a semi-roguelike.

EDIT: But I totally agree that anyone looking for this sort of action should try it out right away. The race/class system is a real delight for min/maxin'.

 

[Dorateen]

This is true, there is a lot of grinding in this game. Given the nature of how this dungeon delve is constructed, however, I think it works. I received much satisfaction from the constant struggle against increasingly powerful enemies, only then to come back levels later and slice through them with ease. That brings me to a point I wanted to make about combat itself, which as you stated, is featured prominently.

I don't like real time, and so I thought the way combat in Demise: Ascenision plays out would not be appealing. Then I discovered there is a "shift-P" pause function. This allows the player to assign different characters actions to different enemy groups (in mob encounters) and then plays out more like phased combat. There was a greater need for tactics, especially in the deeper levels, than one might first surmise.

I should mention again, the experience I have had is with the Ascension expansion, which might have made gameplay improvements over original Demise, and I could be taking for granted.

The way I would characterize the gameplay is that there is a lot going on underneath the surface. I found the Lord Gherrick quest line interesting enough, and enjoyable. There is a level of complexity here in mechanics, if one is persistent enough to appreciate it. And the dungeon design was unmatched, with the varying locations and changes of scenery, and confronting obstacles to further exploration. Legend of Grimrock was received well on the Codex. To me, Ascension is like Grimrock on steroids and a magnitude greater in terms of being hard-core.

 

[Zeriel]

The joy in the game definitely comes from all the unique features like multiple parties, recovering dead bodies, the meta-knowledge of where special quest items are in the dungeon, just the fact that everything _is_ hand-made, et cetera. I shudder to imagine how amazing this game could be with good writing, though, or more quests to give it more of a directed feel. Or... well... I know some people might file this under "working as intended", or "love it", but Demise is the first game I've played where some sort of EZ-mode teleport system wouldn't be out of place.

I know, I know, you can do X-Y-Z coordinate teleports, and there are specific location teleporters in the dungeon (which often separate the party, but that's another complaint), but once you're doing multiple trips to the 10-19 levels of the dungeon just to get enough XP for one level, it starts to get really old and clunky. Oh, Bioware, stone of recall wasn't a bad idea, it was just in the wrong damn game. Still, fucking gem of a game despite all its flaws.

 

[Xi]

.... but once you're doing multiple trips to the 10-19 levels of the dungeon just to get enough XP for one level, it starts to get really old and clunky.

This is the games most glaring flaw. The pinning mechanic forces the player to leave the dungeon every 2 levels. So, you will effectively have left the dungeon 500 times by level 1000. That's a lot of back tracking. It makes no sense in a game like this. It gets in the way of the amount of levels the game offers in all of the different guilds.

I don't want to spend 50 hours back tracking through a lifeless dungeon (because I already killed everything). /sigh

 

[Zeriel]

.... but once you're doing multiple trips to the 10-19 levels of the dungeon just to get enough XP for one level, it starts to get really old and clunky.

This is the games most glaring flaw. The pinning mechanic forces the player to leave the dungeon every 2 levels. So, you will effectively have left the dungeon 500 times by level 1000. That's a lot of back tracking. It makes no sense in a game like this. It gets in the way of the amount of levels the game offers in all of the different guilds.

I don't want to spend 50 hours back tracking through a lifeless dungeon (because I already killed everything). /sigh

I'm not even convinced backtracking is necessarily bad, it just needs a better way of getting quickly from one level to the next. Checkpoints/town portals are popamole as fuck, but this is one of those games they seem justified in.

 

[Stabwound]

The pinning mechanic should just be removed altogether. It's the most pointlessly annoying thing I've ever come across in a game. There is literally no reason for it other than to annoy the player. It should let you accumulate XP limitlessly but not let you level until you return to town.

 

[Mraston]

I'm giving some serious thought to getting this game but the 32 bucks is holding me back. Can any one one say something that will push me over the edge to buying it?

 

[Renevent]

I got the game about a year ago in the gamersgate indie fort deal...never was able to play it though. Would crash on launch with some weird error message...I remember searching the error and found some links saying to manually register DLL's but didn't seem to help.

 

[Overboard]

Don't waste your money, 32 is ridiculous. I got this as part of a Gamersgate bundle, and while it's fine to waste some time on you do not want to be spending more than 5 dorrar on it.

 

[Zeriel]

I got the game about a year ago in the gamersgate indie fort deal...never was able to play it though. Would crash on launch with some weird error message...I remember searching the error and found some links saying to manually register DLL's but didn't seem to help.

If it was the invalid pixel format error, I was able to fix this by running it with the following compatibility options:

Disable Visual Themes
Disable Desktop Composition
Disable Display Scaling (this probably does nothing)
Run This Program as Administrator

Do note there is a is-it-crashing long pause whenever the dungeon loads for the first time in a play session. After that everything runs super fast.

If you are on XP, I have no clue.

 

[Renevent]

Sounds sorta like the error message, but it's been a while. Thanks though, I will definitely try that!

 

[carl]

hey
I havent played ascension is a long time and i have tried to get back into but am unable to because of the fact that my (pre realse version as expired)
I was wondering how i get the update for it and still get to keep all of my characters, the main problem is i dont have the ID that created it anymore because my dad set it up and he isnt around any more, i really need some help please?

 

[Stabwound]

I think you might be out of luck, unfortunately.

Do you have any proof that you have a legit copy of the game? Or know the email used originally? If so you might be able to email support@decklinsdemise.com and get some help. Otherwise, I have no idea.

 

[garfield666]

hey
I havent played ascension is a long time and i have tried to get back into but am unable to because of the fact that my (pre realse version as expired)
I was wondering how i get the update for it and still get to keep all of my characters, the main problem is i dont have the ID that created it anymore because my dad set it up and he isnt around any more, i really need some help please?

you need to download the new version, and to do that you must be able to login to your account on decklin's demise. you can find your chars in C:\Program Files\Decklin's Domain\ASCENSION\System\Ascension\AUTOBACKUP or\BACKUP folders assuming default installation path

regarding demise itself, i personally find mordor far better. addition of graphics to demise was nice visually (in 2001), but destroyed fluidity of mordor's gameplay for me - in demise you have animations and you must wait for them to finish, in mordor everything is instant so you navigate the dungeon much faster.

 

[Severian Silk]

Is this game a blobber, or what?

 

[Dorateen]

First person perspective dungeon crawl. It can be soloed, but also played with a party of 4, plus summoned companions. Combat happens in real time, but a shift-p function allows the ability to pause and select targets or change tactics. Played this way, it is kind of like a player initiated phased system. (Issue orders, and then unpause to watch the battle unfold.)

And you can fly.

 

[zwanzig_zwoelf]

Map reminds me of Mordor: Depths of Dejenol. The sequel to Mordor was actually called 'Demise: Rise of the Ku'tan'. Any idea if those games are related?

EDIT: Oh wait, they are...
Jeg vil gå tjekke det.

 

[Stabwound]

Yeah, they're related. Demise is a sequel, afterall...

Great idea, terrible mechanics. That's all there is to say about this game. The character system is meant for people to sperg in, and you won't be successful otherwise. Not to mention that the combat is complete shit, if you can even call it a combat system. And the pinning, fuck.

I wouldn't recommend this game to anyone that isn't a huge turn-based blobber fan and LOVES to sperg the fuck out on characters. I mean like, spreadsheet-level planning up to the hundreds and hundreds of levels your guys can reach, not to mention the races and classes. Spergfest2000.

 

[Zeriel]

Like, duh?

It's a 31-level dungeoncrawler. Shit's right on the package. If you aren't into this stuff, why would you play it?

I loved the shit out of this back in the day, though. It also gains a lot of depth and dynamism in multiplayer, on persistent servers where the town log records the first people to kill X monster, get to Y level, and complete Z quest. Not to mention the store/monster jail have to be filled up with stuff from the dungeon, which in multiplayer is a communal effort.

It's definitely from another era, though, have to keep in mind that a lot of the core development on this game was done back in the 1999-2002 time period.