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For what do people play Diablo (and such games)?
- Thread starter StaticSpine
- Start date
Diablo had a nice dark atmosphere and the playing area wasn't big enough to feel like mindless grinding. Sacred was like doing manual labor from 9 to 5. What saved Lionheart for me was playing it with a friend so multiplayer does make some games more interesting although I never got into d2 multiplayer. Building up the character is nice but there has to be some point to the grinding and unlimited mob spawns are a turnoff.
I got really hooked up on Diablo, and then Diablo 2. But way more with Diablo. It was all about exploring "just one more floor", cleaning them entirely, spamming lightning nova, getting the loot, improving my gear by that 0.01 DPS. Not sure if then I grew out of it, or what. I enjoyed Diablo 2 a lot, but not as much: the open areas were a bit meh to me, I preferred the very dark dungeons from D1. I finished Diablo 3 on 2/3 classes, found it banalshitboring (I liked Torchlight 2 more, for one), not that entertaining nor that engrossing. The feeling of being a war machine of destruction I had with Diablo 1 (and 2, to a certain extent) was gone.
I must admit, hack&slash games don't quite cut it for me, these days, I just don't find them entertaining any more, after 15 minutes of "novelty effect".
I must admit, hack&slash games don't quite cut it for me, these days, I just don't find them entertaining any more, after 15 minutes of "novelty effect".
Diablo was a groundbreaking, fantastic experience at the time.
The dungeon music, the slowly revealed dark areas, the shrieks, the sounds, the epic items you could find...
It was amazing, and gamers were blown away.
We were.
Diablo II lost much of that atmosphere (almost all of it).
And I agree that the respawning areas killed its soul, turning the game into something players felt GUILTY about playing (which is an interesting psychological phenomenon since, at the end of the day, every game has you "wasting" time by clicking and typing stuff in front of a monitor anyway).
Gems and set items were a cool addition, but there was NO way in hell to acquire a full set in single player, not unless you were ready to grind for EONS. Which you started doing, until it all felt stupid, pointless and depressing.
Still, when at their best, these games aren't even as mindless as they are commonly depicted. They can be quite difficult, and you have to give some thought to your character's progression if you want to stand a chance in the later stages.
I'm playing Torchlight 2 right now, and overall I like it.
The ease-of-use additions to the formula are a godsend, and in this game it IS POSSIBLE to complete a set of armor. I just did, in my first playthrough.
Also I've just discovered the joys of hot-keys remapping, meaning that I've become able to mix more skills more effectively, for a frantic, more satisfying experience.
So, in the end: there's fun to be found in this genre, but you have to stay lucid, play straight and true and cut it when it's time.
If they dared to remove the sick respawning mechanic (while implementing a less randomized itemization), half the problems of all these Diablo clones would be solved since - well - they'd become more like Diablo again.
P.S.:
I've not even considered the existence of Diablo 3 because, well, Always-Online requirement and, excuse me, Auction House?
What am I, a self-aware junkie?
The dungeon music, the slowly revealed dark areas, the shrieks, the sounds, the epic items you could find...
It was amazing, and gamers were blown away.
We were.
Diablo II lost much of that atmosphere (almost all of it).
And I agree that the respawning areas killed its soul, turning the game into something players felt GUILTY about playing (which is an interesting psychological phenomenon since, at the end of the day, every game has you "wasting" time by clicking and typing stuff in front of a monitor anyway).
Gems and set items were a cool addition, but there was NO way in hell to acquire a full set in single player, not unless you were ready to grind for EONS. Which you started doing, until it all felt stupid, pointless and depressing.
Still, when at their best, these games aren't even as mindless as they are commonly depicted. They can be quite difficult, and you have to give some thought to your character's progression if you want to stand a chance in the later stages.
I'm playing Torchlight 2 right now, and overall I like it.
The ease-of-use additions to the formula are a godsend, and in this game it IS POSSIBLE to complete a set of armor. I just did, in my first playthrough.
Also I've just discovered the joys of hot-keys remapping, meaning that I've become able to mix more skills more effectively, for a frantic, more satisfying experience.
So, in the end: there's fun to be found in this genre, but you have to stay lucid, play straight and true and cut it when it's time.
If they dared to remove the sick respawning mechanic (while implementing a less randomized itemization), half the problems of all these Diablo clones would be solved since - well - they'd become more like Diablo again.
P.S.:
I've not even considered the existence of Diablo 3 because, well, Always-Online requirement and, excuse me, Auction House?
What am I, a self-aware junkie?
Lilura
RPG Codex Dragon Lady
- Joined
- Feb 13, 2013
- Messages
- 5,274
Not really. Lrn2tele and do NM Meph runs. Lrn2/players8. I had multiple fullsets in SP within 3 days, without maphack, and I wasn't even farming for them. Also, only noobs MF for fullsets. A combination of Uniques, jeweled Rares and Runewords is where its at. High runes are hard to find in SP, but there are SP trading forums that disallow dupes. If you don't wanna trade, cuz of some kinda purist "It's SP!!11" nonsense, you can still build Hell-capables if you have half a brain. And in SP you have the convenience of PlugY, GoMule and Glide Wrapper.
That gaem is infantile, and doesn't have awesome mods like Eastern Sun and Median XL: Ultimative, the latter of which is probably the most monocled expression of this type of game in existence. I noticed in the D2 topic I created awhile back, noobs who haven't even played it, couldn't take screenshots to save their life, and haven't heard of Glide Wrapper complained of "retinal rape", but noobs will noob. MXL:U > All.
Last edited:
Because it's a F2P game, and unlike in D3 the economy is a central point of the gameplay so it makes sense to combat dupes and hacks.
Sir, I'm sure an answer is owed here, but I don't understand your language.
No sarcasm, I honestly don't know what you just said.
DraQ
Arcane
In other words grindgrindgrind.
To play on NM you need to have already beaten the game twice, and the very possibility of runs was a big part of why D2 sucked (MMOlite lack of persistent game state).
Having to play the game alone while balanced for 8 players to play it "right" was also fucking depressing.
This just makes set mechanics pointless. Pointless mechanics is shit.
Randomness is good, but sets should have guarantee of dropping all or most elements during single game and by single game I don't mean repeated runs because they shouldn't be there in the first place.
Also fucking catgirls and aztec swampvatican.
- Joined
- Jun 4, 2014
- Messages
- 1,901
I never played the original Diablo games when I was younger although a very good mate of mine went on about them all the time. I missed the whole concept and never understood the phrase in gaming reviews afterwards "Diablo Clone".
Doing some research now, I was probably spending a lot of my time and cash on other games like Daggerfall, Warcraft 2, The Dig and Fallout.
I read a review about Titan Quest and not understanding any of the comparions with Diablo.
Many years later I got hold of Torchlight on Steam as it was cheap, before it's popularity kicked off and played it quite a lot. That's when I then got hold of Titan Quest. Both my kid and I have spent a lot (A LOT) of time on these games.
These "Diablo" clones remind me a lot of an episode of STNG where Wesley Crusher and his girlfriend are the only ones not playing this VR game where you would move coloured balls down a little funnel and each time you did that experience some sort of orgasm or something. You have the promise of better loot, that little bar that shows how long left before you level up. Every few steps you took there would be a little reward. A few years ago I read an article about how these new casual games were making lots of money due to housewives buying them - 'find the hidden object' games, companies like Big Fish appeared.
I suppose Diablo clones are the male equivalent. Of the few I have tried, TTQ with the IT update is my favourite, I like the feel of the game, seems quite exquisitvely detailed with the research done into the different mythologies. I like the different classes. I preferred Torchlight 1 over the second one. The only other I have played for a short while is Din's Curse. I was thinking of getting hold of Diablo 3 but did not like the copy protection and constant online requirement with it.
For me, these games are easy to pick up for a short while and you can expect to progress a bit, maybe go up a level. They don't require much attention so you could watch TV at the same time. If someone is using the main household PC for studying, easy to play a Diablo clone on a laptop for a short while if you need a gaming fix.
Doing some research now, I was probably spending a lot of my time and cash on other games like Daggerfall, Warcraft 2, The Dig and Fallout.
I read a review about Titan Quest and not understanding any of the comparions with Diablo.
Many years later I got hold of Torchlight on Steam as it was cheap, before it's popularity kicked off and played it quite a lot. That's when I then got hold of Titan Quest. Both my kid and I have spent a lot (A LOT) of time on these games.
These "Diablo" clones remind me a lot of an episode of STNG where Wesley Crusher and his girlfriend are the only ones not playing this VR game where you would move coloured balls down a little funnel and each time you did that experience some sort of orgasm or something. You have the promise of better loot, that little bar that shows how long left before you level up. Every few steps you took there would be a little reward. A few years ago I read an article about how these new casual games were making lots of money due to housewives buying them - 'find the hidden object' games, companies like Big Fish appeared.
I suppose Diablo clones are the male equivalent. Of the few I have tried, TTQ with the IT update is my favourite, I like the feel of the game, seems quite exquisitvely detailed with the research done into the different mythologies. I like the different classes. I preferred Torchlight 1 over the second one. The only other I have played for a short while is Din's Curse. I was thinking of getting hold of Diablo 3 but did not like the copy protection and constant online requirement with it.
For me, these games are easy to pick up for a short while and you can expect to progress a bit, maybe go up a level. They don't require much attention so you could watch TV at the same time. If someone is using the main household PC for studying, easy to play a Diablo clone on a laptop for a short while if you need a gaming fix.
No worries.
I understand you're a dedicated player, but I'm not into that kind of thing (and that includes the lingo) precisely because I don't see the point in re-doing areas multiple times and so on.
Also I'm not into MMOs, I'm a strictly single player kind of guy.
Lord Azlan: you owe it to yourself to try the original Diablo. Ironically, as much as it has been cloned (including the sequels in this) no game has reproduced its feel, only similar mechanics.
epeli
Arcane
- Joined
- Aug 17, 2014
- Messages
- 719
The addictive grinding and well-designed gameplay mechanics (simple enough to get noobs started, complex enough to keep pros interested) are important part, but the real answer is multiplayer.
I honestly can't imagine anyone dedicating much time to these sort of games playing solo, but they're fun to play with friends. And then there's the entire PVP aspect if that's your thing.
Diablo had excellent atmosphere which made it a passable singleplayer game, but Diablo 2 found its true strengths and spawned an entire genre of games, diabloclones.
I honestly can't imagine anyone dedicating much time to these sort of games playing solo, but they're fun to play with friends. And then there's the entire PVP aspect if that's your thing.
Diablo had excellent atmosphere which made it a passable singleplayer game, but Diablo 2 found its true strengths and spawned an entire genre of games, diabloclones.
you know what time it is
Arcane
Because killing shit is fun.
Owlish
Dumbfuck!
- Joined
- Sep 14, 2013
- Messages
- 2,817
It is not fun. It's addictive. I believe there is a distinction.
J1M
Arcane
- Joined
- May 14, 2008
- Messages
- 14,626
The notion that these games are exciting or interesting because they are skinner boxes is a lie that has misguided game development for a long time.
Diablo 1 had great atmosphere. The mechanics supported the atmosphere.
Diablo 2 had great character systems. The increased control over character development reduced the horror atmosphere, but essentially created a sandbox for tinkering with character builds.
While it is true that many asian "games" are essentially slot machines that reward whoever drops the most money into them, loot drops were never the core mechanic of the Diablo series. That's why when they made it the core mechanic of Diablo 3 (at the expense of character building and atmosphere) the game felt like a tedious slog.
Diablo 1 had great atmosphere. The mechanics supported the atmosphere.
Diablo 2 had great character systems. The increased control over character development reduced the horror atmosphere, but essentially created a sandbox for tinkering with character builds.
While it is true that many asian "games" are essentially slot machines that reward whoever drops the most money into them, loot drops were never the core mechanic of the Diablo series. That's why when they made it the core mechanic of Diablo 3 (at the expense of character building and atmosphere) the game felt like a tedious slog.
Metro
Arcane
- Joined
- Aug 27, 2009
- Messages
- 27,792
If playing something like Gothic or a Gold Box game or Divinity OS is considered eating a steak then playing a Diablo-clone is akin to eating a hamburger. A quick fix for people looking for a 'progress character to earn more loot to progress character to earn more loot' cycle.
Cadmus
Arcane
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2013
- Messages
- 4,264
I don't understand most of you playing it for the loot or the multiplayer grind and sets and min maxing and skill optimization.
When I first played D1, I hated it because it was so dark, always in the dungeon, it really made me feel claustrophobic and uneasy so I stopped.
D2 opened up the world a lot, I liked seeing new armors, new enemies, new skill effects and locations. I enjoyed the atmosphere and feeling of power. I liked the cutscenes. Altogether, it was about the atmosphere for me. The grim, dark, gothic atmosphere. Of course, now that I look back, D1 had more of it, but I enjoyed D2 and played it straight, like a singleplayer game.
When I first played D1, I hated it because it was so dark, always in the dungeon, it really made me feel claustrophobic and uneasy so I stopped.
D2 opened up the world a lot, I liked seeing new armors, new enemies, new skill effects and locations. I enjoyed the atmosphere and feeling of power. I liked the cutscenes. Altogether, it was about the atmosphere for me. The grim, dark, gothic atmosphere. Of course, now that I look back, D1 had more of it, but I enjoyed D2 and played it straight, like a singleplayer game.
Why do people play Painkiller? Or Serious Sam, or Doom?
It's simply mindless fun, after whole day of programming I'd rather relax playing "lol glorified screensaver"(Dungeon Siege) than something more elaborate.
I think that some codexians are too hard on wanting everything to be the deepest things possible.
It's simply mindless fun, after whole day of programming I'd rather relax playing "lol glorified screensaver"(Dungeon Siege) than something more elaborate.
I think that some codexians are too hard on wanting everything to be the deepest things possible.
bloodlover
Arcane
- Joined
- Sep 5, 2010
- Messages
- 2,039
For me it's a combination of many things. Sure it's really fun and catchy but we all get excited when we find new loot, unique items or when we complete some set. The setting is less important than the loot and gameplay.
pippin
Guest
I agree with Sheep's post- Diablo 1 is great and fun because it's a simple game, without major pretensions. The grimdark story doesn't really feel forced at all. And I like the fact that they reduced the character roster to the fighter/mage/thief trio, because in the end everything boils down to that. Diablo 2 was fun at the beginning but in the end it becomes more like a chore, actually. I remember that I just ran through the final levels, and gave up on the game out of a weird mix of boredom and frustration, not because I was losing, but because there wasn't a real reason to finish the game. I'd prefer to play other Diablo clones like Nox.
Lhynn
Arcane
- Joined
- Aug 28, 2013
- Messages
- 9,852
Dins curse does a good job at reproducing the feel, its not quite there tho, it also introduces another factors, like a sense of urgency and a lot of tactical decisions on the fly.
It is the best diablo come ever imho.
TedNugent
Arcane
- Joined
- Dec 16, 2013
- Messages
- 6,352
Diablo 2 had an emergent metagame based around duping items and exploiting magic find/boss drop rates and waypoints to accumulate an ideal item build.
So Diablo 2 was primarily about character building - making and testing interesting builds and item combinations. I do NOT believe it was about grinding.
It also had a very active PvP scene.
By contrast, with Diablo 3, the developers outright declared that the reason anybody played Diablo 2 was because they loved loot - the only reason they played was to find more loot, they needed more loot, and if they didn't have loot to get they wouldn't play. So the resultant game was a series of experiments, some flawed, in engineering skinner boxes to see what can get the player base to continue clicking buttons. It's an extremely degrading experience in cheap entertainment, and by entertainment, I mean engineered attempts to poke out some reaction in the lizard brain.
So Diablo 2 was primarily about character building - making and testing interesting builds and item combinations. I do NOT believe it was about grinding.
It also had a very active PvP scene.
By contrast, with Diablo 3, the developers outright declared that the reason anybody played Diablo 2 was because they loved loot - the only reason they played was to find more loot, they needed more loot, and if they didn't have loot to get they wouldn't play. So the resultant game was a series of experiments, some flawed, in engineering skinner boxes to see what can get the player base to continue clicking buttons. It's an extremely degrading experience in cheap entertainment, and by entertainment, I mean engineered attempts to poke out some reaction in the lizard brain.
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