Section8
Cipher
I view the idea of food/repairs/etc in games as a simple form of resource management. If you look at it on face value only, of course it seems dull and pointless.
I've seen arguments about Fallout's time limit that this is beginning to remind me of. The whole point of that time limit is to propel the player forward, keep them progressing through a storyline that isn't spoonfed and is even integrated into the character system to some extent. I mean, why tag first aid when you can just rest for a few days? (until healed) I'd argue that Fallout's time limit is generous enough even at the original 150 days, and if you're pushing for time, then maybe you've been playing the game in a counterproductive manner (not to be confused with "You're doing it all wrong!" :twisted: )
Likewise, in most games, starvation or item destruction isn't intended to be a major concern, its just a means to another end.
Contending with hunger is fairly trivial in Dungeon Master for instance. For the most part, there plenty of food sources, some of which are renewable. But it does add a couple of things to the game, no matter how trivial and unchallenging it may seem. Like Fallout's time limit it helps to set a pace. If you're busting out your entire mana supply every time you see a monster, and then sleeping it off, or even just sleeping in preference to using priest spells, then you're going to starve. It's a little prodding in the general direction of making game progress, and also a subtle limiting factor. It also leads you to make inventory decisions. What's important to you? Moreover, it's a "grey area" decision that is infinitely more interesting than the binary decisions you see in many games these days.
When considering repair, I can't remember ever using it as a primary skill in anything (although I have tagged it in my most recent game of Fallout) because it never seems to measure up or balance out. In most systems it needs some serious dressing up to be even remotely appealing. The Morrowind approach I actually found pretty good. From memory you couldn't critically fail, and thus never damaged your gear with shoddy repairs, which is something that shits me endlessly in implementations. The idea that you have to magically improve your repair skill at level up time to a high enough level that you can actually use it in the field is just plain irritating.
But back to Morrowind, where the solution was to either find someone with one of the machines that goes "ping!" or to carry around a lot of repair gear (once again, creating inventory based dilemnas) if you had a low repair skill.
And while I'm on the topic of Morrowind, it seems right to address the point of "How bloody irritating is it to trudge all the way back to merchants?!" which is especially relevant given Morrowind's travel system. I ended up training my Mysticism right up just so I could mark and recall at will.
This is when the argument against the little micro stuff like food and repairs actually bears some weight, because it has ceased to be a useful background resource management thingy, and is now actively frustrating the player, and slowing their progress. I'd maintain that this is generally due to poor implementation or questionable player choices, both of which are encompassed by ore golems, where the player makes a poor choice in using a bladed weapon because they haven't been given adequate foreshadowing info.
Ideally, these sorts of things should be implemented in such a way that the never cause major drama or downtime for a player, if they are adequately managed. "Adequate management" should be nothing more than what the player has to do to turn a profit when unloading ph4t loot, and it makes for a slightly more interesting economy than constant profit for the player, with few ways to contribute money back into the merchants' purses (ie Fallout or Morrowind, where money is tracked fairly explicitly)
On the whole, I feel that it can add a lot to a game. It can provide the basest of motivations, keeping the player and/or the plotline moving, it gives the player a sense that their profit has some use, somewhere along the line if quests are a bit thin at any point in the game, it provides an extra bit of decision making (the essence of expressing RP "How would my character approach this problem?") and in the right circumstances provides a platform for more in depth RP. (Like a mate of mine's 300lb wizard who spent most of his loot money on rations, and insisted on tasting everything the party ever killed.)
I've seen arguments about Fallout's time limit that this is beginning to remind me of. The whole point of that time limit is to propel the player forward, keep them progressing through a storyline that isn't spoonfed and is even integrated into the character system to some extent. I mean, why tag first aid when you can just rest for a few days? (until healed) I'd argue that Fallout's time limit is generous enough even at the original 150 days, and if you're pushing for time, then maybe you've been playing the game in a counterproductive manner (not to be confused with "You're doing it all wrong!" :twisted: )
Likewise, in most games, starvation or item destruction isn't intended to be a major concern, its just a means to another end.
Contending with hunger is fairly trivial in Dungeon Master for instance. For the most part, there plenty of food sources, some of which are renewable. But it does add a couple of things to the game, no matter how trivial and unchallenging it may seem. Like Fallout's time limit it helps to set a pace. If you're busting out your entire mana supply every time you see a monster, and then sleeping it off, or even just sleeping in preference to using priest spells, then you're going to starve. It's a little prodding in the general direction of making game progress, and also a subtle limiting factor. It also leads you to make inventory decisions. What's important to you? Moreover, it's a "grey area" decision that is infinitely more interesting than the binary decisions you see in many games these days.
When considering repair, I can't remember ever using it as a primary skill in anything (although I have tagged it in my most recent game of Fallout) because it never seems to measure up or balance out. In most systems it needs some serious dressing up to be even remotely appealing. The Morrowind approach I actually found pretty good. From memory you couldn't critically fail, and thus never damaged your gear with shoddy repairs, which is something that shits me endlessly in implementations. The idea that you have to magically improve your repair skill at level up time to a high enough level that you can actually use it in the field is just plain irritating.
But back to Morrowind, where the solution was to either find someone with one of the machines that goes "ping!" or to carry around a lot of repair gear (once again, creating inventory based dilemnas) if you had a low repair skill.
And while I'm on the topic of Morrowind, it seems right to address the point of "How bloody irritating is it to trudge all the way back to merchants?!" which is especially relevant given Morrowind's travel system. I ended up training my Mysticism right up just so I could mark and recall at will.
This is when the argument against the little micro stuff like food and repairs actually bears some weight, because it has ceased to be a useful background resource management thingy, and is now actively frustrating the player, and slowing their progress. I'd maintain that this is generally due to poor implementation or questionable player choices, both of which are encompassed by ore golems, where the player makes a poor choice in using a bladed weapon because they haven't been given adequate foreshadowing info.
Ideally, these sorts of things should be implemented in such a way that the never cause major drama or downtime for a player, if they are adequately managed. "Adequate management" should be nothing more than what the player has to do to turn a profit when unloading ph4t loot, and it makes for a slightly more interesting economy than constant profit for the player, with few ways to contribute money back into the merchants' purses (ie Fallout or Morrowind, where money is tracked fairly explicitly)
On the whole, I feel that it can add a lot to a game. It can provide the basest of motivations, keeping the player and/or the plotline moving, it gives the player a sense that their profit has some use, somewhere along the line if quests are a bit thin at any point in the game, it provides an extra bit of decision making (the essence of expressing RP "How would my character approach this problem?") and in the right circumstances provides a platform for more in depth RP. (Like a mate of mine's 300lb wizard who spent most of his loot money on rations, and insisted on tasting everything the party ever killed.)