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1eyedking Isometric gameplay can't hold a candle to first person real-time

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CyberP

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Van Buren. Yes it looked very promising, but I know this will upset some old school types, but I am glad they Bethesda-ified it. Isometric gameplay cannot hold a candle to first person real-time. It's a far stronger & deeper core concept. And it doesn't have to mean it suddenly cannot have deep C&C, hardcore gameplay, survival elements and so on either.

Zboj Lamignat: Isometric fag :P
 
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Infinitron

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Van Buren. Yes it looked very promising, but I know this will upset some old school types, but I am glad they Bethesda-ified it. Isometric gameplay cannot hold a candle to first person real-time. It's a far stronger & deeper core concept. And it doesn't have to mean it suddenly cannot have deep C&C, hardcore gameplay, survival elements and so on either.

Zboj Lamignat: Isometric fag :P
:nocountryforshitposters:
 

DalekFlay

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Isometric and first-person are both great for different reasons. Let's not out ourselves as truly insane and debate which is better.
 
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CyberP

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You disagree first person real-time gameplay is not a stronger core concept? Read on..
 
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You are a retard. First person is not inherently better than isometric and that does not need to be explained.
 

Angthoron

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Cut the guy some slack, he's a refugee of a first-person game where jumping is impossible.
 
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CyberP

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Cut the guy some slack, he's a refugee of a first-person game where jumping is impossible.

There is no slack to cut. It's a deeper core concept. It's not my fault some dinosaurs are oblivious to this.
 

tuluse

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There is no slack to cut. It's a deeper core concept. It's not my fault some dinosaurs are oblivious to this.
I know what you mean man. I was totally enjoying a game of Civ4, but then I got to a body of water and my spearman couldn't even jump over it or swim through it. Totally ruined my immersion and dropped the game as fast as I could.
 

No Great Name

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Yes, I have been a retard with my wording. It is not inherently better for all gametypes, such as strategy. For most types of cRPG or a shooter though I believe it is. But variety is nice of course.

It cannot be denied it results in superior interactivity though, and realistically superior immersion also.
RPGs value these things a lot, after all.
Yea you're right. Fallout 1 should've been in first person perspective.
 

AlexOfSpades

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Oh hey, another refugee! Hi, CyberP.

Edit: Ah, the good ol "I like this more because of personal taste, therefore you're a retard if you don't like it too" debate.
 

Cowboy Moment

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It's kind of funny, but first person games, on average, are probably the least interactive, because of the presentation requirements. An isometric game, for instance, can easily have environmental destruction, because nobody's going to zoom in on a destroyed wall and wonder whether it looks good. This is why so few FPS have destructible environments beyond what is explicitly scripted.

Roguelikes on the other hand are, by far, the most interactive games, simply because they don't need to worry about presentation. If an action makes logical sense, they can allow it with little added effort.
 
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CyberP

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^On average perhaps. But Looking Glass' games and Bethesda's are a major exception.
 

TheGreatOne

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First person view -> no party+real time combat ->less depth. Also a true RPG isn't supposed to require twitch reflexes. Nothing wrong with SS2/Deus Ex/VTMB but the default RPG should be 2D/Isometric and have turn based combat and party creation or at least include recruitable party members

Realism/immersion arguments are retarded because real life is boring and games are games
 

DalekFlay

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I think first-person might be better than third-person in all genres for me. I wish the Gothic and Risen games were first-person, for example. I think it works better (with mouse control anyway) for that kind of game.

However isometric or "top-down" perspectives are entirely different and equally valid.
 

No Great Name

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Some RPGs work better in first person, others don't. Objectively, one is not always superior to the other.
 

JarlFrank

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Yes it is, shit head.

So you would argue that first person is not inherently better than behind the player third person also?
It most certainly is superior for realistic & deeper interactivity. Realistically for any sane person it's superior for immersion also.

Isometric, third person and first person are perspectives. They all fit their respective games. Tomb Raider wouldn't be Tomb Raider if it wasn't 3rd person. Thief wouldn't be Thief if it wasn't 1st person. Baldur's Gate wouldn't be Baldur's Gate if it wasn't isometric.

You wouldn't be retarded if you weren't an idiot.
 

Garrettt

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My friend says you guys smell like poo so nuahh!

Honestly you're both retards quit going back and forth like a bunch of children.
 

Gentle Player

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Realistically for any sane person it's superior for immersion also.

Actually, sane people don't talk about immersion in regards to video games because it's nothing more than a marketing buzzword. The one (Oxford English) dictionary definition of "immersion", other than to immerse an object into liquid, is simply "Deep mental involvement in something". Therefore it's entirely subjective - I could be fully immersed in exploring the contents of my nose with my finger, yet may struggle to keep interested in a first person game. That doesn't mean picking one's nose is inherently more "immersive" than playing New Vegas, rather it's dependent on the individual and his state of mind, and not the "something". Also of note is that the only definition of "immersive" that I could find is purely technical ("(Of a computer display or system) generating a three-dimensional image which appears to surround the user.") and makes no reference to any effect on one's emotions or whatever; I've also never seen it used in any other way except by marketing/PR dullards - hell, even the spell-checker is flagging it as a non-existent word as I type it.

As for interactivity, it depends entirely on the game and not the perspective - an FPS like Doom is typically less interactive than Fallout 1, and the top-down Ultima VII is just as interactive as any TES game, perhaps more so.
 
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Divinity: Original Sin
Picking nose 3rd person view:

XNA_Lara_Picking_Nose_by_Ranock.jpg


Much more immersive picking nose from 1st person perpective.

screenshot_pc_prey018.jpg
 

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