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My Risen impressions

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RK47

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Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
After having some back and forth discussions with other codexers over steam chat, it seems like there are many people who genuinely like this game. I honestly have many gripes with this game, and I can't see any 'feedback of fun' from the game despite putting in the effort into learning it. It's funny, I tend to be very forgiving unless the game's a complete trainwreck or is out to unnecessarily punish the players. In this game, it's mostly the latter IMO.

So, here goes. This is my first PB game btw, I never played gothic or other eurotrashes from them.
The only thing comparable to it was probably Two Worlds 2 which I got to the end and quit because it has a turret section.
Couple of things that bothered me a lot...
1. Everything seems vague and under the hood
Yes, I know. It's the 'next-gen' demand of having things spelled out to you. But I honestly got frustrated when the game refused to guide me in the first 10 minutes of the game. My first start was a 3 minute search for a non-highlighted item in a beach... sue me. That's like being set up for a date with an Indian girl by the way.

hahahno.png


Why is everything so 'hidden'? From how the combat is supposed to be played - the game only told me Left click to attack. Not a single time did the game told me double-tap is to dodge. Only through the Witcher 3 play experience I decided to double-tap move keys in combat, and voila. I dodged. I didn't know you could 'HEAVY attack' in this game by holding Left Mouse Button. I also didn't know you could CONTINUE DRINKING FROM THE BARREL by holding the mouse button (LOL). Why not tell the players? Why is it such a hidden feature?

hahahno2.png


There's a huge difference between challenge and frustration.
Try playing chess without knowing what moves are even valid. Have fun taking back invalid moves over and over again till you learn each piece's property. That's what's happening to me in the next paragraph.

2. Poorly done training scenario
Yes, I admit, I fooled around to get into the monastery, but this is by no means a 'loss state' unlike what some codexer claimed. You tempted fate, Steve now pay for it. No, sheeplords, this is a branching of starting factions. Which is cool in my book, at first. Only to experience the whole bitter 'training school' gameplay. This is supposed to be 'Advanced Combat Tutorial' segment, done well, it could fit right into the monastery scenario. You train, you make mistakes, learn new moves from your fellow students, gain advice, have fun while doing it because this is a game. It's supposed to be fun.

Except the last 2 never happened. Let me just add the oddity of having to pay your fellow students money to gain STR/DEX off training. Hey, I thought I'm supposed to e conscripted here, why am I paying you for? Okay, never mind. Advice? Very little advice was dispensed. All the STR guy said is hit hard, hit fast, win fast, hence less chance of losing. OOOOKAY.

Then I walk into the area and get beat down like a chump
No one tells me what I did wrong.
The game won't tell me anything.
Just like in chess, I spent time trying to move my Horse piece diagonally, spent fruitless hours moving the bishop horizontally, trying to figure out how to play Risen's Staff Chess with an unfeeling robot.
I lose a lot of times, I learn nothing out of it, except ...maybe dodge here, spank them on the butt, block, hit, block, move here,..
This is an entirely one-way learning experience. I grit my teeth, people criticize my spamming but c'mon I'm frustrated. Do I look like I was having fun?
The game is supposed to explain, help me understand what the fuck is going on. Not beat me down and tell me repeatedly 'get up and try again' while I gained very little in terms of understanding. This is a training school, but I gained no exp from losing in arena fights, only lose pocket change over and over. And when people called me out on degenerate plays in games that left many things unexplained, I'm supposed to git gud without knowing what is 'average' plays?



So...after beating three of my seniors from trial and error with nary a trace of fun, I finally waited for the game to open up.
What is my motivation in this game so far? I want to escape from this hell of a monastery, which never happened. Cause that's not an option.

Also, I want to murder the designers who thinks I'm to be rewarded after beating three seniors in arena combat with a 'boss fight' aka 'you beat the students, now face the master' like it was even possible for a kid who is just fresh off the boat that got wrecked in the intro.

All in all, it was soul-crushing. I worked so hard to grind through the three robots in duel, only to get tossed into a fight that took out 80% HP in one hit because 'it's funny'
I wasn't laughing.
I wasn't having fun.
This is insulting.

So I decided to side-step, asked for advice, and finally, someone told me to humble this trainer with another trick. Get him drunk and get him to relinquish that sword of his.
GREAT! I finally will humiliate this faggot. I even got him one of the WORST SWORD IN THE WORLD! Hahaha, no way I can lose.

Except...I still lose, horribly.

True, the guy hits for 30% per hit now but he still fucking swings just as fast, and that is a serious problem when I'm still coming to grips to how combat is supposed to work, DID YOU REALLY THINK ALL THAT THREE SESSION WITH A STAFF IS GOING TO PREPARE ME TO FIGHT WITH A FUCKING SWORD AGAINST A SWORDMASTER?
The fuck? This is how you reward players who took an extra step to beat an opponent?
He was even intoxicated, ffs! Yet he fought like a well-drilled soldier. Blocking when needed, striking just as fast as I do. Once again, I knew no tricks, I learned none in the past student fights, I simply block, and tap my mouse twice, then hold block again. Sometimes I hit him, sometimes I don't. All I know is his red bar better drop to zero before mine does.

Eventually, this degenerate play was rewarded and I still wasn't having fun. Thank's for wasting 3 hours of my life, Risen.

BTW I am very glad when NPC Vitus ended up 'broken' after I opened someone's chest by accident and unable to progress the game. At that point, I just felt the game wasn't offering anything fun and it didn't deserve more effort wasted on it.

No offense to those who like this game, I can tell the game had great open world, faction choices, and niche alternative to those tired of next-gen bland RPG, but based solely on my Monastery experience, broken NPC bug or no, this game is not for me.
 

Urbanolo

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I'm pretty sure you're trolling, but whatever, those features you mention are not hidden. Back in the days games used to have manuals.
 
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So, here goes. This is my first PB game btw, I never played gothic or other eurotrashes from them.
Just reached this point and I can already tell I will fiercely dislike the rest of your post.
I have yet to see a person waving this term (or equivalents) around who doesn't strike me as a complete mongoloid in the long run.

EDIT- Yep, I disliked it!
 

Darth Roxor

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TL;DR you suck at the game and blame the game for your sucking like a next-gen kiddo. This is why we can't have nice things.
 

Aeschylus

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What I read: I suck at the game and am looking for someone to validate how much I suck by telling me that the game sucks instead. Sorry buddy, but life is cruel.

Although your thread is an interesting insight into the focus group comments PB likely got that lead to Risen 2 and 3.
 

Darth Roxor

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Maybe you should try Arcania: Gothic 4. It offers a much more welcoming experience for a newcomer to the Piranha Bytes-style RPG.
 

RK47

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Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
I rather not. But that's all you got? Blame the player, not the game?
 

RK47

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Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
What I read: I suck at the game and am looking for someone to validate how much I suck by telling me that the game sucks instead. Sorry buddy, but life is cruel.

Although your thread is an interesting insight into the focus group comments PB likely got that lead to Risen 2 and 3.
You clearly skipped the part where I admit I don't get it and want the game to enlighten me. But it never did.
 

Aeschylus

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You clearly skipped the part where I admit I don't get it and want the game to enlighten me. But it never did.
Actually the fight you grouse endlessly about really is a matter of skill, there's nothing to be enlightened about. The Gothic games + Risen 1 have combat that is both purposefully challenging and skill/reflex based -- if you play it properly it's not particularly difficult to beat that guy without taking a single hit. It's also much easier with a shield, which you probably would have found if you had explored the opening areas in more depth.
 

RK47

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Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
Actually the fight you grouse endlessly about really is a matter of skill, there's nothing to be enlightened about. The Gothic games + Risen 1 have combat that is both purposefully challenging and skill/reflex based -- if you play it properly it's not particularly difficult to beat that guy without taking a single hit. It's also much easier with a shield, which you probably would have found if you had explored the opening areas in more depth.

Yes, it's a matter of player skills that is never explained fully on what the 'skill' is about in this game's badly explained combat and 'learning segments'
I think you missed a point somewhere in all this fervor of fanaticism, there I was in supposedly low level area, being given a staff and told to defend myself with no explanation nor pointers on the 'good combat behavior'
 

RK47

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Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
Better go back to World of Warcraft and Final Fantasy XXVI, Asian.

You mean games with better gameplay? Ahahahah ikr!
All the europeans are coming out of wood work.
 

RK47

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Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
How does one spend 9 years and make 20 thousand posts on the codex without playing eurotrash ?

:lol: On more a serious note: I don't give a fuck about what most oldfags think about their gold boxes, blobbers, gothic, and other stuff 'hivemind thinks I'm supposed to play cause of 9 years and 20k posts in Codex'

I don't see the need.
Now I got bored and went back on steam library, lo and behold: a lot of people in Codex likes Risen. Let's give it a spin.
And it turned to be a disappointment.
 

Orma

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Ohhh deep one liner that explains everything. I can use this line to the game developers, but they're busy enhancing their sinking ship.



You should play risen 2 or 3, they are more 'user friendly'
 

RK47

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Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
You should play risen 2 or 3, they are more 'user friendly'

Nah. I rather not pay the dev anymore. Let them sink. We have fallout 4.
Look, I understand your butthurt: this azn thinks he's hot shit cause he finds the combat mechanics unfun when my old self read the manual and decided to take time and beat the legit challenges in this game while having fun exploring shit that is way better than most of the TES series that the OP spent hundreds of hours if not thousands in there.

But fuck, address the complaint. I'd love to know why or how the snap-no-frame animation dodge, and lack of in-game tutorial on combat makes it a legitimately better gameplay than most next gen shit that waves tutorial on their face.

Press F to get rekt seriously and stop putting pillars in your ass for eternity.

I'm pretty sure you're trolling, but whatever, those features you mention are not hidden. Back in the days games used to have manuals.

Pretty sure I'm not. I'm not paid to shit on this game. I don't get paid to love this game. I paid to play this game. I paid to have fun in this game.

Now repeat after me. All pillars are toys All pillars are toys All pillars are toys All pillars are toys All pillars are toys All pillars are toys All pillars are toys All pillars are toys All pillars are toys All pillars are toys All pillars are toys All pillars are toys All pillars are toys All pillars are toys All pillars are toys All pillars are toys All pillars are toys All pillars are toys All pillars are toys All pillars are toys
 
Last edited:

Baron Dupek

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NPCs are so annoying in Risen 3 it's not even funny. Especially two-legged cow Patty, who's tutorial NPC holding hour hand on everything except her two bimbos.
Writing wasn't special in Risen series, but in R3 is on top with traumatic garbage I experienced in russian shovelwares like Planet Alcatraz.
 

RK47

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Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
Will you get a thousand hours in Fallout 4 too?

m84iPQE.jpg

Possibly? who knows? Depending on the mods we might get a hundred, two hundred three hundred? With the paid DLC plans going on, I doubt I might hit 200 this time around.

NPCs are so annoying in Risen 3 it's not even funny. Especially two-legged cow Patty, who's tutorial NPC holding hour hand on everything except her two bimbos.
Writing wasn't special in Risen series, but in R3 is on top with traumatic garbage I experienced in russian shovelwares like Planet Alcatraz.

This must be related to Risen 1 sucking.
Shocking. Absolutely shocking.
 

Aeschylus

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Ok, it's become fairly clear that you're just using this thread as a weak troll attempt, but I'll give a final response anyway on why you're full of it.

Risen was a holdover from the generation of games (RPGs in particular) that expected players to RTFM and figure things out for themselves. Fallout did not explain optimal combat behavior, or really much of anything. The IE games did not explain optimal combat behavior (or, again, very much at all). You were given a few very basic guidelines and then expected to suck it up, die a few times, figure it out, and improve your strategies as you moved on.

Particularly in PB games, at the start you are supposed to be a pathetic weakling, not any kind of conquering hero, and you have to play in a way that reflects that. You have to run sometimes, and avoid some fights until you are stronger/more skilled/better equipped. Your lack of enlightenment reflects your character's; both you and the PC have very little idea wtf you are doing, and both figure it out as you go along.

Now go back to Skyrim, you'll be safe there.
 

Jaedar

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Project: Eternity Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pathfinder: Kingmaker
Yes, it's a matter of player skills that is never explained fully on what the 'skill' is about in this game's badly explained combat and 'learning segments'
I think you missed a point somewhere in all this fervor of fanaticism, there I was in supposedly low level area, being given a staff and told to defend myself with no explanation nor pointers on the 'good combat behavior'
You really weren't in a very low level area.

You are pretty much "supposed to" go to either the bandit camp or harbor town first. Getting captured without doing anything is going to make you a bit underleveled. And not only were you underleveled, you also couldn't afford to actually spend the few learning points you had, because you had no money.

The game certainly could have had a tutorial, but lets be honest: Risen combat is not complex. There's sidestepping, blocking and attacking. Attacking is a single length 3 combo, and the only skill is timing it so the attacks come out a bit faster. In all honesty, this does not need a tutorial, its not unreasonable you figure it out (plus... you could read the manual).

And then you can't figure out how to proceed with the investigation, and instead of manning up (or looking at a guide), you claim the game is broken and give up.
 

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