-
Welcome to rpgcodex.net, a site dedicated to discussing computer based role-playing games in a free and open fashion. We're less strict than other forums, but please refer to the rules.
"This message is awaiting moderator approval": All new users must pass through our moderation queue before they will be able to post normally. Until your account has "passed" your posts will only be visible to yourself (and moderators) until they are approved. Give us a week to get around to approving / deleting / ignoring your mundane opinion on crap before hassling us about it. Once you have passed the moderation period (think of it as a test), you will be able to post normally, just like all the other retards.
Vapourware Project Silkworm (from a indie)
- Thread starter Apexeon
- Start date
Abelian
Somebody's Alt
- Joined
- Nov 17, 2013
- Messages
- 2,289
Looking good. Is this a mock-up or did you and your brother get this far with your game engine?
Apexeon
Arcane
- Joined
- Nov 10, 2012
- Messages
- 864
Combat system oh no its like a 20 year old blobber turn based style !!New world bling with old school charm or fail.
Combat was never going to be on the exploration screen. I worked on a few different ideas and the time/$ required for all the animation work. Basically with the heavy map art workload I would require 2 additional staff to handle all the animation work (100K in wages). With the Blobber style me and my wife can probably have a set of 30 creatures for review on the KS pitch.
or 
My prototype concept / work in progress. Once me and my wife work out the art work load we can proceed.
Animations with full 3D characters running around the screen is a mega ton of work so we cancelled that approach.
Last edited:
80Maxwell08
Arcane
- Joined
- Nov 14, 2012
- Messages
- 1,154
Out of all the images you've posted, the only typo I saw was "Strenght". Looks great.
What if you cut down on the number of opponents? If you do something in a setting where all humanoids are humans (or at least, have a human shaped skeleton), that should reduce animation needs a lot (that is also why there are only human and skeletons in my game).
Ninjerk
Arcane
- Joined
- Jul 10, 2013
- Messages
- 14,323
What are you thinking the goal is going to be?
MRY
Wormwood Studios
Apexeon The video is amazing. The Kickstarter page needs a bit of work, I think. Some thoughts, in no real order:
(1) You should retain a copy editor. Or, if you really want, I'm sure I or one of the many good eyes on the Codex can scrub the text. But it's fully of typos, formatting issues, etc. I think you need to be as close to perfect as you can.
(2) I would definitely remove "Realm of Heaven and Earth" from the Kickstarter title, probably also from the game's name. To me, it has a vaguely Asian flavor to it, and in any event is the kind of say-nothing subtitle that you see a lot of in jRPG titles. To be sure, Wizardry had subtitles along those lines, bu I think they were more evocative and direct. In any event, the combination, to me, strongly connotes an RPG Maker. This is idiosyncratic, so take it for what it's worth.
(3) I am not persuaded on Alcyone either. I know the allusion, but the name itself has that almost-a-word quality ("anyone" "a cyclone" "halcyon") that means that when I see it, I cannot really tell you what I'm reading. That the name is parsed as gibberish by our brains is underscored by the fact that you misspell it three times in the Overview section and three times elsewhere ("Alycone").
(4) The non-3d-rendered art, including the logo, on the page is much weaker than the 3d-rendered art. My recommendation would be to drop it altogether. The 3d art looks in the same general league as IE games (although not quite as strong), but the concept art looks like the kind of stuff you can find on a bazillion failed projects and in a bazillion nerds' trapper keepers. It dilutes the brand you're offering, which is professional-quality look from a husband and wife team.
(5) I think the one-liner (logline?) is not as strong as it could be. I know that "turn based" matters a lot to people, but both "turn based" (I myself would hyphenate it) and "CGI" feel more technical than evocative. I think the "c" in "cRPG" is probably unnecessary. Maybe "An isometric, turn-based RPG inspired by the classics." Still technical, but I think it is a bit more moving. I'm not a great copywriter, but I think that's going to do you better. Let the art speak for itself.
(6) The heading text is hard to read (almost illegible without work).
(7) I would flip the first two pictures. The zoomed out one with two characters feels more like a random screenshot and less like what a signature image of the game.
(8) The Overview is guilty of the same problem as the logline: it contains technical stuff that doesn't sound like features, even though in this age of streamlined RPGs, they may well be. "Get equipment and EXP" is definitional to an RPG; it doesn't set yours apart. Here is a stab at rewriting it:
(9) The Magic Items section should be removed.
(10) Story should be moved up to after features.
(11) The "development points" system gets mentioned twice in features, but I'm not sure what it is. Might be best to give it its own section, and flesh it out more.
(12) Platforms should be cut. Just say "Steam and DRM-free release options" in features.
(13) I would move the Team section up earlier. The husband-and-wife concept is an appealing aspect of the pitch.
(14) I'm not sure you need to define exploration, etc., as much as you do.
(15) I would not mention stretch goals at the outset.
(16) I would remove "by Stephen Burns" -- you're a scholar and a gentleman, but no one knows you from Adam.
I think my biggest takeaway is that you could use a dedicated writer. There are lots of strong candidates on the Codex who I suspect would take the job for a nice word and a boxed copy.
-EDIT-
This is all fairly negative, but you probably need criticism more than backslapping at this stage. The art is certainly there; it's the tentpole of the project, and the speed with which you're banging it out is really impressive. I just think you need to build up the other parts a bit. I'm sure I'll throw some money your way.
(1) You should retain a copy editor. Or, if you really want, I'm sure I or one of the many good eyes on the Codex can scrub the text. But it's fully of typos, formatting issues, etc. I think you need to be as close to perfect as you can.
(2) I would definitely remove "Realm of Heaven and Earth" from the Kickstarter title, probably also from the game's name. To me, it has a vaguely Asian flavor to it, and in any event is the kind of say-nothing subtitle that you see a lot of in jRPG titles. To be sure, Wizardry had subtitles along those lines, bu I think they were more evocative and direct. In any event, the combination, to me, strongly connotes an RPG Maker. This is idiosyncratic, so take it for what it's worth.
(3) I am not persuaded on Alcyone either. I know the allusion, but the name itself has that almost-a-word quality ("anyone" "a cyclone" "halcyon") that means that when I see it, I cannot really tell you what I'm reading. That the name is parsed as gibberish by our brains is underscored by the fact that you misspell it three times in the Overview section and three times elsewhere ("Alycone").
(4) The non-3d-rendered art, including the logo, on the page is much weaker than the 3d-rendered art. My recommendation would be to drop it altogether. The 3d art looks in the same general league as IE games (although not quite as strong), but the concept art looks like the kind of stuff you can find on a bazillion failed projects and in a bazillion nerds' trapper keepers. It dilutes the brand you're offering, which is professional-quality look from a husband and wife team.
(5) I think the one-liner (logline?) is not as strong as it could be. I know that "turn based" matters a lot to people, but both "turn based" (I myself would hyphenate it) and "CGI" feel more technical than evocative. I think the "c" in "cRPG" is probably unnecessary. Maybe "An isometric, turn-based RPG inspired by the classics." Still technical, but I think it is a bit more moving. I'm not a great copywriter, but I think that's going to do you better. Let the art speak for itself.
(6) The heading text is hard to read (almost illegible without work).
(7) I would flip the first two pictures. The zoomed out one with two characters feels more like a random screenshot and less like what a signature image of the game.
(8) The Overview is guilty of the same problem as the logline: it contains technical stuff that doesn't sound like features, even though in this age of streamlined RPGs, they may well be. "Get equipment and EXP" is definitional to an RPG; it doesn't set yours apart. Here is a stab at rewriting it:
Perhaps flowery, especially at the end! But I think a little better. When mentioning your inspirations, best to target games that will have a strong nostalgic pull.
(9) The Magic Items section should be removed.
(10) Story should be moved up to after features.
(11) The "development points" system gets mentioned twice in features, but I'm not sure what it is. Might be best to give it its own section, and flesh it out more.
(12) Platforms should be cut. Just say "Steam and DRM-free release options" in features.
(13) I would move the Team section up earlier. The husband-and-wife concept is an appealing aspect of the pitch.
(14) I'm not sure you need to define exploration, etc., as much as you do.
(15) I would not mention stretch goals at the outset.
(16) I would remove "by Stephen Burns" -- you're a scholar and a gentleman, but no one knows you from Adam.
I think my biggest takeaway is that you could use a dedicated writer. There are lots of strong candidates on the Codex who I suspect would take the job for a nice word and a boxed copy.
-EDIT-
This is all fairly negative, but you probably need criticism more than backslapping at this stage. The art is certainly there; it's the tentpole of the project, and the speed with which you're banging it out is really impressive. I just think you need to build up the other parts a bit. I'm sure I'll throw some money your way.
MRY
Wormwood Studios
I certainly don't mean to suggest a hostility to Asian things, so I hope it didn't sound that way! As a teenager, my multimedia staples were kung-fu movies, anime, and jRPGs. But I think the connotations the name generates are not consistent with the game, which seems "Western" in both mechanics and setting. I think you want, as much as possible, to suggest that the game is a love-letter to specific games that possible backers will also fondly remember, such that they will want to be signatories to the love-letter themselves. By all means you should also show ways in which you're building upon those classics as opposed to merely aping them, but you don't want to seem like you're building away from them, if that makes sense? The title, to me, feels like it's going in a different direction.
You may also want to namecheck Lords of Xulima. If nothing else, it seems like one of a small number of games that mash up isometric exploration with that style of combat, and it was a successful crowd-funding venture. The developers seem like good people, too, so they might be able to provide you some practical advice as well as a useful point of comparison.
You may also want to namecheck Lords of Xulima. If nothing else, it seems like one of a small number of games that mash up isometric exploration with that style of combat, and it was a successful crowd-funding venture. The developers seem like good people, too, so they might be able to provide you some practical advice as well as a useful point of comparison.
tuluse
Arcane
- Joined
- Jul 20, 2008
- Messages
- 11,400
Watched your video Apexeon
I think a lot of the wipes are cheesy and it kind of seems like you just wanted to use all of them. I think you should probably stick with just fade in and outs, looks much classier. The scene where you fade the characters and bring in the snow looks really nice.
The music and art in the video are both very nice.
You have to talk in you video. You may not want to, but you have to. I'd keep what you have right now (with changes to the transitions as I said), and talk over it. Just introduce yourself and your game. Talk about inspirations and why you think you have something special to bring. You don't *have* to appear on camera, but you have to talk.
I think a lot of the wipes are cheesy and it kind of seems like you just wanted to use all of them. I think you should probably stick with just fade in and outs, looks much classier. The scene where you fade the characters and bring in the snow looks really nice.
The music and art in the video are both very nice.
You have to talk in you video. You may not want to, but you have to. I'd keep what you have right now (with changes to the transitions as I said), and talk over it. Just introduce yourself and your game. Talk about inspirations and why you think you have something special to bring. You don't *have* to appear on camera, but you have to talk.
tuluse
Arcane
- Joined
- Jul 20, 2008
- Messages
- 11,400
Went over the pitch text (honestly this isn't as important as the video because well people are people).
I have to disagree with MRY about the game list. Make sure you leave Warriors of the Eternal Sun in. I haven't heard of it either, but that doesn't matter. It shows it's a list of games *you* are inspired by, not a "who's who" of classic RPGs.
Don't do an image dump like you have. Use images to space out text like you did, save any extras to put into update.
PREPARE FOR LOTS OF UPDATES. People can only take in so much information at once, and I think you did a reasonable job giving high level explanations of certain concepts, but I'm left wanting to know more about the character system, story, and world/universe. That's actually ok. The rule of hollywood is always leave them wanting more, but expect to be writing updates about this stuff and you can use the left over art then.
You should re-name drop games when explaining how things work. When you explain how exploration works, you should yadda yadda yadda like Baldur's Gate.
Drop the character sheet screen completely. It is not on par with the rest of your work in terms of presentation, and you can put it in an update later to show it, but not have it appear on the front page.
I have to disagree with MRY about the game list. Make sure you leave Warriors of the Eternal Sun in. I haven't heard of it either, but that doesn't matter. It shows it's a list of games *you* are inspired by, not a "who's who" of classic RPGs.
Don't do an image dump like you have. Use images to space out text like you did, save any extras to put into update.
PREPARE FOR LOTS OF UPDATES. People can only take in so much information at once, and I think you did a reasonable job giving high level explanations of certain concepts, but I'm left wanting to know more about the character system, story, and world/universe. That's actually ok. The rule of hollywood is always leave them wanting more, but expect to be writing updates about this stuff and you can use the left over art then.
You should re-name drop games when explaining how things work. When you explain how exploration works, you should yadda yadda yadda like Baldur's Gate.
Drop the character sheet screen completely. It is not on par with the rest of your work in terms of presentation, and you can put it in an update later to show it, but not have it appear on the front page.
MRY
Wormwood Studios
Perhaps, but I think WoES seemed like a head-fake: it is not 3D rendered, it has a small party, it's a console game, combat is different, etc. I think the current project page, which lists Ishar, splits the baby nicely. Ishar is also small name game, but it's less small name and more in line with this project.
Regarding the new page:
(1) I like Drakmoor a lot more as a title, and it fits wonderfully with the lead image. I wonder whether it might get read as "Darkmoor." Just something to mull.
(2) The title and story make it sound like a megadungeon that you're crawling through, but the artwork and world map suggest otherwise. I don't know that it needs addressing, but I figured I'd mention it.
(3) FWIW, I like the character sheet. Clearly Tuluse and I are not like minded.
It also seems like the logical image to put in conjunction with the skill system.
Apexeon
Arcane
- Joined
- Nov 10, 2012
- Messages
- 864
Awesome advice.
MRY
Wormwood Studios
By the way, a very stupid point, but I would consider not showing a photo of you and your wife -- I think text will work better here, though others may disagree. If you use a photo, I would not use one where either of you is wearing a shirt that says "MONEY."
Apexeon
Arcane
- Joined
- Nov 10, 2012
- Messages
- 864
You know outside of these forums I have not met many people who know any of the games I played and loved when I was younger.
Gone to a few developer gigs here in Oz.
Mention these below and be prepared to be met with a blank face.
Ishar 1,2,3.
Might and Magic 1-6.
Eye of the Beholder
Even Ice Wind Dale, PST
The Fallout name is known because a first shooter showed up with its name on it.
Most people think Fallout has the 3 on it to match with the 3 on the end of the playstation 3 (Like its the first game in the series/marketing gimmick).
There was a Fallout 1&2 gamers.
Gone to a few developer gigs here in Oz.
Mention these below and be prepared to be met with a blank face.
Ishar 1,2,3.
Might and Magic 1-6.
Eye of the Beholder
Even Ice Wind Dale, PST
The Fallout name is known because a first shooter showed up with its name on it.
Most people think Fallout has the 3 on it to match with the 3 on the end of the playstation 3 (Like its the first game in the series/marketing gimmick).
There was a Fallout 1&2 gamers.
Apexeon
Arcane
- Joined
- Nov 10, 2012
- Messages
- 864
By the way, a very stupid point, but I would consider not showing a photo of you and your wife -- I think text will work better here, though others may disagree. If you use a photo, I would not use one where either of you is wearing a shirt that says "MONEY."
Its a work in progress pitch I am going to change it. 8 weeks out from a pitch.
As an Amazon Associate, rpgcodex.net earns from qualifying purchases.