Risen 3: Titan Lords

[Clockwork Knight]

Enemies having predictable patterns is only good in Megaman boss fights. Enjoy your frailty while it lasts because exploring an unknown world becomes less interesting when you can rapidfire fireball everything from a mile.

Alternately get knocked up by the inquisition

( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

 

[Alfons]

All that matters is that you learn how to dodge properly. If you don't get hit you don't take damage.

Dodging is hilariously shit, or maybe it's the fault of the atrocious absence of hitboxes. Sometimes you get hit from the side even though your shield is up sometimes you don't. Your attacks don't have that privilege though, a dude is 90 degrees to the left of you and your attack animation sails through his head but for whatever reason you don't hit. Same goes for dodging, you get hir by shit that doesn't hit you.

A hilarious thing about the side dodge is that it doesn't actually work. When you use it reactively you will get hit almost 100% of the time, but if you just use it when the dude is not attacking if you are close enough he will always attack and miss, if you're not close enough he'll hit you. I'm pretty sure I mentioned it before but the ai is making it look like you dodged an attack. Cracks me up every time.

Unfortunately capitalizing on that is not that easy since the lock on just doesn't work. What's nice is that for the most part the NPC's have the same problem, when someone sidesteps and attacks they are usually hitting nothing but air.

Another funny thing is that some, maybe all animals can't figure out that the little parry/attack move is an attack. For example, the vultures will back peddle like assholes until the end of the earth to almost any attack you throw but if you initiate with the parry strike they will stand there like a deer in headlights.

Sometimes when enemies are in large groups they will just stand there and let you have a one on one fight and jump in just to fuck with you every once in a while, other times all of them are piling up on top of you with 3 people doing combos at the same time.

But I get where you guys are coming from, defending this shit. Now that I am reasonably strong I don't notice that shit as much. If you take one bullshit hit you don't really see how bullshit it actually was. But just as an experiment, next time you play go and fight some of the mobs while you're level 2 and you'll probably see what I'm talking about.

In this game gear and levels are way more important than skill.

 

[Alfons]

BTW, is there a reason to go with swords over axes?

 

[Average Manatee]

All that matters is that you learn how to dodge properly. If you don't get hit you don't take damage.

Dodging is hilariously shit, or maybe it's the fault of the atrocious absence of hitboxes. Sometimes you get hit from the side even though your shield is up sometimes you don't. Your attacks don't have that privilege though, a dude is 90 degrees to the left of you and your attack animation sails through his head but for whatever reason you don't hit. Same goes for dodging, you get hir by shit that doesn't hit you.

A hilarious thing about the side dodge is that it doesn't actually work. When you use it reactively you will get hit almost 100% of the time, but if you just use it when the dude is not attacking if you are close enough he will always attack and miss, if you're not close enough he'll hit you. I'm pretty sure I mentioned it before but the ai is making it look like you dodged an attack. Cracks me up every time.

Unfortunately capitalizing on that is not that easy since the lock on just doesn't work. What's nice is that for the most part the NPC's have the same problem, when someone sidesteps and attacks they are usually hitting nothing but air.

Another funny thing is that some, maybe all animals can't figure out that the little parry/attack move is an attack. For example, the vultures will back peddle like assholes until the end of the earth to almost any attack you throw but if you initiate with the parry strike they will stand there like a deer in headlights.

Sometimes when enemies are in large groups they will just stand there and let you have a one on one fight and jump in just to fuck with you every once in a while, other times all of them are piling up on top of you with 3 people doing combos at the same time.

But I get where you guys are coming from, defending this shit. Now that I am reasonably strong I don't notice that shit as much. If you take one bullshit hit you don't really see how bullshit it actually was. But just as an experiment, next time you play go and fight some of the mobs while you're level 2 and you'll probably see what I'm talking about.

In this game gear and levels are way more important than skill.

Certain attacks are meant to be dodged side ways, certain attacks are meant to be dodged backwards. Your job is to know which are which. Certain attacks are undodgeable if you are at a certain distance to the enemy. Your job is to not let the enemy stand at this distance.

The lock on takes some getting used to but you can totally re-target the enemy after a dodge by quickly moving your mouse.

In this game gear and levels are way more important than skill.

Again, you literally start out as a starving person whose had no exercise forever. The only animals you are meant to fight are the ones who are similarly emaciated, "hungry wolves" and the like, who die to one or two strings of attacks (and bear in mind that you can easily get the drop on them and land the first string without problems). Everything else is not meant to be fought until you've picked up a few points of strength and a better weapon, although you can with practice and some quicksaving.

The main problem is that enemies simply start out with a huge amount of health and DR compared to your next-to-nothing strength and weapon. Once you get to level 2 or 3 and dump points in strength, this is over with and skill is the main determiner of what you can 1v1 (fighting groups tends to be sketchy and harder to deal with without good levels and equipment).

 

[Alfons]

1.Certain attacks are meant to be dodged side ways, certain attacks are meant to be dodged backwards. Your job is to know which are which. Certain attacks are undodgeable if you are at a certain distance to the enemy. Your job is to not let the enemy stand at this distance.

2.The lock on takes some getting used to but you can totally re-target the enemy after a dodge by quickly moving your mouse.

1. That's just a load of shit. I have as much success and failure dodging the straight attacks as much as I do the dodging swipe type attacks using the side dodge. If you try and time it you fail if you exploit the AI's quirks you are almost guaranteed to succeed.

2. Yeah, you can, only sometimes the dude is so turned you still miss or you have to wait just enough so the attack is blocked anyway. And that doesn't solve the problem of the lock bouncing all over the place when there is more than one enemy, which is 99% of the time.

 

[Average Manatee]

1.Certain attacks are meant to be dodged side ways, certain attacks are meant to be dodged backwards. Your job is to know which are which. Certain attacks are undodgeable if you are at a certain distance to the enemy. Your job is to not let the enemy stand at this distance.

2.The lock on takes some getting used to but you can totally re-target the enemy after a dodge by quickly moving your mouse.

1. That's just a load of shit. I have as much success and failure dodging the straight attacks as much as I do the dodging swipe type attacks using the side dodge. If you try and time it you fail if you exploit the AI's quirks you are almost guaranteed to succeed.

2. Yeah, you can, only sometimes the dude is so turned you still miss or you have to wait just enough so the attack is blocked anyway. And that doesn't solve the problem of the lock bouncing all over the place when there is more than one enemy, which is 99% of the time.

Git gud, that's seriously all there is to be said.

 

[AetherVagrant]

I cant speak to your experiences, but im not a combatfag, and usually suck at difficult, combat heavy games, at least at the higher difficulties. and i didnt have much problem with risen 1, 2 or 3, though i did find 2 and 3 a little easier than 1. at least not once i did some stupid fetch quests and stole some goodies. the combat is weird and clunky and reminds me of a more janky yet slightly more forgiving version of Dark Souls (which i just gave up on playing after 1/4 of the way through).
it's not precise -- executing a move properly doesnt guarantee that you wont get hit, but still, its doable, and has all the glitches of any other open-world arpg: in that you can lead enemies, choke them, cheese them, reload and surprise them before conversing, etc. but i played 2 and 3 on console with a controller, and playing Risen 1 on PC the jankiness of the combat took way more getting used to with kb+m than it did with a controller.

but im hella : "not gud" and Risen 2 was frustrating at first when i kept trying to explore despite not being equipped or leveled to do so. you can explore...just dont get in a fight. also in 2 i could lead enemies back to the town and get help downing them in my initial forays.

 

[cvv]

Jesus fucking christ Alfons.

 

[T. Reich]

Alfons, you sounded reasonably frustrated at first, but now you're being a retardo for the sake of being retardo. Pls stop.

This one made me split my sides:

But I get where you guys are coming from, defending this shit. Now that I am reasonably strong I don't notice that shit as much. If you take one bullshit hit you don't really see how bullshit it actually was. But just as an experiment, next time you play go and fight some of the mobs while you're level 2 and you'll probably see what I'm talking about.

In this game gear and levels are way more important than skill.

So, uh, like in a proper RPG?
Also, level 2 trying to explore the world and fight the mobs instead of carefully leveling in starting areas to build strength.

Is this your first RPG, or something?

 

[Goblino]

Alfons, you sounded reasonably frustrated at first, but now you're being a retardo for the sake of being retardo. Pls stop.

This one made me split my sides:

But I get where you guys are coming from, defending this shit. Now that I am reasonably strong I don't notice that shit as much. If you take one bullshit hit you don't really see how bullshit it actually was. But just as an experiment, next time you play go and fight some of the mobs while you're level 2 and you'll probably see what I'm talking about.

In this game gear and levels are way more important than skill.

So, uh, like in a proper RPG?
Also, level 2 trying to explore the world and fight the mobs instead of carefully leveling in starting areas to build strength.

Is this your first RPG, or something?

A good arpg is a mix of both.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Except he's complaining about skill "not being important" when he's demonstrating MCA-like levels of skillz with the beginning critters.

 

[Alfons]

Is this your first RPG, or something?

Bitch please. The point that some of you guys were trying/still trying to make is that this game is heavily skill based and that I just need to git gud. Some of you motherfuckers repeatedly state that dodging can allow you to avoid damage entirely, which is simply untrue.

How the fuck do you discover a pattern? By doing something a lot or for a long period of rime. When you're level 4 or 5 and fuck up wolves in 2 or 3 hits you obviously get hit a lot less if at all, when you do, it might be a genuine fuck up, even if it's not, you might write it off as a fuck up since it happens much less than when you are level 2 and it takes around 7-8 hits, then you start to notice all the bullshit that occurs.

TLDR: Yeah it's a very proper RPG that tries to present itself as an ARPG. It's an inconsistent shit of an ARPG.

Except he's complaining about skill "not being important" when he's demonstrating MCA-like levels of skillz with the beginning critters.

You can do everything perfectly and still get fucked consistently, so yeah, skill is not important, the fucking RNG is.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

I retract my previous statement, this is sub-MCA levels of skill. At least he never resorted to the patented "I can't do it so it's impossible" excuse and took his repeated failures in stride.

How is RNG to blame for you fucking up your dodges?

 

[Alfons]

fucking up your dodges?

Yeah, I definitely fuck up dodges, especially the ones where the animation doesn't connect but I still take damage.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

"it's the impredictable patterns"

"it's the RNG"

"it's the hitboxes"

"it's the yearly Jupiter alignment with Saturn fucking up with my Theta waves"

Maybe you're just bad? I'm thinking of just quoting your join date and moving on

 

[Alfons]

Oh noes, there's more than one reason why the combat sucks, my brain, it just can't process that. Of course RNG and unpredictable patterns is basically the same thing. But don't worry, I've got you faggot.

Joined: Jul 25, 2014

 

[adddeed]

What a chump. RIsen 1 has the best aRPG combat there is, and here is this shmuck whining because its not prdecitable and dangerous creatures one shot him at level 1. No wonder PB games are underrated, if most people have such retarded opinions like this genius here.

 

[Gnidrologist]

Jeebus. Just don't use dodging and don't try to go head to head against mobs, especially animals/monsters. Play the game in gamist way, cheese the fuck out of system, level up by doing none combat crap first, steal everything you can steel, SUMMON FUCKING FRED and so on. I'm crap at twitch combat myself. I usually struggle to kill even scavengers and molerats in gothics before sufficiently leveled, while i've seen people, who kill snappers at level 1, without armor using 'heavy branch'.

 

[Alfons]

RIsen 1 has the best aRPG combat there is

There are no words, well except for these:
Motherfucker, you like Risen 2 and 3's combat which is nothing like risen 1 so what in the fuck are you even talking about?

Gnidrologist so what? I'm saying the combat is fucking broken, I know you can cheese the living shit out of it. Lead enemies into NPC's, stand on high ground and snipe, hell, if you really want to, just cheese shit until you have enough in magic bullet and eventually do this:

The fact that you can completely bypass something doesn't make it less shitty.

 

[Gnidrologist]

Have you played gothics, especially Gothic 2: NotR? It's incredibly hard initially and you are basically like retarded baby at the start. Leveling and getting gear is the focal point of that game just like Risen. If you don't have 133t twitch skillz, don't play it like action game. I don't know why are you even trying. Yes, combat in Risen isn't all that fluid and is pretty random given the odds are equal. This is why developing your char is more important than trying to master it's clunky combat. It was the same thing with gothics. Those, who say that Risen combat is super awesome are full of shit, of course.

 

[adddeed]

No we're not. Show me another aRPG with better melee combat than Risen. The feeling of progression, the way you learn new moves and skills, the fights, the way you need to time your attacks and be patient, how you need to watch the enemy and its cues, its all top notch.

 

[Gnidrologist]

There aren't any arpgs with great combat. At least among those i've played (haven't tried the hyped Dark Souls). Risen is decent in terms of progression, just like Gothic, yes. The combat mechanics aren't that enjoyable though.

 

[Alfons]

Yes, combat in Risen isn't all that fluid and is pretty random given the odds are equal. This is why developing your char is more important than trying to master it's clunky combat. It was the same thing with gothics. Those, who say that Risen combat is super awesome are full of shit, of course.

I don't know if you are being sarcastic or not, but this is exactly my point. Twitch skills don't come into play when enemies attacks are executed instantly or when enemies are attacking at the same time. For example something like this:

might seem impressive. But when you pay attention you'll notice the attacks he's "dodging" are starting only after he already started dodging. The enemy is attacking because he dodged, he didn't dodge because the enemy attacked.

When you look which attacks he actually dodged, then he legitimately dodges the jumping lunge move once and he does it because there is enough distance to actually see the attack while it's happening (00:47).

The other time he dodges it (00:55) the attack already missed him and the dodge is just an "oh shit" input. He dodges the bite attack at 00:25 because he's reacting to the ashbeast going forward not the attack itself.

During 00:34 it looks like he actually dodged the bite attack but I'm almost certain it's the same case as in 00:25, he reacted to the beast moving forward, not the attack itself.

The attack he actually consistently dodges is the swipe attack, which has a short windup animation you can see, something the vast majority of animal attacks don't have.

 

[Gnidrologist]

Well then, learn from that guy.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Alfons]

Well then, learn from that guy.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Yap, too bad this is impossible to do against most animal encounters since they are always encountered in packs. Against those he does this:

Most important points:
1) Be high enough level to do a lot of damage.
2) Be high enough level to not care too much if you get hit.
GOT IT!
Twitch skills for the win.