Putting the 'role' back in role-playing games since 2002.
Donate to Codex
Good Old Games
  • Welcome to rpgcodex.net, a site dedicated to discussing computer based role-playing games in a free and open fashion. We're less strict than other forums, but please refer to the rules.

    "This message is awaiting moderator approval": All new users must pass through our moderation queue before they will be able to post normally. Until your account has "passed" your posts will only be visible to yourself (and moderators) until they are approved. Give us a week to get around to approving / deleting / ignoring your mundane opinion on crap before hassling us about it. Once you have passed the moderation period (think of it as a test), you will be able to post normally, just like all the other retards.

KickStarter Shenmue 3

taxalot

I'm a spicy fellow.
Patron
Joined
Oct 28, 2010
Messages
9,613
Location
Your wallet.
Codex 2013 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015
The politics of it all don't matter at all. Shenmue rekindled my interest in video games however popamole and flawed it is because at the time it really felt like an entirely new way to tell stories. And a kickstarter is just a pre order with a discount.

We are getting a game that has been expected for fifteen years. Moral considerations seem pretty irrelevant to anyone interested in the series. It's not like we are funding terrorism.
 

DeepOcean

Arcane
Joined
Nov 8, 2012
Messages
7,394
No way this project is only funded by kickstarter, Shenmue cost a fucking lot of money back in the day, 2 million dollars is nothing, can buy two months of a big development team at best. Shenmue wasn't an isometric RPG or a platformer that are cheaper, it was an open world game like modern day open world games and that shit is expensive as fuck. If the project has no publisher support, it will end on the usual kickstarter mess even if it gets 10 million dollars.

The alternative is if Sega is planning something with Sony and they are using kickstarter as a big focus group tool/marketing tool, alot cheaper than doing market research and they get money upfront. They aren't just being 100% clear of their involvement because they know that they being publishers people are going to look at them on a bad way.

So, people are backing a potential kickstarter mess or pre-ordering a game years before it's ready and years before reviews and trusting that Sega won't fuck it up? How that is a good idea? Sega and Sony are happy for sure with the starved fanboys money.:M
 

Lucky

Arcane
Joined
Apr 28, 2015
Messages
672
The politics of it all don't matter at all. Shenmue rekindled my interest in video games however popamole and flawed it is because at the time it really felt like an entirely new way to tell stories. And a kickstarter is just a pre order with a discount.

We are getting a game that has been expected for fifteen years. Moral considerations seem pretty irrelevant to anyone interested in the series. It's not like we are funding terrorism.


Kickstart isn’t just a pre-order. Sure, it is for the high-profile ones that would have gotten made either way, but it’s also a way for both developers, small or bigger, to get around the publisher system when unable to fund a game by themselves and actually own their content. Games that probably wouldn't have been made without that crowdfunding. Now we’ve got games like Knock Knock, FTL, Serpent in the Staglands, Freedom Planet, Quest For Infamy, Sunrider, Pillars of Eternity, Shovel Knight, Legends of Eisenwald, LISA, the Shadowrun games and Xenonauts, to name a few. And then there’s the games that haven’t been released yet, like STASIS, Torment 2, Chaos Reborn, Frog Fractions 2, Hyper Light Drifter, Octopus City Blues, Barkley 2, Darkest Dungeon and That Which Sleeps

Downplaying it as not being terrorism also doesn’t change that this kickstarter doing well helps publishers get more influence on yet another source of potential income for developers, since the E3 presentation suggests that Sony wants to make this approach more mainstream. That no-one cares about those kind of things is precisely why the games-industry is currently able to get away with doing what it does.

The sad thing is though that the game’s actual quality won’t even matter here since it’s the precedent that it sets of people being willing to kickstart big publisher sponsored games for millions that’s important. A kickstarter that I can pretty much guarantee does nothing to help the developer become independent and only further lines the pockets of their real financers. With Bloodstained and Deliverance the real moneylenders at least still felt compelled to hide their involvement, which means that they wouldn’t be able to make any claims regarding providing marketing advantages to developers looking to kickstart. Now even that is out the window and we’ve got E3 presentations in plain sight.
 

Perkel

Arcane
Joined
Mar 28, 2014
Messages
15,810
Somebody fill me in quickly what this Shenmue series is all about. Thanks.

Pretty fucking stoked. Loved S1 and 2 on my friend dreamcast
What is Shenmue ?

It is hard to describe really.
At its core is story based game with beat'em up elements.

Thing is those games featured most complex cities/villages at that time with shit ton of stuff to do.
I mean people were excited when they saw GTA3 city first time.
GTA3 city was joke compared to shenmue attention to detail.


As for kickstarter itself.
Suzuki says that he need to gather minimum 2mln to get money from other sources.

Basically this is same situation as Star Citizent. SC dude also needed minimum 2mln to get money from investors.
There is no Sega logo anywhere nor any copyright so it means they licensed it and they have nothing to do with it which isn't really surprising considering 2mln is probably more money than they spend on their last 5 games...

Either investors are private or this is actually Sony. Both don't want to risk money lost so they send Suzuki to poll people on this.


Looks like it will get around 10mln and if they will continue after KS maybe even 15-20mln which should make game even without investors support.
 

Damned Registrations

Furry Weeaboo Nazi Nihilist
Joined
Feb 24, 2007
Messages
14,983
To be honest I'm ambivalent about the whole publishers using KS thing. On the one hand, yeah, they don't need the money and that money might be better spent elsewhere. OTOH, however, it allows for developers to demonstrate that their game has a market even when the fucking retarded publishers/marketing guys are telling them there's no market for anything but popamole brown stubbleface simulators. If a good series (I personally couldn't give a fuck about this one but to each their own) gets revived by a publisher because kickstarter showed support, that's a good thing. And not just as a quick cash grab, but if it gets enough support, it can show that the game/series is worth a decent investment.

The other thing to consider, is that the people spending money on a franchise revival like this might not be the same people that would have spent money on a new indie project anyways, but rather people who would normally just be buying the new AAA shit. If that is the case, there's really no downside.
 

Abu Antar

Turn-based Poster
Patron
Joined
Jan 19, 2014
Messages
13,514
Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is. Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
I'm not saying this is unwelcome but isn't ryuu ga gotoku series pretty much the same thing. What's the big deal
Not really. I love the Yakuza series, but it is a lot more limited in scope than Shemnue ever was.
 

darthaegis

Cipher
Joined
Dec 27, 2014
Messages
402
Quoting a comment from someone:
Thank god! I'll never have to hear weebs begging for this game again.
Okay seriously now, is it any good? Because from what I looked up it was fucking QTE crap.
 

abnaxus

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Dec 31, 2010
Messages
10,849
Location
Fiernes
I wonder if they're going to bungle this up by not actually re-releasing the games on Steam or some shit, since NOBODY who didn't own a Dreamcast has played Shenmue, and most of today's gaming audience doesn't even know what a Dreamcast is.
Well, Shenmue 2 was on Xbox.
 

taxalot

I'm a spicy fellow.
Patron
Joined
Oct 28, 2010
Messages
9,613
Location
Your wallet.
Codex 2013 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015
To people wondering if Shenmue is any good...

The first thing you have to keep in mind is that this game used to be graphically stunning. I remember buying a cheap used Dreamcast, burning the game on CD-Rs and good grief, I had seen nothing like it even on my own computer that was decent at the time. Character models were superbly detailed, the environments rendered in details that were absolutely astounding. It was really quite something ; nowadays, that effect is a bit lost because we are used to any open world games having the kind of detail Shenmue had. Shenmue was however way ahead for a long long time. I think maybe until GTA 5, and yes, I'm serious, even if the thing ran on a Dreamcast. There's very little game mechanics in Shenmue, so the entirety of the power of the console could easily be put into graphics.

Keep also in mind that this game was supposed to come out in Saturn, and.. just look at the video below. It already looked incredible.


Next, about the gameplay, once again, context is everything. If you play Shenmue 1 for the first time now, it's possible you just see a slow paced popamole adventure game (no puzzle), with QTE and Virtua Fighter like combats and lightish RPG elements. Yes, that's all there it is to it, but that's just actually the surface of it all. When Shenmue was released, there was nothing like it. I remember a trailer describing Shenmue with "It is not a game. It is not a movie." and that's really the closest description you can use about Shenmue : neither game, nor movie.

What you do in Shenmue is progressing through a story, with a few fights and mini games for diversity's sake. It doesn't sound exceptional in 2015 when just every game follows this routine, but really, Shenmue 1 really made me feel I was witnessing a new form of storytelling. There is no other point in the game than telling the story, and the game allows you to live said story fully. : Ryo goes home one day to find his father brutally murdered by what looks like to be the Chinese mafia, but not before said father is accused by his murderer to be himself a murderer and stealing a strange mirror. The story begins in Yokosuka, with you trying to find a lead on who is this murderer and where he could have gone.

I'll be honest : what seemed like an awesome storyline back when I first played it actually now feels almost bad ; everything is centered about Kung-Fu and weird chinese culture, cliches about martial arts abound, and abound also in how it is a tale of revenge, a cycle that never ends. Add also a treasure hunt in there. Still, while not being top tier in quality, the story targets a few areas that were seldomly addressed by games before : it is set in the 1980s in Japan and China, in a real world without too much fantasy (you only witness one possible supernatural event in the entire playthrough of Shenmue 1&2), some characters are very likeable, and fuck ! It happens in a real japanese city and Hong Kong ! And then you go deeper into China ! That's just not something you do in every games !

But more than the story in itself what stood Shenmue apart is the way it is told. You can have an awful story, as long as the narration is brilliant, you'll have a good time. One example I like to quote is Portal 2. Another would definitely be Shenmue 1&2.
Shenmue 1 is slow paced, yes. You wander around a small town asking everyone questions, but that's what makes the whole thing awesome. Shenmue is incredibly zen. Ryo, the main character, knows almost everyone in town. The game has a day&night cycle, respects holidays, has weather that impacts slightly the game world and conversations. You really feel like you are there and it is an incredibly immersive experience ; talk to people and they'll gossip about each other, as days pass, couples are formed and other break up. Everyone in the game has a name, an occupation, and a schedule... Something I couldn't remember having seen since Ultima 7. And it really feels like a modern Ultima 7 in that regard : the game is filled with useless locations, NPCs and activites being put only there just so that the experience feels even more real. A small environment with such great details, so many things to be missed on a first playthrough, and a slow paced story provides an incredibly relaxing experience with a few action sequences here and there.

Shenmue 2 is different : you do leave the before mentioned town and go to Hong Kong. And oh boy, I remember it felt like visiting the damn place although only a few quarters are in, of course. You no longer know everyone, only a few NPCs, but I think most have still a schedule. Gameplay is a bit different and atmosphere is totally unlike the first game : here, it's a full fledged HK Kung Fu action movie, with mysteries and adventure bits thrown in for good measure. It's equally great, but once again, very different. It is on a much bigger scope than the first game, with its pros and cons : A less focused game that retains most of the quality of the previous one, and adds other nice traits like a much faster paced story and holy fuck, Hong Kong.

The final part of Shenmue 2 deserves to be mentioned. It is Dear Esther/contemplative gaming before anyone thought about it. Apparently, Shenmue 2 was supposed to be quite a bit longer, but the last chapters were cut. However, the final disc of Shenmue 2 still feels like an introduction to those cut chapters... And as such, final part of Shenmue 2 feels like, once again, an absolutely different game and a demo of Shenmue 3. Without spoiling much, nothing pretty much happens : you are on your way to some place in deep rural China and meet some girl with whom you engage in an incredibly well written conversation. That's the whole last disc of Shenmue 2 : walking, and talking, with once again relaxing music after all the hectic action of the first three GD ROMs ; it sounds boring, it's not. Once again, it's to be experimented before being able to exactly relate to it.

And the disc ends on a cliffhanger. What the fuck happens in the last minutes of Shenmue 2, nobody really knows. So yes, you can sort of guess why people are happy to see the third part coming around, have some answers, and see if they can keep the charm this series have than Yakuza, its so called successor hasn't (although being a very good game on its own merit).
 
Last edited:

abnaxus

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Dec 31, 2010
Messages
10,849
Location
Fiernes
There's a ton of stuff to miss in both games if you just follow the narrative. Last time I played S2 I didn't even know about the Fangmei romance.
 

ZoddGuts

Augur
Joined
Apr 15, 2013
Messages
213
IGA's Kickstarter game (the Castlevania dude) did over 5.7 Million on Kickstarter and paypal, this will easily do over 6 million.
 

Gozma

Arcane
Joined
Aug 1, 2012
Messages
2,951
I remember being mind-blown by how good Soul Calibur on DC looked
 

Perkel

Arcane
Joined
Mar 28, 2014
Messages
15,810
wellthereitis.gif

Sony is officially helping with funding and development with Shenmue 3
It was just announced by Gio Corsi during their Live from E3 Stream on twitch. It was something to gauge interest and since it hit it's goal they are officially partnering up to help fund and develop with YS Net.

I predicted this in my earlier post. I guess for minigames there will be probably something like miniwipeout or something...
 

Perkel

Arcane
Joined
Mar 28, 2014
Messages
15,810
No surprise here. Cerny and Yoshida both are fanboys of Suzuki.
 

Abu Antar

Turn-based Poster
Patron
Joined
Jan 19, 2014
Messages
13,514
Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is. Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Sony helping out shouldn't be a surprise to anyone. The game will probably need at least $10 million to have a chance of being good.

Gio Corsi is the guy at Sony that has been handling their #BuildingTheList campaign. It has resulted in Tales of hearts R for PSV and soon Yakuza 5 for PS3. I think Suikoden 2 on PSN was also part of this thing.
 

Tehdagah

Arcane
Joined
Feb 27, 2012
Messages
9,236
There's very little game mechanics in Shenmue, so the entirety of the power of the console could easily be put into graphics.

I remember a trailer describing Shenmue with "It is not a game. It is not a movie." and that's really the closest description you can use about Shenmue : neither game, nor movie.
cognitive_emotional.png
 
Last edited:

MTwolves

Educated
Joined
Jan 8, 2015
Messages
32
I pretty much agree with taxalot's take on the Shenmue series.
At the time Shenmue came out, it was really a revolutionary game.

One of the questions I have in my head is whether or not Shenmue 3 will be relevant when it comes out.
I think if Shenmue 1 or 2 came out today, not a lot of people would buy it. The gaming industry has advanced a lot since Shenmue came out, both in terms of gameplay and graphics. And player expectations have changed as well.
Will the team be successful in updating the series accordingly, in regards to gameplay and graphics or will it be a rehash of the first two games?

I guess time will see.
 

keppj0nes

Educated
Joined
May 4, 2008
Messages
77
I don't know what to think about the current habit of using kickstarter to leverage publisher support or gain attention of corporations. It seems so secretive, sketchy, dishonest. That's probably not the word for it. But you certainly don't see information on the hidden investors on the Bloodstained Kickstarter. and Sony isn't mentioned AT ALL on the Shenmue III Kickstarter.
 

As an Amazon Associate, rpgcodex.net earns from qualifying purchases.
Back
Top Bottom