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KickStarter Shroud of the Avatar - Lord British's Not-Ultima Online 2

Eggs is eggs

Learned
Joined
Mar 12, 2015
Messages
256
I don't think money was the issue. They got money from Kickstarter, they did another crowdfunding in which people got equity stakes in the company (i'm pretty sure they're mostly worthless though), the monthly begathons, the deal with the Russian publisher, RG probably put some money into it, I think they raised money from other investors as well and the game currently is on sale on Steam.

The game was poorly planned and poorly executed. The team didn't have the skill to make a game of this scope, plus so many developer resources have been diverted into cosmetics and housing that they sell for real money.
 

grimace

Arcane
Joined
Jan 17, 2015
Messages
1,959
re: Elves

They are ugly by design.


While the Elves of Novia were originally created for war by the Obsidian Order, in the centuries since many have sought to find new meaning in their lives, and have found it through finding a place of their own in nature’s order, harmonious with the land around them.


Overview
Elves are humanoids that were once human, but have been shaped by magic to become "crafted warriors" by the Obsidian Empire.

The first iteration of elves were too aggressive and of limited intellect. The next refinement provided the elves improved eyesight and enhanced reflexes, as well as a mind for tactics. They were intelligent enough to be useful to command small groups of other creatures, but were independent and prone to abandoning their posts and fleeing the army, or even forming cells and attacking their former comrades.

The elves that survived the fall of the Obsidians call themselves Vertas, and live deep within the Forsaken Vale.

Lore
Elves were created during the Obsidian Wars by Obsidian Sorcerers as powerful chaotic leaders with very destructive tendencies. They were created as tools to dominate the natural world and the creatures within it. When the Obsidian cause failed, all of the creatures created by these Obsidian Sorcerers became leaderless, wandered away, and were mostly driven to extinction. Few survive today, and those that do find themselves hunted and hated.

In the intervening two hundred years since the Obsidian Wars, some elves, specifically those known as Vertas Elves, have reemerged with a new outlook on life, somehow they have turned over a new leaf, and found new purpose in life. These elves, while just as smart and powerful as their historic cousins, are masters of their own fate. While still often shunned or hated, they work to improve their own lives and come to peace with their warmongering past.

Outlanders that manifest in New Britannia, often take on a familiar human form, though many have noted their new Avatar manifestation differs significantly from their home world form. It is not uncommon to be taller, shorter, thinner or wider when an Outlander manifests in New Britannia. Even a change of gender is common when an Avatar manifests.

Rarely, very rarely, for reasons yet unknown, human Outlanders may manifest as Elves in New Britannia. So few such Outlanders exist, that any Elf claiming such heritage is likely to be disbelieved.
http://sotawiki.net/sota/Elves
 

InD_ImaginE

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Aug 23, 2015
Messages
5,367
Pathfinder: Wrath
MMO lives or dies by hype, especially in 2018.

Game is pretty much dead. Ultima veterans that have working braincells knows how barebone the game is. Its nearly impossible to market the game to newer audience either due to lackluster presentation/graphics. It can't really cash in on nostalgic MMO feels like WoW classic either.
 

ADL

Prophet
Joined
Oct 23, 2017
Messages
3,682
Location
Nantucket
The game's biggest fault is an over reliance on store bought assets with absolutely zero regard for a baseline level of quality or consistency in the world. Walk into a town and you'll see a druid tree house in a desert. A steampunk ship (Star Citizen collaboration) across from a castle in a viking village. Chinese architecture in medieval towns. I know why they did it but it's frustrating that they couldn't see the easiest way to design around the world while maintaining a level of coherency.

What should have been done is backers should've had the ability to select a biome/region-locked house for their respective pledge level and the storefront should have been sorted by region/biome. It would've been a little more effort but at least the world wouldn't be a cluster fuck where I'm just seeing an urban sprawl of whatever shit they could buy off the Asset Store.
 

Aildrik

Savant
Joined
Sep 10, 2014
Messages
159
What should have been done is backers should've had the ability to select a biome/region-locked house for their respective pledge level and the storefront should have been sorted by region/biome. It would've been a little more effort but at least the world wouldn't be a cluster fuck where I'm just seeing an urban sprawl of whatever shit they could buy off the Asset Store.

That is crazy talk. I would only expect features like that in a game that had at least a few years of development time and millions of dollars of budget.
 

grimace

Arcane
Joined
Jan 17, 2015
Messages
1,959
The game's biggest fault is an over reliance on store bought assets with absolutely zero regard for a baseline level of quality or consistency in the world. Walk into a town and you'll see a druid tree house in a desert. A steampunk ship (Star Citizen collaboration) across from a castle in a viking village. Chinese architecture in medieval towns. I know why they did it but it's frustrating that they couldn't see the easiest way to design around the world while maintaining a level of coherency.

What should have been done is backers should've had the ability to select a biome/region-locked house for their respective pledge level and the storefront should have been sorted by region/biome. It would've been a little more effort but at least the world wouldn't be a cluster fuck where I'm just seeing an urban sprawl of whatever shit they could buy off the Asset Store.

The game's story tackles the idea of OUTLANDERS entering New Britannia thru Moongates/Lunar Rifts and NPCs upset that they don't respect the traditions of the regions.

So the mismatched art styles of homes in towns/cities fits in with the lore. That's part of the sandbox. You can only control your part of the sandbox. Ugly decorations to grief your neighbors is a core mechanic.
 

The Avatar

Pseudodragon Studios
Developer
Joined
Jan 15, 2016
Messages
336
Location
The United States of America
My expectations are completely different for single player and multiplayer games. They tried to have both and failed at both. It might have been half-decent if they choose to make a single player(maybe with co-op) game in the tradition of the old Ultimas, but I guess they would have never raised the money that they did for that.
 

Aildrik

Savant
Joined
Sep 10, 2014
Messages
159
In watching some of the interviews with Garriott, especially the recent game dev con where they talked about the virtual ecosystem in UO that the players wrecked, I am more and more convinced he has severe developer ADD. The guy thinks and dreams big, but needs a team of people to focus him properly. I think that is why the older Ultimas were more fondly remembered. He had big ideas but they were more constrained by the limits of what could be done with the tech. Once those limits began to really be lifted he had a hard time not chasing squirrels in every directions versus actually producing a coherent and fun game.
 

lophiaspis

Arbiter
Joined
Oct 24, 2012
Messages
379
My expectations are completely different for single player and multiplayer games. They tried to have both and failed at both. It might have been half-decent if they choose to make a single player(maybe with co-op) game in the tradition of the old Ultimas, but I guess they would have never raised the money that they did for that.

On the contrary, the promise of a single player Ultima successor was the most attractive Kickstarter proposition, so much that they used it as a scam hook for their shitty P2W MMO. Just like Roberts with the idea of a WC successor, hmmm I'm seeing a pattern here?

It really seems like working with EA will rob you not just of your company but your very soul. That publisher has a knack for turning wide-eyed idealistic designers into cynical Korean mobster style scammers. Molyneux, Garriott, Roberts...
 

Eggs is eggs

Learned
Joined
Mar 12, 2015
Messages
256
I don't think they had a clear idea of what the game would be during kickstarter. Or maybe if they did they just kept saying things and adding stretch goals to get as much money from people as possible, rather than help facilitate the proper development of the game.

Honestly it seems like most games that blow up during the kickstarter and beat their initial goals by huge amounts just start adding random stretch goals without really thinking them through to keep that $$$ rolling in and then deal with the consequences of it later.

I mean have they implemented any of these stretch goals?

$1.1 million: Pet system
$1.2 million: Seasonal weather
$1.4 million: Taming
$1.6 million: Shipping lanes open for business + new island content set
$1.7 million: Dynamic and contested resource nodes
$2 million: Players take over the world! Castles and PvP siege content

Some other ones they have like the Denis Loubet cover, interview with Spoony, Iolo making a song, Tracey Hickman novel...i.e. anything not game related seems to have been completed.
 
Last edited:

taxalot

I'm a spicy fellow.
Patron
Joined
Oct 28, 2010
Messages
9,613
Location
Your wallet.
Codex 2013 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/20...g-spend-hundreds-thousands-living-video-game/

Scroll down and you'll see a familiar face, eventually.

The 47-year-old, who runs trading website markeedragon.com, has been involved in RMT since its genesis, profiting from the transformation of an unregulated trading market into a multi-billion dollar industry, then losing tens of thousands when the developers of the various games he was making money from clamped down on the system.

His rollercoaster career as an online goods merchant; trading in top of the line spaceships, high-end real estate, gold and rare trinkets in the virtual world, has encompassed the high of making his first million to the lows of filing for bankruptcy, twice, losing $250,000 (£189,000) in one day and being hit with a $6m (£4.5m) lawsuit from video game giant Blizzard Entertainment."
 

Eggs is eggs

Learned
Joined
Mar 12, 2015
Messages
256
Oh I thought that Markee Dragon was just a superfan of Ultima and LB. Didn't know he had a business selling all this online crap. That does explain a lot.
 

Infinitron

I post news
Staff Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
97,236
Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
I am too lazy to link, but you will all be happy to hear that funding for Episode 2 has started. Buy items on the store and maybe they'll afford putting ridables horses in the game.

There's now an optional $9 monthly subscription ("Rewards Program") as well: https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/?page_id=77345

Earn the best rate on purchasing Gold Crowns, AND receive rare stretch-goal items from our monthly livestreams by joining the Shroud of the Avatar Rewards Program! Subscribe now for these recurring monthly rewards and more.

~Milk it to the limit (the limittttt)~
 

grimace

Arcane
Joined
Jan 17, 2015
Messages
1,959


Imagine marketing your music through SOTA.
Though at this point I'm not even sure what to think anymore. It's just another oddity.


Shooter Jennings loves Ultima games and backed Shroud of the Avatar early. He moved into a town that my guild resides in. I've played with Shooter and attended his in game premiere for the album Countach.

I had fun. Other players had fun too.





https://youtu be/JYqabdnKy0I

See track 6."Chase" (featuring Richard Garriott de Cayeux) ... you'll love to hate it
 

taxalot

I'm a spicy fellow.
Patron
Joined
Oct 28, 2010
Messages
9,613
Location
Your wallet.
Codex 2013 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015
Yeah, I'm also uninstalling. I think I'm pretty done. And I haven't "actually" properly completed Episode 1.

I will give the game a second pass, in many, many years when it has reached its conclusion in Offline mode.

IF it ever gets to that point.

Maybe it will be time to review it again ?
 

grimace

Arcane
Joined
Jan 17, 2015
Messages
1,959
I mean, if anyone still had any doubt if this was a game or just a medieval Second Life clone...

Role playing in a computer simulation. Some people want this. Did you believe Shroud of the Avatar was going to be something different than this? From day one kickstarter there were "unique" rewards and "rare" items available to pledgers only.

Maybe it will be time to review it again ?

It's your choice if you wish to re-visit the game whenever episode "launches". (Whatever "launch" means to Portalarium.)

This thing is an abomination. I will keep saying it:

No full-loot, open PvP = Dead on Arrival.

What game today offers full loot PVP with a single, persistent server?

World of Warcraft (as I've read) has adopted an opt-in PVP mechanic like SotA has.
 

funkadelik

Arcane
Joined
Jul 30, 2010
Messages
1,496
This thing is an abomination. I will keep saying it:

No full-loot, open PvP = Dead on Arrival.

What game today offers full loot PVP with a single, persistent server?

World of Warcraft (as I've read) has adopted an opt-in PVP mechanic like SotA has.
Mortal Online does. Darkfall did. The original Ultima Online did and it still has more players than this new "Ultima" does, especially if you account for private shards.
 

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