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Skyrim,worth it?

Sigourn

uooh afficionado
Joined
Feb 6, 2016
Messages
5,659
Addictive?How exactly? I saw some stuff and seems like you just talk to people Take a long walk,go into linear dungeons and kill zombies.But the combat looks awful and with no exploration at all, i don't see a motivation to play.

There is something else to the game or its just a button masher?

That's how addictions work. Your description of Skyrim is spot-on, but that didn't stop me for playing the game for 600 hours, because again it is a very addictive game. Requiem makes it a much better game, but still is a shit RPG, though with more interesting combat.
 

Neki

Scholar
Joined
Jul 30, 2016
Messages
145
Got the Requiem mod and Project optimization.

Will give my 2 cents later.
 

Cadmus

Arcane
Joined
Dec 28, 2013
Messages
4,264
Got this game from a friend...
She dosen't know much about videogames.

I liked daggerfall and morrowind,Oblivion made me want to go play gothic instead.
Never played Skyrim but heard a lot of things about it.Its more like oblivion or morrowind?

Can I get at least some fun out of it?
Short version:
Vanilla game is much better than Oblivion and noticeably better than Morrowind's expansions, so are the expansions or at least Dragonborn. So, yes, although not nearly as much fun as from vanilla Morrowind, and there is some mechanical dumbing down involved.
With the right selection of mods - mainly Requiem (requires Dawnguard expansion, SKSE and a new game), 3DNPCs and DCO - to correct its most glaring shortcomings it becomes downright excellent.

Long version:
Nah, can't be arsed to write it. Search this subforum with my nick and you should find some fairly comprehensive write-up, otherwise you might try pestering me in this thread (bring bribes).
DraQ strikes again. You have some disability that makes you unable to critically look at Skyrim which is fine, but you should avoid hurting other people because of it.

Short version: there is not a single thing better than Morrowind in the vanilla Skyrim. One might be tempted to say the presentation is but then one should remember the voice actors, the music, the performance, the art direction, written dialogues, etc. It's got more polygons, that's all.
Re: some mechanical dumbing down
he means there are no stats, there's an arrowing leading you all the way through the game, the UI is unusable, the quests are retarded, level scaling...

It's not dumbed down, it's made for fucking retards, there's a difference.

Now onto the mods: ask any fucktard Skyrim lover about the mods you should use to keep the game from becoming a retarded colourful rollercoaster while fixing the innate flaws of the game design and you will get a different answer from fucking everyone. No, it's not a simple 5-6 mods because soon you'll start seeing through the cracks and see the game is designed to be shit and it's really difficult to mod that away. So you'll search for more mods to keep you entertained and then they'll start crashing the shit engine and then you'll quit after hundreds of hours of fucking around inside and outside the game instead of actually playing it the way it's meant to be played, because that's impossible.

By the way, I still don't understand why people say it's addictive. It's fucking boring and repetitive. I don't see anything addictive about that.
 

Sigourn

uooh afficionado
Joined
Feb 6, 2016
Messages
5,659
Here's an objective analysis of every single element of Skyrim that comes to mind:

- Story: it's crap, stupid, cliched, and doesn't manage to convey the sense of urgency DRAGONS FUCKING SHIT UP LEFT AND RIGHT should convey. Not to mention you never see any dragons fucking shit up, whereas in Morrowind at least you encounter people who have lost people to the Blight.
- Quests: repetitive and boring as hell "go here, kill that, retrieve this". I'm not even talking radiant quests, but actual quests that may as well be radiant quests due to their simplicity. Oh, and you must play with quest markers because otherwise most are impossible to complete thanks to the lack of instructions
- Factions: borderline fan-faction in every case except Dark Brotherhood, which could have been better but it's still stained by the rest of the mediocre faction questlines. Also: faction jobs are radiant quests. Enjoy stealing the same three items from every house in Skyrim.
- Combat: boring and dumbed down compared to Morrowind. I mean it.*
- Dialogue: terrible, the NPCs treat you like a player constantly and not like an actual human being.

In the end, Skyrim's real pros over Morrowind are the graphics, the animations, the music and the sounds. That's literally it, because everything else comes at the expense of something (like characters being voiced by 20 people tops, and dialogue being really short). And when you think about how a faithful Morrowind remake would have much better graphics, animations, sounds, and music selection, Skyrim is really a product of its time and not a product of creativity.

*here's an exercise: imagine you are playing Skyrim with Morrowind's graphics and animations. Now tell me what you really like about Skyrim's combat: the mindless button spamming, or the nice graphics and animations.
 

Commissar Draco

Codexia Comrade Colonel Commissar
Patron
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Messages
20,856
Location
Привислинский край
Insert Title Here Strap Yourselves In Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Divinity: Original Sin 2
To What those two gentleman above have said: :bro::obviously:

Things I liked in Skyrim:

1 Skyrim having some distinct character not Renaissance Fair in England aka Cirodil in Oblivion.
2 General Tulius and Imperial Legion like from Morrowind only more Grim Dark not those fracking Knights in plate armor from Oblivion.
3 Geremy Soule soundtrack a bit too bombastic at the moment but again above the forgettable one from Oblivion.
4 Obviously not being Oblivion.

All except above is shit and huge :decline: compared to both Dagerfall and Morrowind.
 

Carrion

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jun 30, 2011
Messages
3,648
Location
Lost in Necropolis
I kind of agree on what DraQ is saying, as Skyrim is indeed a massive improvement over Oblivion in many ways, but at the same time I can't really recommend it. It does resurrect some of the more interesting elements of Morrowind's lore, brings back politics, has much better writing and world-building than Oblivion, even the simplified character system has its merits etc. etc., and I suppose that it manages to do what it tries to do adequately enough. In many ways Oblivion was like Morrowind except diluted with piss (lots of piss), whereas Skyrim drops all the signs of pretense and embraces its aRPG nature and the fact that it's mainly a game about killing things. In general this makes it better than Oblivion, even though it initially comes off as dumbing down the game even further. Still, at the end of the day playing it just kind of feels like a chore because it's so streamlined in many places, so heavily focused on crawling in linear dungeons and so devoid of actually interesting content.

While the writing is at times decent (by Bethesda standards), pretty much every storyline in the game is irredeemable shit where you're the Chosen One and have to find ancient artifacts because of reasons and blah blah blah. Every NPC is provided with a Bethesdavoice actor that speaks with a fake Scandinavian accent that makes you want to put a broadsword through its skull the moment you meet it, regardless of what it actually has to say. Quests have even less variety than before, and the guild questlines are a joke because every single one of them essentially comes down to just killing draugr like every other quest in the game, making it pointless to try to actually play a thief or an assassin or a mage, especially when those questlines are like two hours long each. You do get to do some Radiant Questsif you want to, but really, why would you? Whenever the game tries to do a quest that does something original or unconventional, it instantly collapses under its own stupidity (see the big Markarth side quests, the Windhelm murder mystery, or pretty much anything involving the Thieves Guild, for example).

The magic system is completely castrated, with pretty much all of the interesting forms of manipulating the game world removed. It's mostly just about shooting lightning and fireballs, i.e. the stuff you get to do in every RPG ever, and even though you can shoot lightning and fireballs in more varied ways than you could in Oblivion, it's still generic as fuck and massive disappointment compared to the more complete system of Morrowind. The perk system does arguably make specialization more important than before, which is certainly a good thing, but with the removal of attributes it still comes off as a really shallow system considering that in the past nearly everything you did in TES was governed by a stat or two or three. The dungeons have their moments, and there are some that are actually pretty good (even some of the more linear ones provide a nice amount of combat options), but the linear layouts, repetitive "puzzles" and certain over-used enemy types make all of them seem pretty much the same after a certain point. The combat system is functional but, as vanilla, doesn't provide enough depth to carry the game, especially when the combat AI is nonexistent and the HP mechanics are all sorts of fucked up. In the end you'll just find yourself working on autopilot, picking up a quest and entering a dungeon and clearing the dungeon and returning to the questgiver and receiving the reward and moving on to the next quest without giving a shit about what it is that you're actually doing or what happens to all these people or the game world.

Upon realizing this I tried to go on a murder spree and kill the world, but the first hobo I attacked turned out to be immortal, so that was the end of that scheme.

Personally I never found the strength to try out Requiem (partly because it requires Dawnguard, and because I had already become bored out of my skull when trying out other, probably inferior mods), but I could see it making the game fun for a while, increasing the lethality and the survival aspect of the game and making the dungeon crawling more enjoyable as a result. After all, dungeon crawling is the game, and outside that and the exploration there really is no meaningful content in the game. Whether the game is worth it or not probably comes down to your enjoyment of that kind of stuff.
 

sullynathan

Arcane
Joined
Dec 22, 2015
Messages
6,473
Location
Not Europe
I have put 200 hrs into this game over 2 platforms. It isn't great mechanically, but you'll put a lot of hours into it especially with mods.
 

Konjad

Patron
Joined
Nov 3, 2007
Messages
4,054
Location
Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Skyrim is one of the most boring games ever. Oblivion at least gave a rage fueled adrenaline boost fun and something to post on Codex. Skyrim, on the other hand, is just so bland and contentless that there's literally nothing to feel anything about (except dumb dialogues) and write about. It's like staring at the wall. Don't bother with it even for free, it's just crap. There are better open world cRPGs.
 

Black

Arcane
Joined
May 8, 2007
Messages
1,872,647
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Makabb

Arcane
Shitposter Bethestard
Joined
Sep 19, 2014
Messages
11,753
At this point i would wait for the special edition to play
 

Makabb

Arcane
Shitposter Bethestard
Joined
Sep 19, 2014
Messages
11,753
Skyrim is one of the most boring games ever. Oblivion at least gave a rage fueled adrenaline boost fun and something to post on Codex. Skyrim, on the other hand, is just so bland and contentless that there's literally nothing to feel anything about (except dumb dialogues) and write about. It's like staring at the wall. Don't bother with it even for free, it's just crap. There are better open world cRPGs.


but graphics
 

Miner Arobar

Educated
Joined
May 28, 2015
Messages
64
What Draq said. Worth it, if you liked Daggerfall and Morrowind AND the general TES setting. Worldbuilding, lore is miles ahead of Oblivion. Dungeons are a bit linear but designed with much greater care than in Oblivion: bandit lairs actually look like bandit lairs, etc. Undead tombs are a bit repetitive but some dungeons (Dwemer) are very well done.

Main non-moddable drawback is faction questlines: there's too few of them, pacing is way too fast, and one of them is a bit incomprehensible (Mages Guild). Enough miscellaneous quests and sightseeing to keep you busy, though. Main quest is alright: not up to par with Morrowind's, but it does involve some gray morality (e.g. siding with the all-too-fanatical Blades or with the Greybeards who are all too comfortable with the whole end of the world thing), a number of points where you have good in-game justification to put things off for a while and train/adventure, etc.

Use Requiem: character development becomes much more interesting with perks that actually matter. Stamina matters enormously. Health does not regenerate without spells, advanced perks, etc. Getting hit with a sword will likely kill you, as it should - but your sword will really hurt the other guy as well if you get the first hit in, so there's no whaling away at HP sponges.

If you use Requiem, the first quest dungeon is pretty murderous so you'll need to put that off until level is well past 10 or so. Alternate Start mod may help in making early game pacing feel more natural.
 

Neki

Scholar
Joined
Jul 30, 2016
Messages
145
Started playing,The intro looks like a less retarded version of FO3,Still long and unskippable,Do i have to endure all of that shit every time i want to Reroll a character?
I don't get to choose a class,But i found 3 rocks with a mage,figther and thief drawings Are those the classes?

I did the main quest For a while,but stopped after being told to kill more zombies.
Did some side quests,And to give credit where credit is due some of them were actually good,But the lack of retroactivity hurt my feelings.

Looks like i'm playing with 4 differnt characters

A Living dragonkiller legend

A sneaky thief who steal without been seen for the thieves guild

A Sneaky assassin for the brotherhood

And a motherfucking dual axe wielding beserker war hero

I had most fun with random encounters that with some quests,The game has a lot of wasted potential.
 
Joined
Mar 27, 2013
Messages
277
Location
Austin, TX
The game is wasted potential to the scale of Fallout 4.

It is a great game, but only if you can appreciate what little story there is. The main quests take maybe 10-15 hours with speedwalking, and I liked the 2nd half of the story. Dawnguard was alright too.

Everything has to be modded for it to be worthwhile, but in the end it can be a great sandbox rpg with a better FPS combat/graphics combination than anything I've played.

I don't see what's so great about the Requiem mod, but be sure to increase level scaling, walk speed, and I loved the SKYPE perks mod.

It's true that to mod it takes longer than to enjoy it. I definitely spent more time modding than playing (at least 150 hours).

List of things that suck:
-Magic
-Itemization
-NPC Faces
-Dragon combat variation
-Civil War depth in story and gameplay
-Perks
-Music
-Voice Acting
-Dialogue
-Monster variation
-Insane hand-holding
-Movespeed
-Short story length
-Choice and consequence
-Lack of nudity

The worst part, by far, is that somehow there are no good quest mods over 10 hours long. It's the most popularly modded RPG game by far, with a built-in editor, and no one can give the game a deep story to make it a really worthwhile experience. It's the biggest fail by rpg fans ever, as it was the perfect time to do it.
 

pippin

Guest
I played Skyrim for a few hours a couple of years ago and I can say it's noticeable it was done with more care than Oblivion, and even Fallout 3. Out of all the post Morrowind products Bethesda has released, Skyrim is the one they cared for the most, easily.

This is an objective opinion, since I don't care about Bethesda enough to consider myself a fan of their games, even though I love Morrowind.
 
Joined
Aug 5, 2009
Messages
3,749
Location
Moo?
Every time I start up any Bethesda game post Morrowind, Fallout or Elder Scrolls, I wonder what's wrong with dropping someone off with a minimum of introduction and letting them discover things at their own pace.


It took Obsidian all of one game to realize that was a good idea. "Hey, you got shot and that sucks. Could you answer a couple of questions for me? Thanks. Here you can have my old Pip Boy and some supplies to help you on your way. Victor is the one who dug you up. He's...you'll probably figure out who Victor is."
 

roll-a-die

Magister
Joined
Sep 27, 2009
Messages
3,131
It's basically, erm, how do I say it. It's like they forgot how to write and design the games that they did well prior to Oblivion. Skyrim was a step back in the right direction, but Skyrim still feels about 5 steps off track from something like Morrowind or Daggerfall.

Part of that magic of Morrowind and Daggerfall, was basically, it dropped you in, told you the bare minimum of what you had to do(And in the case of Daggerfall sometimes lied to you.) And were just left to be. That was really important to establishing the YOU in-game, as an entity. You didn't need to feel a connection too Smitty the gate guard who helped process your paperwork, in the grand scheme, he was utterly unimportant, sure a side quest or two might cause you to talk to him. Whereas in both Skyrim and Oblivion, Smitty the guard becomes an unnecessary attempt at causing emotion. With the redguard from the sewers following you around for the entire game. And Hadvar/Other Smitty basically trying to forge an emotional connection with the whole, "FOLLOW ME PRISONER." "WE'RE ESCAPING HADVAR!"


Basically, with Daggerfall and Morrowind they didn't try and assume emotions onto you. They just made the stories and let the player experience the thing forming their own opinions along the way. It's what makes Dagoth Ur such a good villain, and Alduin, Mannimarco(Oblivion MG and ESO), and Molag Bal fall completely flat. That sense that they are trying to make you feel something, that their writers are only halfway portraying. Whereas Dagoth Ur had a story, motivations, goals, etc. But ultimately understood the fate of he and his. Azura would reap her due, and there was little he could do to stop it. He would take solace in the fact that the others who fell by the blade of his killer were his foes. And even respect the creature who killed him.


But you weren't forced to learn this, you the player, weren't forced to draw into question your characters agency, by having the camera basically forced onto choices that didn't really matter. You weren't given these moments that attempted to preach to you the player, trying to give you the player, agency. Instead you were given moments to actuallize you the character, trying to give, you the character agency. It's a line bethesda walked very well prior to the arrival of Oblivion. They have swapped from very heavily character focused RPG's to very Player focused ARPG's.
 

Carrion

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jun 30, 2011
Messages
3,648
Location
Lost in Necropolis
Every time I start up any Bethesda game post Morrowind, Fallout or Elder Scrolls, I wonder what's wrong with dropping someone off with a minimum of introduction and letting them discover things at their own pace.
Nowadays it's the industry standard that the game has to "grab you" right from the start. Regardless of the genre you'll almost always have to suffer through these long, linear and action-packed sequences that are basically just glorified tutorials, because otherwise the players might get bored by the lack of action and overwhelmed by the amount of freedom given to them.

Of course, the actual effect is often the opposite, as the early-game hand-holding is usually immensely boring for any reasonably experienced player, and the tutorials tend to turn into these godawful info dumps that are probably harder to digest than discovering the same things gradually by yourself while playing the game.
 

pippin

Guest
I think they do that to create a mood, especially now in the youtube age. The game has to have something "awesome" in its early stages so they can show it in marketing meetings and youtube let's plays. Imagine trying to sell a game where the guy playing it can't figure out what to do (which is way worse than losing).
 
Joined
Aug 5, 2009
Messages
3,749
Location
Moo?
But that's supposed to be part of the charm! You think I had any idea what I was doing the first time I played Morrowind? Prior to that my only free-roaming experiences were the latter half of some JRPGs (Star Ocean, Chrono Trigger, the entirety of Sage Frontier fuck yeah etc) and Grand Theft Auto.

My first character performed a running battle with Seyda Neen's guards, jumping from house to house killing the inhabitants and swiping whatever might be useful. The end came when I found out the guards weren't impressed by a scroll of Summon Skeleton, and I only had one scroll left. Almsivi's Intervention. I hoped it would be a shield or another summon or a powerful offensive spell. Nope. Teleported to Vivec, about three feet from an Ordinator. Who somehow knew everything I'd done. Fight to the de-*Thud* My second character I got lost exploring some of the islands and died in an Ancestral Tomb because nothing I had affected these fucking ghosts.



Now you have this nice, compact starter dungeon with plenty of eye candy and a guide who explains how everything works.


HYPa8dR.jpg



That's cute.
 
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Neki

Scholar
Joined
Jul 30, 2016
Messages
145
The stormcloaks won the war...
So what?It doesen't make a fucking difference im still am the petty thief despite being a godamm war hero.
Also what diference does it make who wins the war?
 

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