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Someone decent at statistics needed -- help debunk Lhynn's claim

Norfleet

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The problem with attempting statistical analysis on the distribution of 4d6 rolls is that, frankly, d6 are only an approximation of randomness if you roll naively and/or disinterestedly. I can tell you right now that for a skilled dice shooter, it's not exactly difficult to get results like that, not merely frequently, but quite consistently and specifically. I know this because I've done it. If this is being rolled with physical dice, the way it should be, rolling dice is a skill, one that gets me kicked out of casinos.

Getting tht coveted 00 is way harder, d10 are far less controllable than d6es and often backfire, and even a newbie can control a d4. 'swhy I played thieves and wizards, all about that d6/d4 action. A typical fighter will average 5.5 HP a level, and swing a longsword for a base of 4.5 damage. But thieves (now rogues) do everything with d6ses, my specialty...you figure it out.
 

Lhynn

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The problem with attempting statistical analysis on the distribution of 4d6 rolls is that, frankly, d6 are only an approximation of randomness if you roll naively and/or disinterestedly. I can tell you right now that for a skilled dice shooter, it's not exactly difficult to get results like that, not merely frequently, but quite consistently and specifically. I know this because I've done it. If this is being rolled with physical dice, the way it should be, rolling dice is a skill, one that gets me kicked out of casinos.

Getting tht coveted 00 is way harder, d10 are far less controllable than d6es and often backfire, and even a newbie can control a d4. 'swhy I played thieves and wizards, all about that d6/d4 action. A typical fighter will average 5.5 HP a level, and swing a longsword for a base of 4.5 damage. But thieves (now rogues) do everything with d6ses, my specialty...you figure it out.
Eh, not sure, maybe on an unconscious level, i did/do always get good rolls when im invested on a throw. And i did play a ton, so that if it could be considered a skill i would have gotten good at it.

I never really treated it as luck, or even as a skill tho, just me asserting a sort of dominance on the dice, i just call the throw and roll. I often tempted death without fear, like exposing myself to ST without regard for my own safety, just to make a point or intimidate someone. and to my recollection i have never failed a saving throw against death (cpt that one time my second character got killed by a statue falling on top of him and the time a wail of an actual banshee got him dead).

And i did have a favorite d4, with which i could throw unbroken chains of 4s for my magic missile. My record with that one were 5 straight castings of the lvl 9 version that did max damage. But tbh ive played pnp for over what is it, 14 years now? Ive seen crap you wouldnt believe on the dice, ive seen players miss hits for several stories on a row. i once met a fighter that couldnt land a hit in 5 stories straight in a hack and slash campaign. I find it extremely fun, and make it a point to remember them because its silly.

Like there was this one time i was playing with my wizard, and some legendary mage slayer comes over to threaten me. I fireball him, the DM laughs and rolls magic resistance, i do damage. The dude a bit wary backs off but still tries to intimidate me, i fireball his dumb face yet again, he rolls and fails, eat 10D6 again. Thats it, the dude cant take it anymore and he charges at me, another fireball, placed behind him so it doesnt hit me, he rolls yet again. fails. At this point the dude clearly couldnt take it anymore and felt he had miscalculated greatly, he apologizes, swears he wont bother me again, gets on his horse and leaves, probably thinking his biggest weapon against magic was useless against mine.
In theory he was supposed to capture me and take me to a some wizard organization that was "recruiting" talent for a war. In the end i did go there on my own because well, thats where the campaign was taking place.
He later confessed me that the mage slayer had a MR of 90%.

Ive played/DMed over 300 sessions (by my arguably iffy calculations, a lot more than that), lost track a long time ago, shit like this is bound to happen, and you are bound to remember it because of how strange it is.

I get off numbers too but this fucking thread doesn't deserve this much effort.
Its a thread started by crispy about some random character with good rolls, what were you expecting.
 

King Crispy

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"Some random character with good rolls" yet you continue to regale us with your tales of stupendous, incredible, otherworldly feats with die rolls, over and over and over again.

Whether it's 18/00 18 18 15 15 18 or whether it's natural 20's simultaneously or whether it's defeating 90% magic resistance three times in a row... does it, will it ever stop, Lhynn?

I'm not the one doing this to you, man. You're doing it to yourself. I'm merely reacting.

Actually, at this point, I'm just laughing.
 

Lhynn

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I actually cant believe you guys havent witnessed freak streaks much like my own.
 

King Crispy

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Streaks I can understand. I've seen horror stories on blackjack tables in Tahoe and Vegas myself. Randomness happens.

But what shouldn't happen is someone like you who makes all these wild claims (some of which could even be valid), then, when called out on them, has to be strapped down onto an examination table, injected with sodium pentothal, water tortured, dissected, examined, then finally just asked politely, to tell the truth, finally to let slip out a slight little detail such as the fact that your DM let you re-roll 1's when you didn't like them. Didn't you think that was worth mentioning, like maybe the second time you bragged about that character in Shoutbox and before I decided to make this thread?

That characterization of you earlier was right on: you're just like that one kid who always had to be at the center of attention (which in itself isn't an unforgivable sin -- I should know) but felt he was forced to lie or exaggerate everything he ever did in order to get that attention. "I've done that before." "My character had all 18's once." "LOL I beat a god haven't you?"

If you can't see how other people are just going to roll their eyes at claims like those, especially knowing your deceptive nature now, then it's no wonder you can't believe it when others... can't believe you.

You're out of touch with reality and you bend the truth and facts to suit your needs.
 

Gregz

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Beyond now being officially known as Codex' most ravenous munchkin, for reasons blindingly apparent ITT, you've also been caught basically lying and exhibiting behavior...

Crispy is right, Codex needs a "ravenous munchkin" tag.

Someone tag the tag-makers!
 

Lhynn

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But what shouldn't happen is someone like you who makes all these wild claims (some of which could even be valid), then, when called out on them, has to be strapped down onto an examination table, injected with sodium pentothal, water tortured, dissected, examined, then finally just asked politely, to tell the truth, finally to let slip out a slight little detail such as the fact that your DM let you re-roll 1's when you didn't like them. Didn't you think that was worth mentioning, like maybe the second time you bragged about that character in Shoutbox and before I decided to make this thread?
What kind of a delusional cunt would expect me to remember the homebrew rules of a character that i created probably 9 years ago under a DM i havent played with in 8.

That characterization of you earlier was right on: you're just like that one kid who always had to be at the center of attention
Theres just one attention whore here, and it aint me.

but felt he was forced to lie or exaggerate everything he ever did in order to get that attention. "I've done that before." "My character had all 18's once." "LOL I beat a god haven't you?"
I have exagerated nothing, and what kind of story do you want me to share? that time i beat a CR apropiate encounter? that time i got an exceptionally high roll on my pick locks and got a bit of extra treasure?

If you can't see how other people are just going to roll their eyes at claims like those, especially knowing your deceptive nature now, then it's no wonder you can't believe it when others... can't believe you.
My deceptive nature? like i would need to lie on a shitty forum on the internet about my old pnp experiences.

You're out of touch with reality
Whut? the fuck you talking about old man, we are discussing a game and you are talking like a nonsensical idiot.

and you bend the truth and facts to suit your needs.
And my needs are? you do realize you imbecile that we wouldnt be here if it wasnt for you? Ive known womans that are stupid and hard to deal with, but you take the fucking cake crispy.
 

Lhynn

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:lol:

I've got you frothing at the mouth, now.
I really dont get you. You say retarded shit, you have people correcting you and somehow they are the idiots?
what kind of fucked up logic is that?
 

Ninjerk

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:lol:

I've got you frothing at the mouth, now.
I really dont get you. You say retarded shit, you have people correcting you and somehow they are the idiots?
what kind of fucked up logic is that?
Pretend you're him and had the life he has had and then think about whether calling someone on bullshitting about PnP almost a decade ago seems like one of life's little victories.
 

Night Goat

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On the part of his high stats, some people are smart enough to realize that if a campaign allows casters, no matter how high the fighters attributes are (within racial boundaries), it wont make much of a difference.
Aren't you the guy who keeps saying that AD&D is so much better than 3e because the classes are balanced?
But what shouldn't happen is someone like you who makes all these wild claims (some of which could even be valid), then, when called out on them, has to be strapped down onto an examination table, injected with sodium pentothal, water tortured, dissected, examined, then finally just asked politely, to tell the truth, finally to let slip out a slight little detail such as the fact that your DM let you re-roll 1's when you didn't like them. Didn't you think that was worth mentioning, like maybe the second time you bragged about that character in Shoutbox and before I decided to make this thread?
What kind of a delusional cunt would expect me to remember the homebrew rules of a character that i created probably 9 years ago under a DM i havent played with in 8.
If you remember trivial shit like the time you rolled max damage on magic missiles five times in a row, why shouldn't you be expected to remember something much more important like house rules?
 

Lhynn

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On the part of his high stats, some people are smart enough to realize that if a campaign allows casters, no matter how high the fighters attributes are (within racial boundaries), it wont make much of a difference.
Aren't you the guy who keeps saying that AD&D is so much better than 3e because the classes are balanced?
Aye, but casters only need 1 stat to work, warrior classes need 3 to excel, you do have spells like sleep or charm person, that can completely break a low level campaign. But a mage is essentially dead on 1 hit and he can only outperform in 1 fight at level 1, so those counter points balance the game fairly well. Also lets remember casting times, and that anything can interrupt a spell without any sort of check. Magic isnt as convenient as in future editions either, spells arent cheap, and stuff like stone skin can literally ruin an entires group economy, or literally kill them slowly, like haste. Being a mage wasnt easy in AD&D, and getting to the higher levels was truly a feat (with any class really, but moreso with a mage), and im proud mine got there.

If you remember trivial shit like the time you rolled max damage on magic missiles five times in a row, why shouldn't you be expected to remember something much more important like house rules?
Obviously because one thing is memorable and the other one isnt, do i need to explain further?
 

Shevek

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DM: "Ok, roll for stats"

Lhynn: "Can we do 4d6 drop lowest?"

DM: "Ugh, fine..."

Lhynn: "Ugh, I got two ones in a row!"

DM: "Then drop one. Thats what 4d6 drop lowest is for."

Lhynn: "Can we just ignore ones"

DM: "Ok, fine, whatever, I just want to start playing some time this century."

Lhynn: "Hmm, all twos and threes, can be ignore anything under 4?"

DM: "Screw you man, its point buy from here on out."
 

Lhynn

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Ive never actually played under point buy rules. they are awful.
 

Shevek

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That may or may not be true but point buy was created explicitly to prevent headaches players like you cause DMs.

In this thread, Lhynn rolled this:

tumblr_msrnpeO40g1rrofo2o1_4001.jpg

You may not reroll.
 

Lhynn

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Rolled a 1 on what. I dont understand.
Headaches from what?

I wish people would explain themselves better so i can apropiately prove them wrong.
 

Night Goat

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Rolled stats are too easily cheated, and are inherently unfair because some players will get better rolls than others*. Point-buy has its own flaws, but it's the lesser evil.

*I've seen suggested a system where everyone rolls up an array, then each player gets to choose from any of the arrays rolled. This seems like a much better way to do rolled stats, but I've never heard of anyone actually doing it.
 

Lhynn

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Good, the game is suposed to be unfair, you may lose an arm, or a leg, or your eyes along the way. you may gain powerful special habilities, strong magical items, you may end up commanding an army, or living as a beggar, robbing travellers to feed yourself.
As for cheating, i always have my players control eachother if im in a hurry, if not i supervise the rolls myself, i know the temptation to cheat is strong, to start with an edge, to improve your chances, but at the end of the day it just makes playing the game pointless.

Play smart, good rolls wont save you, learn to let go, a character dies and you gotta roll another, learn that your character is in fact disposable until proven otherwise. Especially in a PnP environment. Be brave, playing it safe makes for your characters living longer, but will leave you with no stories to tell. Any player in their right mind would have retreated from that castle when they saw a fucking god being reborn, no one would have taken the chances i did, but honestly i was tired of being pushed back, that particular campaign was fairly ruthless and i just had enough, My character wasnt going to lose his friends over that, so he decided to make a stand.
Learn that no matter how high your stats are, in the bigger picture you are still part of a weak mortal race, and what you have means nothing.

Point buy is shit, it takes away a lot of charm from character creation, and its only suitable in a video game.
 

King Crispy

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If I were DM and I was working with a reasonable group of players who were conservative like I am I'd simply work with them during character creation:

- We talk briefly about that player's vision for his or her character
- We roll for stats and arrange appropriately (which is something I've never had a problem with)
- If the player has no real preference then we wing it
- If the rolls are disappointing, I allow the player to make a verbal case why they need to be altered. It had better be a good one.
- If the character is meant to be a fighter, for example, and no score were above say 13, I might allow the STR score to be boosted by one point, as an example
- Now write up his or her background and reason for being an adventurer and let's get to work
 

Shevek

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All this is ridiculous.

The DM decides how uber he wants players to be within the scope of the campaign and gives them a point cap. You then make your character with said points. That works very very well since the player has the choice necessary to build a character concept within the scope of what the DM envisions for the campaign.
 

Night Goat

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I'd give the players a generous point buy. This means we'd get some powerful characters, and that's good because it means I can use more interesting creatures against them.
 

Lhynn

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You sound like JP spiritual guru. I tell them to suck it and get on to making their character.
I even have them roll for money, and laugh at them if its low too. Shit why do you pamper them? players should know that they will have to fight and overcome from the start, if they do reach a decent level they can be proud of that, because it was them that did it, i wasnt helping. If they die on the way there, they can make aother character, hopefully having learned a valuable lesson and laughed their asses off meanwhile.

Shevek You are so boring i may actually vomit after reading your garbage, its a fucking game of chance, treat it as one.
 

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