Sword Coast Stratagems BG1

[Wyrmlord]

I feel like I am rediscovering BG1 as a brand new game now. I used to find BG1 to be one of the slower, more demanding, and grindey RPGs, because if you stayed within the story path, you would be stuck in the early game fighting low XP creatures for hours and levelling at an excruciatingly slow pace. But if you dared venture out of the comfort area and went into the dangerous zones, you would face a basilisk or one of those underground burrowing things that would wipe out your party. Which means that generally you would typically face kobolds, bandits, and ogres who would not be hard to kill, but can instantly kill a low level party member otherwise. It came to just getting a good dice roll.

But SCS BG is different. Yes, the encounters are much harder, but also much more rewarding. Since you can level up much quicker in this version, just by wandering around a bit, and bumping into a group of Sword Spiders or Dread Wolves, you quickly have a level 3-4 party which has a variety of abilities to use and you are not stuck to a mere band of bows and slings. At the same time, since the encounters are harder, you are more pressed to use your spells and abilities intelligently, as I discovered when I ran into the Red Wizard fight early in the game.

I always wondered if there was a genuine middle ground between the super low level win-or-lose-on-dice-roll-only style of BG1 and the so high level that low to mid level abilities are useless nature of BG2/ToB, and SCS BG1 seems to find that middle ground.

 

[Lilura]

Lrn2scout.

 

[Krraloth]

Sneaking Ranger w/ poison arrow cheese

 

[Incantatar]

But SCS BG is different. Yes, the encounters are much harder, but also much more rewarding. Since you can level up much quicker in this version, just by wandering around a bit, and bumping into a group of Sword Spiders or Dread Wolves, you quickly have a level 3-4 party which has a variety of abilities to use and you are not stuck to a mere band of bows and slings. At the same time, since the encounters are harder, you are more pressed to use your spells and abilities intelligently, as I discovered when I ran into the Red Wizard fight early in the game.

I always wondered if there was a genuine middle ground between the super low level win-or-lose-on-dice-roll-only style of BG1 and the so high level that low to mid level abilities are useless nature of BG2/ToB, and SCS BG1 seems to find that middle ground.

What are you talking about? You won't generally level faster with SCS. A few optional monsters give slightly more xp and the harder random encounters option in BG2 can give you more xp to a certain point. But that's both no major deviation from vanilla. (The engine changes from BG1->BG2 can make a more noticeable difference through the way random encounters are borked.)

The middleground between BG1 and ToB is SoA. The mid levels is where the series shines and where in a broader sense P&P D&D shines.

 

[Immortal]

I Think mid - late game BG 1 on hardest difficulty is where the infinity engine shines. Unless you are a total save scuming monster summoning cheese factory where you fireball into fog of war and abuse doorways.. You generally can expect a pretty tough game with some cool spell interactions and tough fights near the mid - end of BG 1.. Early on you get completely raped by rats and gibberlings and still that feels pretty good unless your b-lining to the exact areas where the hidden items / easy xp is.

In BG2.. If you know the games well you can basically decimate everything except liches and dragons with barely any work. Bonus points if you actually use your ability to transform even once.. completely useless.

Both games are extremely abusable but if you put certain anti-cheese rules on yourself you can have a pretty fun time.

 

[Rivmusique]

SCS is p. great.

Doing a playthrough of BGT with it now (is there an SCS for just BG1? I assume there once was because I recall BG2s being called SCSII, but now it is just SCS and it is for BGEE, TUTU, BGT, BG2 TOB). It's been awhile since my BG1 vanilla playthrough, but I can't say I've noticed a significant boost in XP gain. Definitely going to end up over the old TotSC cap though, pretty sure the mod adjusts for this so it's okay.

 

[octavius]

Few mods enhance a game as much as SCS does for BG1. I wish the gold Box games could have been modded like this.

But as others have mentioned you don't actually get more XP, since it doesn't change spawns or how much XP the affected creatures are worth; it only changes their combat scripts. IMO you should get more XP for beating the much smarter human enemies you face, especially spell casters. I actually mentioned this to DavidW once, and IIRC he tended to agree but felt that it was not within the scope of the mod.

 

[Grunker]

SCS = best mod ever, period

 

[agris]

truth


(though level1npcs is pretty great)

 

[Incantatar]

But as others have mentioned you don't actually get more XP, since it doesn't change spawns or how much XP the affected creatures are worth; it only changes their combat scripts. IMO you should get more XP for beating the much smarter human enemies you face, especially spell casters. I actually mentioned this to DavidW once, and IIRC he tended to agree but felt that it was not within the scope of the mod.

You get ten thousands of XP for simple fed ex quests in BG2 it's not like there isn't enough of it around.
Trivia: David wrote a book about the Everett interpretation of quantum theory. http://www.amazon.co.uk/The-Emergent-Multiverse-according-Interpretation/dp/0199546967
It's not really a popular interpretation in the science but it's definately an entertaining thought.

 

[octavius]

But as others have mentioned you don't actually get more XP, since it doesn't change spawns or how much XP the affected creatures are worth; it only changes their combat scripts. IMO you should get more XP for beating the much smarter human enemies you face, especially spell casters. I actually mentioned this to DavidW once, and IIRC he tended to agree but felt that it was not within the scope of the mod.

You get ten thousands of XP for simple fed ex quests in BG2 it's not like there isn't enough of it around.

I was talking about the BG1 version. In BG1 a few hundred point of XP can make a difference, especially early in the game. I agree it's not a problem in BG2, with its extensive use of quest XP.
But to me it just feels wrong that defeating a dangerous opponent with 20 HP and spells that he uses effectively does not give more XP than just pumping arrows until dead into a 40 HP bear or similar. But then the whole concept of XP in AD&D is rather abstract, so I guess it's another discussion and not something really worth bothering with for a mod.

Trivia: David wrote a book about the Everett interpretation of quantum theory. http://www.amazon.co.uk/The-Emergent-Multiverse-according-Interpretation/dp/0199546967
It's not really a popular interpretation in the science but it's definately an entertaining thought.

I knew he was a clever guy, but not that he was that clever.

 

[hoverdog]

I've recently started a new BGT run with SCS, Spell & Item Revisions plus a few miscellaneous mods (Randomizer, UBs, Fixpacks, BG1NPCs, Rogue Rebalancing et co.). Currently in Cloakwood.

The first time I played SCS ('bout two years ago) I was pummeled harder than bryce's ego a great deal of times, including Nashkel, Bandits' Camp, spiders, statue garden and a dozen more probably. Right now, I'm... maybe not disappointed, but a bit underwhelmed compared to my previous run. The only real trouble I've had so far was Mulahey (went straight to the mines). I suppose it should be easier when I know more or less what to expect, but the most epic battle ever, the bandits camp (two dozen reloads, several deaths and running around the whole map away from those fucking archers), took me one try, two webs and a couple shots from a wand of fireball, no deaths even. The spider part of cloakwood - two antidotes all.

Any other mods that can increase the difficulty in BG1? Non-cheese, please. Grunker

 

[octavius]

Hard Times mod makes it somewhat harder, with good weapons harder to find, what with the iron crisis and all.

Also do you go full SCS with all options turned on?

 

[Coriolanus]

I didn't like it. BG1 was a mediocre game except for the freedom of exploration and this mod just made it feel a lot longer than what it should have been. Once you figured out how to deal with something it just kept throwing the same thing at you over, over and over again.

BG2 (non-ToB) was good and SCS2 made it better.

However, I was just sick of endless, same-ish combat by the end of the Fire Temple in ToB.

 

[Grunker]

Any other mods that can increase the difficulty

My modlsit is actually fairly slim:

1) ToBEx
2) BWP Fixpack
3) BG2 Fixpack
4) BGT
5) 1PP v4.1
6) 1PPv3 Avatar Fixes
7) BG1NPC
8) BG1NPC Music
9) The Lure of the Sirine's Call
10) Baldur's Gate Mini Quests and Encounters
11) BG1 Unfinished Business
12) Rogue Rebalancing
13) Level 1 NPC
14) SCS
15) BGT Tweak
16) BG2 Tweak
17) aTweaks
18) BGT Music
19) Item Randomiser
20) LadeJarl's Tutu GUI
21) Widescreen mod
22) Cre Fixer
23) Generalized Biffing

So I can't really help you there. Maybe ask at G3? They seem to be the most responsive community atm.

EDIT: If you don't run Item Randomiser, DO SO! Fucking awesome.

EDIT2: Randomiser only really works well on a clean install and a new game though. It can be installed on a current game but you'll have to make a bunch of concessions.

 

[Grunker]

what with the iron crisis and all.

I see what you did there

 

[hoverdog]

Any other mods that can increase the difficulty

My modlsit is actually fairly slim:

1) ToBEx
2) BWP Fixpack
3) BG2 Fixpack
4) BGT
5) 1PP v4.1
6) 1PPv3 Avatar Fixes
7) BG1NPC
8) BG1NPC Music
9) The Lure of the Sirine's Call
10) Baldur's Gate Mini Quests and Encounters
11) BG1 Unfinished Business
12) Rogue Rebalancing
13) Level 1 NPC
14) SCS
15) BGT Tweak
16) BG2 Tweak
17) aTweaks
18) BGT Music
19) Item Randomiser
20) LadeJarl's Tutu GUI
21) Widescreen mod
22) Cre Fixer
23) Generalized Biffing

So I can't really help you there. Maybe ask at G3? They seem to be the most responsive community atm.

EDIT: If you don't run Item Randomiser, DO SO! Fucking awesome.

That's pretty much the same install is mine (I only added Spell and Item Revisions). Maybe I should just play on Insane.

Hard Times mod makes it somewhat harder, with good weapons harder to find, what with the iron crisis and all.

This seems interesting, just have to check whether it meshes with the other item mods.

 

[Tigranes]

SCS is the only way to play.

 

[ghostdog]

If only obsidian realized that the way to go for their IE spiritual successor should be BG1&2 D&D with SCS instead of the cool down syndrome.

 

[Grunker]

In my experience, randomiser actually made the beginning significantly harder because I couldn't just dust up the +2 weapons I always relied on and take it from there. Some mage fight like the Red Wizards in Wood o' Sharp gave me a run for my XP. I had to ditch them not once but twice before coming back and finally killing them on Level 7.

 

[octavius]

Hard Times mod makes it somewhat harder, with good weapons harder to find, what with the iron crisis and all.

This seems interesting, just have to check whether it meshes with the other item mods.

Haven't tried Item Randomizer, but I suspect it will be compatible, since IR doesn't add any items.
Hard Times is however incompatible with a mod (or a component of a mod), the name of which I can't recall, that adds exotic weapons like Katanas.

 

[hoverdog]

Hard Times mod makes it somewhat harder, with good weapons harder to find, what with the iron crisis and all.

This seems interesting, just have to check whether it meshes with the other item mods.

Haven't tried Item Randomizer, but I suspect it will be compatible, since IR doesn't add any items.
Hard Times is however incompatible with a mod (or a componenet of a mod), the name of which I can't recall, that adds exotic weapons like Katanas.

Not a weaboo, so hardly a problem.

 

[Grunker]

Hard Times mod makes it somewhat harder, with good weapons harder to find, what with the iron crisis and all.

This seems interesting, just have to check whether it meshes with the other item mods.

Haven't tried Item Randomizer, but I suspect it will be compatible, since IR doesn't add any items.
Hard Times is however incompatible with a mod (or a component of a mod), the name of which I can't recall, that adds exotic weapons like Katanas.

Actually Randomizer randomises a bunch of mods as well IIRC, so.

 

[GarfunkeL]

SCS in BG1 will always give you a run for your money unless you just turn all the options off because enemy spellcasters get bumped up few/several levels. Meaning that they will have protection spells active that you might not be able to dispel. Similarly, they will use Chaos and Confusion a lot, and you won't have Chaotic Commands. That's pretty much my only gripe with SCS in BG1, that you need to rely on Berserker/Barbarian rage, the one helmet giving Mind Shield and Potions of Magic Blocking for some of the key fights where you cannot spare the time to have most of your team wandering around aimlessly.

Also, not sure how you got so lucky as to deal with the Bandit camp with only two webs. There's enough bandits that they should overwhelm you. That's one thing that DavidW never managed to implement - getting enemy casters to dispel your AOE spells. Guess it's impossible and having them dispel your buffs is good enough.

 

[hoverdog]

Also, not sure how you got so lucky as to deal with the Bandit camp with only two webs. There's enough bandits that they should overwhelm you. That's one thing that DavidW never managed to implement - getting enemy casters to dispel your AOE spells. Guess it's impossible and having them dispel your buffs is good enough.

Believe me, I was equally surprised.
Are there actually any spells that can dispel AoE effects like Web? I only know of Sphere of Fresh Air (or whatever it's called) that counteracted stinking cloud/cloudkill. Dunno if AI uses it.