Putting the 'role' back in role-playing games since 2002.
Donate to Codex
Good Old Games
  • Welcome to rpgcodex.net, a site dedicated to discussing computer based role-playing games in a free and open fashion. We're less strict than other forums, but please refer to the rules.

    "This message is awaiting moderator approval": All new users must pass through our moderation queue before they will be able to post normally. Until your account has "passed" your posts will only be visible to yourself (and moderators) until they are approved. Give us a week to get around to approving / deleting / ignoring your mundane opinion on crap before hassling us about it. Once you have passed the moderation period (think of it as a test), you will be able to post normally, just like all the other retards.

Bioshock Infinite - the $200 million 6 hour literally on rails interactive movie with guns thread

Major_Blackhart

Codexia Lord Sodom
Patron
Joined
Dec 5, 2002
Messages
18,300
Location
Jersey for now
I don't hate the game specifically for it's liberal messaging, I hate it for lots of things, one of them is a poorly transcribed and implemented liberal messaging, not that it's liberal.
If it was actually well done, I wouldn't have a problem.
 

Mary Sue Leigh

Erudite
Joined
Aug 31, 2012
Messages
414
Location
Mysidia
Maaaan this is torture to play, it took me 8 hours actually and I tried to rush it, but you can't. Every so often it grinds to a halt, immobilizes you and forces your view on what it wants you to see or locks you in an elevator and has exposition dumped onto you without showing anything you haven't seen already. I'm suspecting that there is supposed to be some cultural satire in it but while I can't see it, the sad truth is that the developers may really have thought this is the work of genius.
If you don't know where I'm coming from, I loved ole System Shock 2 (1 was too complicated for me, derp) and I still have a soft spot for Bioshock 1. But whatever you wanna say about BS1 it still had some bit of exploration and an actual scary horrory feel, even if it couldn't hold a candle to SS2.

BSI simply has nothing of that. You really feel like watching a movie, a badly acted one with no semblance of coherence or plot or character motivations. There's an instance where 'The Girl' (which is all she's ever called in text) hates you because you want to sell her into underage sex slavery and because you're a meanyhead, so she does the usual trick-and-knockout thing with a wrench (clever reference to SS2? I think not!) and you get her again soon later and she's cross, you can tell because she scowls. Anyway, not long after she does a 180 degree turn during a firefight, telling you she is sorry to have called you a thug and you REALLY impressed her with your ability to mercilessly shoot people that are just doing their job and scramble their brains by busting a circular saw through their craniums, and everything is cool again. Good character writing or what? It's like they never even saw a human being before. :D

And it becomes clear very quickly WHY they went with this "infinite realities" arc. For one so they can re-use the lazy, linear and uninspired, boring to look at maps, sometimes even up to 4 times. Another reason is, every single time you get into a tough situation where the writers don't know how to get the characters out of it, they simply travel to another world where the problem doesn't even exist in the first place! If that's not good writing, I don't know what is.
The bad guy has no motivation. The super powers are never sufficiently explained given how well they do at inventing pseudo-science (for instance the city floats because it rests on Quantum particles that are fixed in space and time or something, but even despite this it can MOVE anyway). At least not without reading a lot of external "literature", this is like trying to understand a Star Wars prequel.. The game makes a huge point to show that all that happens in it is meaningless, and establishes a logic in which the ending makes no sense and is also not accomplishing anything. The main character (SPOILERS!) dies though, which I consider a mercykilling, but he must be horrified to see a dozen or so copies of the most annoying sidekick character I have ever seen (and I played Daikatana a lot) drowning him.
I'm actually surprised "The Girl" doesn't also have the ability to throw you sammiches during combat since that's all us womynfolk are apparently good for (and a sammich item actually exists in the game!) but then you never know what's inside those medcases that she hands you. At least she's invulnerable, headstrong, independant, yaddaya but still needs a strong tough guy to do things for her since she's so lost otherwise, emotionally too.
If you expect character development, you're going to be left in the dust, my hearties.

And if you needed more, the combat is also offensely broken. I normally play stuff on easy or so - even though I am an expert FPS player, just like John Romero - but this one I started on Hard and still faced zero challenge. I died only once in the beginning when I was still adapting to the terrible controls and didn't have my regenerating shields yet. It puts you back exactly where you were, with partial health, and takes a bit of your cash for the trouble. Enemies you killed, stay dead. Since you just go to an alternate universe where you didn't actually die (there there, try again, okay? It's not so hard, you can do it!). Death has less consequence and meaning than in Diablo 2 or Dead Island or even Prey.. this stuff is for babies! I guess Hepler had a say in it? Too bad you can't skip combat entirely, it would shave about 2 hours off the game and it is boring and tedious anyway.
There's also no danger of falling off the "skyhooks", a mechanic I utterly loathed, just like the random 'tears' that get in the way even more than 'The Girl' does, since the game won't let you do anything so dangerous. Need solid ground to jump off. That immediately dissolves all the possible acrophobia tension away, even for me who actually suffers from this condition. Come on guys, even in Unreal '98 I was able to fall off the map in Na Pali Haven and drop out of the skybox and die exploding into a pile of gibs and had to reload my game like a ditz. But this just gives you nothing.
You can carry two weapons only so think smart what to upgrade. And why would I want magic spells that summon ravens and gusts of winds when I can shoot freaking fire and lightning like the Emperor from Star Wars basically from the get-go? (You invoke magic in this game with forever unexplained "Salts", rather than Mana, or EVE or Psi or whatever, I just don't know, it's as random as anything else in this mess of a trainwreck..)
Additionally, the AI is totally crippled. They spend most their time NOT spotting you even in plain view, or to empty their entire clip trying to shoot you through a giant fountain that they can't even see past. Have mercy on them and kill every one you see. They always have goodies on them.. There are bigger enemies with different behaviour and giant glowing weak spots but they're so retarded that I don't think they deserve a detailled mention, and they contribute almost nothing to challenge anyway since they always have a full health restore on them, in case you managed to indeed get hurt by them.
In the end it even invokes FEAR 2 a little when it suddenly goes to a ghost-buster-esque storyline for no reason that is ever explained, which was also greatly disappointing. I suppose they just went to a universe where ghosts exist, because, why not? You even go to the future and past since there is apparently universes where time just lags behind or skipped ahead a couple of years. Everything's possible because of Quantum Physics (basically "The Force" of this game's universe), hence the "Infinite" part. Bullsh*t Infinite.
It's not even that original. SliderS did it ages ago and even then I didn't like it. But at least SliderS had LotR's "Gimli" John Rhys-Davis. BSI doesn't even have Kahri Wuhrer..

I have a reputation for liking very bad games, especially FPSes, among those that know me.. but this.. I have no words. How did it become Anything of the Year, of the anything? Who would play this twice? I'd rather watch paint dry or an amazing match of League of Legends or something than replay this, no matter how much people ensure me the newly unlocked "1999" mode is a lot more challenging. How can it be? I barely play the game, I am almost never in control of my actions, even if it does let me wander but not ever progress until I go to a certain point and hit the Use key to [Comfort Elizabeth] or [Tie Corset] or [Enjoy the Party] or stuff like that. Sometimes it offers you choice (!) like two or three times like what kind of choker 'The Girl' should wear, but whatever you do is 100% consequence free, don't ya worry yer little head!

Argh, sorry, rant, but I had to do it, I had to get it out of my system, even if no one cares, I feel like I am a lot cleaner, almost reborn. See? I did a thing there, a reference to the stupid game- seriously, don't play it. I mean it.

Peace out.
 
Last edited:

DeepOcean

Arcane
Joined
Nov 8, 2012
Messages
7,394
I have a reputation for liking very bad games, especially FPSes, among those that know me.. but this.. I have no words. How did it become Anything of the Year, of the anything? Who would play this twice? I'd rather watch paint dry or an amazing match of League of Legends or something than replay this, no matter how much people ensure me the newly unlocked "1999" mode is a lot more challenging. How can it be? I barely play the game, I am almost never in control of my actions, even if it does let me wander but not ever progress until I go to a certain point and hit the Use key to [Comfort Elizabeth] or [Tie Corset] or [Enjoy the Party] or stuff like that. Sometimes it offers you choice (!) like two or three times like what kind of choker 'The Girl' should wear, but whatever you do is 100% consequence free, don't ya worry yer little head!

Argh, sorry, rant, but I had to do it, I had to get it out of my system, even if no one cares, I feel like I am a lot cleaner, almost reborn. See? I did a thing there, a reference to the stupid game- seriously, don't play it. I mean it.

Peace out.
1999 mode that makes a regular enemy take 2000 shots before dying? No, it only prolongs the torture. When I got to the first fight with that generic Big Daddy, I couldn't take anymore. Why this game was considereted game of the year? That is easy, lots of money to buy people and people having really low standards. I see people thinking this game is something incredible and revolutionary then wondering why gamming isn't considerated art... Why that would be?:lol:
 

CSM

Cipher
Patron
Joined
Dec 12, 2009
Messages
459
Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
Looks like shit.
Idiots trying to ape film noir.
Yeah, fully functioning Rapture, after Fontaine's death but before the madness.
Big fucking deal.
You got that goddamn gigantic fucking city in the sky, why not use that?
Oh wait, this game will take us to that world as well, won't it?

Considering you made it clear dozens of pages ago you hate this game on spec for it's supposedly liberal messaging, why do you keep reading this thread? Just to vent?
Racism, jingoism, and religious fundamentalism = bad, is liberal messaging now? How far gone is this loon? :lol:
 
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Messages
8,268
Location
Gritville
SOMEWHERE BEYOND THE SHIT DLC'S THERE WAITING FOR MEEEEEEE KEN LEVINE STANDS BEHIND MY AAAAAAASS AND GENTLY PUTS HIS COCK IIIIIN IT IF I COULD REFUND IT I WOOOOOULD AND BUY PATH OF EXILE INSTEEEE-AD
 

Mary Sue Leigh

Erudite
Joined
Aug 31, 2012
Messages
414
Location
Mysidia
If Elizabeth could open tears whenever she wanted, why didn't she just open a tear to Paris?

But she does, she does open tears to Paris, at least one time, she just always gets scared and never goes through. Well, I lie, there is no real explanation why she doesn't. I remember the scene though because some nerrd referenced it to me again since it was apparently the bestest thing ever, because you see a theatre in the foreground that plays 'Return of the Jedi', but still uses the title that Lucas originally intended, "Revenge of the Jedi" (in french of course, to add extra pretentiousness, and because it IS in France), so apparently that made this scene supar deep and endlessly cool.

But still, she doesn't just go through, she's content to sit there and wait to be rescued like a fairytale princess locked in a tower that's guarded by a dragon (or giant bird-man in this case). How original.
 

DalekFlay

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Oct 5, 2010
Messages
14,118
Location
New Vegas
I feel like there was a quick line of dialog from her about why she never goes through to stay, but I forget what it was.
 

Jick Magger

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Dec 7, 2010
Messages
5,667
Location
New Zealand
PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Bubbles In Memoria
I feel like there was a quick line of dialog from her about why she never goes through to stay, but I forget what it was.
There might be, but since most of her talk about the tower after you leave it is some variation of "I've always wanted to escape that place and I would rather die than go back there", I still find this strange. She seems to have nothing but seething contempt for the place, but not once in the sixteen or so years she was confined there did she try to actually escape when the fucking door out was one tear away. Why bother learning how to pick locks when you can fucking phase through the door with interdimensional portals?
 

Mary Sue Leigh

Erudite
Joined
Aug 31, 2012
Messages
414
Location
Mysidia
Because QUANTUM PHYSICS, that's why. Stop asking perfectly logical questions..!

Oh I just got a response from an expert:

Because the tower is a siphon
it siphons her power


Almost poetic.
 
Last edited:

sea

inXile Entertainment
Developer
Joined
May 3, 2011
Messages
5,698
I believe she says that she could "never bring herself to leave" but no reason is ever actually given. Yeah, it's bullshit, just like the rest of the game.
 

Jick Magger

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Dec 7, 2010
Messages
5,667
Location
New Zealand
PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Bubbles In Memoria
Oh I just got a response from an expert:

Because the tower is a siphon
it siphons her power


Almost poetic.
Tell the expert he's an idiot, because as you said, you see her opening a tear to Paris while she's in the tower. I think I'll just out-and-out say that you can't have a fucking damsel in distress character when said character has full-access to the multiverse at her disposal and move on.

Which actually raises another question: It's established near the end of the game that destroying the tower will give her full access to her powers and make her a semi-godlike being, but the tower's destroyed about 1/3'rd through the game in the initial universe.

Did that tower just not count?
 

Mary Sue Leigh

Erudite
Joined
Aug 31, 2012
Messages
414
Location
Mysidia
The tower is only "partially" destroyed at first, with the part that houses this siphon mechanism being in its base, aaand apparently in the tower she can only "create" tears and not "open" them, which I am told is an entirely different thing. I am still arguing that the ending is pointless since it should not happen in infinite minus seven other dimensions, but apparently they do because Elizabeth has godlike powars and WHATEVER, can do what she wants!
I never sufficiently understood why she has that kind of power though and why not everyone does it when it's as easy as leaving a speck of your body in a different dimension, which apparently anyone can access with the right machinery..
I don't really like this writing X)

I already went ahead and called him an idiot though, thanks :D
 

Jick Magger

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Dec 7, 2010
Messages
5,667
Location
New Zealand
PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Bubbles In Memoria
The tower is only "partially" destroyed at first, with the part that houses this siphon mechanism being in its base, aaand apparently in the tower she can only "create" tears and not "open" them, which I am told is an entirely different thing.
Before I start this, let me emphasize that I'm not mad with you.

This is my biggest problem with Bioshock Infinite fans. At no point is a difference between "creating" and "opening" tears mentioned or explained. It's basically just fans blowing fairy dust up their own asses to convince themselves that they're dealing with smart and ground-breaking storytelling, on the same level as indoctrination theory. The farthest they go to explain why she never just opened a tear and left her oh-so-oppressive gilded cage was, as Sea and DalekFlay have kindly told me, one line about how she "couldn't bring herself to leave", which completely flies in the face of her later descriptions of the place, how she hated being there, always tried to find new ways to escape it, and at one point literally tells Booker to kill her if they ever reach a point where failure is the only option. This is just bad writing, plain and simple.

This crowd is what pisses me the fuck off about the current state of video games the most. Worse than CoD kiddies, worse than casualization, it's the pricks who are so goddamn obsessed with proving how gaming is 'art' that they'll accept utter bottom of the line trite shelled out by hacks like Ken Levine and David Cage so long as they can have something 'deep' and 'innovative' to hold up high as the Citizen Kane of video games.

I hate everything and everyone seems stupid to me.
 

Mary Sue Leigh

Erudite
Joined
Aug 31, 2012
Messages
414
Location
Mysidia
Amen.

This is more like the Phantom Menace of gaming rather than Citizen Kane. Same hype, 'success', mixed feelings about it, paid off critics, resting on a legacy that was probably made more by other people, but having nothing to show for it than flashy visuals and action scenes, a confusing story and boring characters.
 

Shadenuat

Arcane
Joined
Dec 9, 2011
Messages
11,955
Location
Russia
What I particularly don't like about BI writing and the idea of multiple dimensions in general, is that there are no rules, and no consequences for the writer for his actions. Now that they established that there will be more stories and they can draw from the pool of Elizabeths and Bookers, it doesn't really matter what happens with any of them or even with the worlds they occupy. It reminds me of comics and their problem of extended universes. In one of the latest DC movies, Wonder Woman cuts Aquaman's head off with a sword, but then everything is right again, cause that was just one version... timeline... which Flash did cause he... or whatever. All fixed now.

I doubt I am qualified to say what "real" writing is, but when writer can so easily escape his characters and consequences of their actions, escape their future, it doesn't feel like real writing to me.
Also one of the reasons why I don't like obscure endings after credits which doesn't mean a fuck but "leave room for interpretation!". To hell interpretation, writer should bear the burden of what happened to his characters afterwards, what their life will be, and so on.
 

Minttunator

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Sep 26, 2012
Messages
1,649
Location
Estonia
Codex 2012 Codex 2013 Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 RPG Wokedex Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Codex USB, 2014 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pathfinder: Wrath
I had the same exact thought - the video started off well, but then I realized I'm just wasting my time watching a video about a game that I don't give a fuck about. It's much better to waste time posting about it on the Codex! :P
 

As an Amazon Associate, rpgcodex.net earns from qualifying purchases.
Back
Top Bottom