Thief : I approve of this good shit.

[Serious_Business]

Here's a random thread for some praising of the Thief series. I just recently booted TDP, been a couple of years since I played it, watched the intro vid, got goosebumps as always. I just love this shit so much I felt like I had to put all those emotions into words and share them with mah bros.

Now, I am an original Thief faggot, I played the game back into 1998. I had very little experience with computer games at the time, I remember a friend (this friend became a cop, I'm not sure if that's supposed to mean something) telling me about it, and I remember being in awe at how much interactivity the game offered, how much it seemed to be alive. Now of course, coming from a console background and being a teenager that doesn't know anything about coding or game engines, any kind of PC game which is non-linear will do that impression on you. Still, I think it's fair to say that as far as stealth games go, the Thief series are unsurpassed in their non-linear design.

What I want to talk about here is not the game design, even though I could write quite a lot on that - so here it is, story faggotry incoming. What grapples me the most about the Thief series is its sense of mystery that it managed to create. You'd think what Thief did right was primarly the gameplay - here's a bunch of old school designers with ideas and solid, no-nonsense programming skills - and I would agree with that, sure (the AI is still pretty much on par with any stealth game out there!). But think about how much flair the games had. It's just incredible how they pulled off this unique world, this unique atmosphere. First thing to point out is the emphasis on sound - has there been a game that experimented so much with sound since and then, that explored and exploited that rich continent as much as the Thief series did? I doubt it - and this is somewhat revolting, because I have no idea why hearing should be deemed less important than sight in our experiences.

And this is exactly what Thief is - an experience. Think about how the world is introduced to the player, the texts at the beggining of each missions, the cynical commentary of Garrett, isn't that pure genius right there? Doesn't that just emanate style? Now if you want to be a faggot, you might want to tell me that this good shit was only the result of lack of technological means at the time. All the cool little movies at the beggining of a mission - just trash them, here comes the cutscenes. Oh yeah baby. Now here's the realisation that we all make today - technology doesn't equal progress, this is what the "jews" want you to believe.

As far as main characters go, can you think of a cooler guy than Garrett? I find that, as a teenager, Garrett was my personal hero. Maybe he still is. Think about it - a loner, cynical, angry, stuck between different raving groups of fanatics, finding no solace in either civilization (Hammers), nature (Pagans), or knowledge (Keepers). He is the ultimate individual, and thus the ultimate anti-hero.

I could go on and on about this good shit, and then I would do just that because I am a man of bad form, bad taste and crude intelligence, but I will refrain here for the sake of the lady. Now I know the Thief 2 storyline and general gameplay was weaker, and Thief 3 was new shit (the story was still fairly good though, a nice conclusion to the series I feel, and there was that hospital mission)... to me TDP is still the standard, although I am not enough of a faggot to say that TMA isn't just as good (we must prize all the gold that Looking Glass left us). What's even more amazing about all of this is probably how much of an old standing, brick solid fan community the games spawned even after all those years. I mean just listen to me rave about the series 12 years after the fact - I guess I can say they changed my life, sure, I'll put the hyperbole there, that's how I feel about those games. And those mods, man. The funny thing is, doing a Thief mod is probably fairly complex (I never tried it, maybe someone wants to fill in the blank) - look at how much mods there is, and how much quality stuff was done too. A beacon in the darkness, to be sure. Or perhaps rather - something that thrives even through the horrors and the darkness? Well, enough of the shitty metaphors

So yes :

 

[Gragt]

I remember that I had played the original Half-Life first, which impressed me very much, coming too from a mostly console background. But I think that only when I played Thief, a year or so later, I understood the full potential of what games could offer.

Anyway TDP is also my favourite. T2 is great and has amazing map design (not sure it's ever been matched) and refined the stealth mechanics and tools, but the story and cohesion in TDP is just great.

 

[SCO]

The amazingly big maps. I am still in awe at some thief 2 fan missions. I mean, sure in this age of I/O stream engines, visportals and shit, that is kinda old hat. But a map that allows access from bellow, above, sides (windows) or just the front door? With a full sized castle and a neighborhood too? A cathedral even? Gameplay styles that go from just bashing everyone with a sword in straight combat (a true challenge considering how discouraged it is, and thus worthy of being tried), to backstabbing/knocking out, to the "simple" ghost, to the perfect ghost ironman (never be detected, don't change the light sources, lock the doors again, pickup rope arrows, close everything you open, try to leave everything the same basically - money and don't save).

Funny thing is, you will probably graduate in these styles if you play thief enough, at least into ghost.

The dark mod is shaping up to a ghost paradise. It has some AI problems: if alerted, their paths can go awry, some exploits possible, bunny hopping to make minimal sound - going to report that, the thief able to climb the most ridiculous shit, like wall lamps and tables full of shit - fun but makes things too easy.

But the AI is more alert, there is a possibility to put it in permanent search mode with directed search so you have to keep moving, the next version they will be able (not mandatory) to notice open doors and light lamps again etc.
Good times.

 

[waywardOne]

i have saves for each TMA mission so when i jones for a particular one i can just jump right into it. after all these years i'm still an addict.

 

[Marquess Cornwallis]

Nice write-up, SB.
I second the preference for TDP. I'm nearing the end of my first playthrough of Thief Gold and, compared to vanilla TDP, it felt a little diluted. It's not that the extra missions aren't good (they're all enjoyable enough and some are among the best when considered on their own), but the narrative flow of the original release is tighter. The Thieves' Guild at the very least should have been tacked on as a freely accessible bonus rather than placed in the main storyline.

 

[SCO]

Got lost eh?

 

[Wirdschowerdn]

My god I can't wait to see what they're doing with Th4ef: The new shit.

 

[Marquess Cornwallis]

Got lost eh?

Not really, the map is huge but not that hard to navigate. It's more about how long it takes to complete and how it doesn't really fit that well between Assassins and The Sword.

 

[Topher]

Yep, TDP is a true classic and one of my all time favorites.

 

[DwarvenFood]

Well, nice write-up indeed, I might just try the game now (!) where to start, the one known as TDP ?

It's just one of those really good games that somehow I never got around to playing.

 

[SCO]

Got lost eh?

Not really, the map is huge but not that hard to navigate. It's more about how long it takes to complete and how it doesn't really fit that well between Assassins and The Sword.

My personal problem with the map is the fucking additional objective in expert of finding some hidden shit of that fucking well. Took 6 hours no kidding.

 

[Eyeball]

Just so's you know, there's 50% off on Thief games on gamersgate right now. Bought T3 from there - I understand it's the worst game in the series, but I'm aiming to enjoy it anyway.

 

[ChristofferC]

I got bored after playing the first map in Thief 1 on the hardest difficulty and didn't bother with the rest. Does it get better?

 

[RatFink]

I got bored after playing the first map in Thief 1 on the hardest difficulty and didn't bother with the rest. Does it get better?

if you got it to run properly(videos and all) on a modern computer you owe it to yourself to at least try!

plus yeah, man! theres ghosts n zombies n shit!
which i in hindsight kinda missed in the metal age!

it does get better, just let the plot start! first mission is to characterize garrett

 

[Joghurt]

I actually remember playing a demo in early 1999. It was fantastic. I was new to the FPS genre back then and the only FPS games I've tried were Wolfenstein, Doom 1 and 2, Quake 1 and 2, Duke, Heretic, Blood and Half-Life. When I tried Thief demo (I got it from a CD that came with some PC Games Magazine) I fell in love with it. I've just never seen such an immersive world and atmosphere in an FPS game. It was fantastic. I bought the game the same week.

 

[MetalCraze]

It will probably have a cover system, Garrett's bow firing arrows like an assault rifle and a health regen. To hide you will just press the crouch button like in that game where stealth was better than in Thief 3. Quest compass will lead you to the treasure you will need to steal through linear corridors. And everyone will finally be a Thief fan, just like everyone is Fallout fan now.

 

[Lyric Suite]

I got bored after playing the first map in Thief 1 on the hardest difficulty and didn't bother with the rest. Does it get better?

For you? No it doesn't. Now go choke on a dick, and remove yourself from the gene-pool.

 

[Turisas]

Lord Bafford's Manor

 

[Unkillable Cat]

For someone absolutely green and oblivious to the Thief series, I recommend the following:

# Play them in order (Dark Project/Gold, then Metal Age, then Deadly Shadows)

# Use headphones. Kill all other sources of sound except the game. Turning off the lights is optional.

# Don't play on Expert the first time round, as the near-omnipresent objective of not killing anyone will make the game a bit too difficult to a beginner. Once you've gotten a feel for the game(s), then restart playing on Expert. (Does not apply for Deadly Shadows, as the game really doesn't care if you go around unnoticed or if you murder everything in sight, and the difficulty only affects how much loot you must grab.)

# Don't rush. Take it slow. Except when running away from enemies who've found you.

# You cannot fight more than one opponent at a time. Don't try it.

 

[commie]

For someone absolutely green and oblivious to the Thief series, I recommend the following:

# Play them in order (Dark Project/Gold, then Metal Age, then Deadly Shadows)

# Use headphones. Kill all other sources of sound except the game. Turning off the lights is optional.

# Don't play on Expert the first time round, as the near-omnipresent objective of not killing anyone will make the game a bit too difficult to a beginner. Once you've gotten a feel for the game(s), then restart playing on Expert. (Does not apply for Deadly Shadows, as the game really doesn't care if you go around unnoticed or if you murder everything in sight, and the difficulty only affects how much loot you must grab.)

# Don't rush. Take it slow. Except when running away from enemies who've found you.

# You cannot fight more than one opponent at a time. Don't try it.

All good except the 'do not play on expert bit'. DO play on EXPERT! It's the full experience and going through again after doing the game on an easier difficulty minus the extra objectives and fuller looting just will not be the same! You won't have that same sense of awe or achievement as even if the game is harder it will be locations you've already experienced. Better to persevere with the full on objectives and play a noble non-murdering thief as Garrett should be played as!

I can't stress this enough. Apart from wargames and strategy where I crank up the difficulty to as high as it can go without ridiculous AI cheating, THIEF games are the ones where I ONLY play on the highest difficulty. Any less as you won't get half the experience of the game. It will be a cutdown FPS with sneak elements, something you DON'T want! You're playing a sneaking, thieving game anyway, not a combat game, so why limit the AI and make yourself more resilient for combat and lessen the joy of loot hunting when you don't need much at lower difficulty?

 

[Jaesun]

For someone absolutely green and oblivious to the Thief series, I recommend the following:

# Play them in order (Dark Project/Gold, then Metal Age, then Deadly Shadows)

# Use headphones. Kill all other sources of sound except the game. Turning off the lights is optional.

# Don't play on Expert the first time round, as the near-omnipresent objective of not killing anyone will make the game a bit too difficult to a beginner. Once you've gotten a feel for the game(s), then restart playing on Expert. (Does not apply for Deadly Shadows, as the game really doesn't care if you go around unnoticed or if you murder everything in sight, and the difficulty only affects how much loot you must grab.)

# Don't rush. Take it slow. Except when running away from enemies who've found you.

# You cannot fight more than one opponent at a time. Don't try it.

Thank you. I have never played the Thief series, but am going to rectify that now.

 

[catfood]

Also when you're done with them be sure to visit this page for more Thief goodness. It has one of the best modding scenes around.

 

[Marquess Cornwallis]

To hide you will just press the crouch button like in that game where stealth was better than in Thief 3.

Off topic, but this reminded me of a discussion we once had. You were right all along.

All good except the 'do not play on expert bit'. DO play on EXPERT! It's the full experience and going through again after doing the game on an easier difficulty minus the extra objectives and fuller looting just will not be the same! You wn't have that same sense of awe or achievement as even if the game is harder it will be locatins you've already experienced. Better to persevere with the full on objectives and play a noble non-murdering thief as Garrett should be played as!

Seconded.

 

[commie]

For someone absolutely green and oblivious to the Thief series, I recommend the following:

# Play them in order (Dark Project/Gold, then Metal Age, then Deadly Shadows)

# Use headphones. Kill all other sources of sound except the game. Turning off the lights is optional.

# Don't play on Expert the first time round, as the near-omnipresent objective of not killing anyone will make the game a bit too difficult to a beginner. Once you've gotten a feel for the game(s), then restart playing on Expert. (Does not apply for Deadly Shadows, as the game really doesn't care if you go around unnoticed or if you murder everything in sight, and the difficulty only affects how much loot you must grab.)

# Don't rush. Take it slow. Except when running away from enemies who've found you.

# You cannot fight more than one opponent at a time. Don't try it.

Thank you. I have never played the Thief series, but am going to rectify that now.

Play on EXPERT though. Accept no substitute. As a Wizardry player you have the balls for tough shit!

 

[Excommunicator]

For someone absolutely green and oblivious to the Thief series, I recommend the following:

# Play them in order (Dark Project/Gold, then Metal Age, then Deadly Shadows)

# Use headphones. Kill all other sources of sound except the game. Turning off the lights is optional.

# Don't play on Expert the first time round, as the near-omnipresent objective of not killing anyone will make the game a bit too difficult to a beginner. Once you've gotten a feel for the game(s), then restart playing on Expert. (Does not apply for Deadly Shadows, as the game really doesn't care if you go around unnoticed or if you murder everything in sight, and the difficulty only affects how much loot you must grab.)

# Don't rush. Take it slow. Except when running away from enemies who've found you.

# You cannot fight more than one opponent at a time. Don't try it.

All good except the 'do not play on expert bit'. DO play on EXPERT! It's the full experience and going through again after doing the game on an easier difficulty minus the extra objectives and fuller looting just will not be the same! You wn't have that same sense of awe or achievement as even if the game is harder it will be locatins you've already experienced. Better to persevere with the full on objectives and play a noble non-murdering thief as Garrett should be played as!

I would recommend not playing it on Expert the first time. If you are still getting used to the game, it is most likely going to frustrate you more than anything. Replaying/failing levels due to highly sensitive objectives is more likely to pull you out of the whole mood and story continuity if you fail to do things that you haven't had the experience to know how to deal with yet.

Besides, it can be a lot of fun to kill people sometimes, and it is certainly part of the experience fighting your way out of a tight situation with your weapon if you find no other way.