Putting the 'role' back in role-playing games since 2002.
Donate to Codex
Good Old Games
  • Welcome to rpgcodex.net, a site dedicated to discussing computer based role-playing games in a free and open fashion. We're less strict than other forums, but please refer to the rules.

    "This message is awaiting moderator approval": All new users must pass through our moderation queue before they will be able to post normally. Until your account has "passed" your posts will only be visible to yourself (and moderators) until they are approved. Give us a week to get around to approving / deleting / ignoring your mundane opinion on crap before hassling us about it. Once you have passed the moderation period (think of it as a test), you will be able to post normally, just like all the other retards.

To AoD fans - why aren't you looking forward to Dead State?

What puts you off Dead State?


  • Total voters
    106
Self-Ejected

Excidium

P. banal
Joined
Aug 14, 2009
Messages
13,696
Location
Third World
The zombie apocalypse is not :obviously: enough as an rpg setting. I think zombies are strictly dudebro power fantasy material for people who want to mow down brainless hordes of enemies. A classical zombie never poses a threat for anyone with half a brain in games and when you give your zombies speed, intelligence and ability to use guns and stuff they are not zombies anymore they are just regular people who happened to die at some point.
Are you retarded or what?
 

TwinkieGorilla

does a good job.
Patron
Joined
Oct 19, 2007
Messages
5,480
Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech Pathfinder: Wrath
Same reason I'm not looking forward to PoE:
  • Setting/subject matter
    • Art direction
Difference between caring slightly and having pledged to PoE is one thing: Tim Cain.
 

canakin

Cipher
Joined
May 15, 2011
Messages
421
The zombie apocalypse is not :obviously: enough as an rpg setting. I think zombies are strictly dudebro power fantasy material for people who want to mow down brainless hordes of enemies. A classical zombie never poses a threat for anyone with half a brain in games and when you give your zombies speed, intelligence and ability to use guns and stuff they are not zombies anymore they are just regular people who happened to die at some point.
Are you retarded or what?

Why?
 

canakin

Cipher
Joined
May 15, 2011
Messages
421
If you are talking about how the game's about interaction between characters and survival of society in an apocalyptic environment I know about that. Still I would like to know why they chose the most uninspired, overdone and stupid kind of apocalypse.
 

Roguey

Codex Staff
Staff Member
Sawyerite
Joined
May 29, 2010
Messages
35,785
I'm not surprised to see that setting is the biggest factor, though I had to see it for myself (Scientific!)

In almost every interview Brian's all "I know you're sick of zombie games but ours is different because blah blah human factor blah blah relationships blah blah survival" however he's overlooking one thing: RPG fans, especially on the Codex, have tastes that are narrower than a hallway in a camp of pygmy dwarves (to paraphrase the Saw, long live the Saw). Age of Decadence, while not a Tolkien-esque orcs'n'elves pseudo-medieval European fantasy setting, is still recognizably fantasy. You have your swords, spears, shields and leather and metal armor and enough recognizable trappings of a fantasy setting. Dead State, to paraphrase Josh again, has enough unusual choices of characters, equipment, and landscape for a crpg to make it difficult for a person to look at a scene and think, "This is a fantasy setting," even though its zombies are quite fantastic (and the only thing fantastic about it; I'm also assuming there will be no hamfisted scientific explanation provided for the zombies' existence). Even a financial disaster of a game like Bloodlines is more recognizable as a fantasy setting. So it doesn't matter how well- or differently-executed the setting is if the people are flat-out not interested in it.

Fortunately for Dead State, trad-RPG fans aren't the only audiences out there; considering DS has outsold AoD on EA, they seem to be getting a few of them. I think how many it ultimately gets will depend on execution.

Really, the only thing both have in common is the engine and being turn-based.
They're both dialogue- and C&C-heavy turn based RPGs.

Because it is vaporware.

I would love to play it but i can't fucking get excited over game that will be released in 2020. And yes i fucking can't wait for AoD or DS
In a recent forum post, Brian said that they don't have it in them financially or psychologically to delay it up to another year. It'll come out either this year or early next; granted, it might not turn out very good.

Mitsodas self-ejected from 'dex. That tells all you need to know about Dead State.
Brian never posted here, and Annie isn't officially self-ejected. She is busy and possibly/probably not all that enthused about making it a priority to post here on account of the negativity. One might counter with "Thicker skin," in which case I'd circle right back to "busy." I think it's understandable for someone working on two video game projects to not want to spend what time they have for themselves engaging with killjoys.
 

Gozma

Arcane
Joined
Aug 1, 2012
Messages
2,951
I kinda look forward to it (I think I voted for it on that anticipation poll) but I consider it a long shot. They have to really thread a gameplay needle to get the setup to be X-Com-type interesting with enemies as limited as zombies and I don't have any reason to think they'll get it right instead of veering off into one of the many ways it could be boring shit. The art also sucks and I'm somewhat cautious of SJW moralizing based on the "Red State" thing.
 

Roguey

Codex Staff
Staff Member
Sawyerite
Joined
May 29, 2010
Messages
35,785
Dead State, to paraphrase Josh again, has paper-clips and cue cards.

Yeah.
Glad we can agree a present-day elementary school is an unusual choice of setting for a crpg.

This is (you have to be self-aware enough to realize this, right?) hilarious coming from you of ALL people here.
Self-aware absurdity is my thing. I'm extremely negative and I'm also extremely reasonable about it.
 

Invictus

Arcane
The Real Fanboy
Joined
Nov 3, 2013
Messages
2,789
Location
Mexico
Divinity: Original Sin 2
I actualy had not noticed it myself, but looks cool enough since I think those guys could make it very Falloutish in its survival horror scenarios. As most fans of the genre know, the dead are the least interesting part but what lengths the survivors are willing to go...
The combat looks good and does the graphics and seems to me it will be still a year away from release
Kind of surprised by the lack of support here anyway given the fact that it is beigb developed by the AoD team but how they decided to develop this instead of a Lovecraftian game is beyond me
Perhaps I could offer the services of a virtal focus group to get a feel for that here on the Codex?
 
Self-Ejected

Excidium

P. banal
Joined
Aug 14, 2009
Messages
13,696
Location
Third World
I'm not surprised to see that setting is the biggest factor, though I had to see it for myself (Scientific!)

In almost every interview Brian's all "I know you're sick of zombie games but ours is different because blah blah human factor blah blah relationships blah blah survival" however he's overlooking one thing: RPG fans, especially on the Codex, have tastes that are narrower than a hallway in a camp of pygmy dwarves (to paraphrase the Saw, long live the Saw). Age of Decadence, while not a Tolkien-esque orcs'n'elves pseudo-medieval European fantasy setting, is still recognizably fantasy. You have your swords, spears, shields and leather and metal armor and enough recognizable trappings of a fantasy setting. Dead State, to paraphrase Josh again, has enough unusual choices of characters, equipment, and landscape for a crpg to make it difficult for a person to look at a scene and think, "This is a fantasy setting," even though its zombies are quite fantastic (and the only thing fantastic about it; I'm also assuming there will be no hamfisted scientific explanation provided for the zombies' existence). Even a financial disaster of a game like Bloodlines is more recognizable as a fantasy setting. So it doesn't matter how well- or differently-executed the setting is if the people are flat-out not interested in it.
I don't think people take issue because the setting is unorthodox, more like because it's the zombie apocalypse specifically
 

Gozma

Arcane
Joined
Aug 1, 2012
Messages
2,951
I don't really mind stuff like how they select backgrounds for people particularly, but I do care about didactic moralism. Like putting some stereotyped bigot character that you can force to be a nice homo progressivus with a corny self-righteous Freudian dialog chain or something.

Like I'll give you an example of progressive mush-writing that made me roll my eyes: in New Vegas that quest with the raped sniper woman, the goal of the whole quest is to get her to go talk to a post-apocalyptic doctor to get "counseling". I have the head of the guy that raped her in my inventory. They won't write any way to resolve this quest, in a comically violent pulp post-apocalypse, that isn't this hyper-sincere prog rape counseling after school special message.
 

Roguey

Codex Staff
Staff Member
Sawyerite
Joined
May 29, 2010
Messages
35,785
Like I'll give you an example of progressive mush-writing that made me roll my eyes: in New Vegas that quest with the raped sniper woman, the goal of the whole quest is to get her to go talk to a post-apocalyptic doctor to get "counseling". I have the head of the guy that raped her in my inventory. They won't write any way to resolve this quest, in a comically violent pulp post-apocalypse, that isn't this hyper-sincere prog rape counseling after school special message.
Vengeance isn't going to make someone get over trauma bro.
 

Gozma

Arcane
Joined
Aug 1, 2012
Messages
2,951
Vengeance isn't going to make someone get over trauma bro.

Even setting aside the statement that "counseling" is what's best for realistic healing, it being the only resolution of the quest is inherently moralizing. And it's even more irritating when I know the people that wrote it don't even get how didactic they're being.
 
Joined
Jul 11, 2010
Messages
3,212
Location
Vostroya
Eh, I'm actually backed this game and I don't really mind zombie-apocalypse as a genre - for example, one of my favorite roguelikes is Cataclysm: Dark Days Ahead. Also I liked Zafehouse Dairies and Project Zomboid. What makes me cautious about DS isn't the setting, it's that I'm unsure if they could implement interesting gameplay systems into it - I found EA version rather boring in that aspect. And also I second Excidium - writing is... really not good, which is rather surprising and disappointing given that Mitsoda became one of my favourite game writers after I played VtM:B.

And also DoubleBear people really, and I mean REALLY suck at PR and community management. VD at least is a good salesman and can encourage interest in his product.

Also rather disappointing is the lack of publicly available updates and roadmap for the project.
 

JarlFrank

I like Thief THIS much
Patron
Joined
Jan 4, 2007
Messages
33,134
Location
KA.DINGIR.RA.KI
Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
I hate zombies with a passion. Zombie movies, zombie games, zombie everything. The market is over-saturated with this shitty fantasy creature.

Exactly fucking this. The entire zombie genre is just utterly uninteresting to me. It's just boring and banal. Dumb hordes of mindless corpses, how exciting. Not. And yeah, I know the argument that it's not about the zombies but the survivors, but it's still boring to me. If they want to make a troy about survivers go full post-apoc, or heck, do an alien invasion at least it has intelligent enemies (maybe something like the scenes on Cylon-occupied human planets in Battlestar Galactica with human resistance fighters and Cylon mercilessly hunting them down). But zombies are just fucking boring, uninspired and overused and do not offer anything of value that couldn't be done better with something else.

Most overrated and most fucking crappy setting of all time.
 

shihonage

Subscribe to my OnlyFans
Patron
Joined
Jan 10, 2008
Messages
7,159
Location
location, location
Bubbles In Memoria
I still like zombies and believe that the setting hasn't been fully exploited, especially in videogames. I backed it's KS campaign... but last time I checked, Dead State didn't seem to have an art or gameplay design direction.
 
Joined
Apr 3, 2006
Messages
1,386
But why explore zombies at all when the number one most dangerous thing in any post-apocalyptic setting is other people? Compared to renegade army units, biker gang bandits, end times flagellants, cannibal cultists, petty neo-feudal warlords and so forth what do zombies have to offer? Next to the living, they feel about as threatening as packs of feral handbag dogs. I know that Dead State is intending to focus on the other human survivors, but I'm skeptical about how interesting that's going to be when they've chosen a trope as shop-worn as "zombie apocalypse" for an overarching background.

Also I'm butthurt no one has made an RPG set during the actual 14th century apocalypse:
bruegel-triumph-of-death-supersize.jpg
 

Roguey

Codex Staff
Staff Member
Sawyerite
Joined
May 29, 2010
Messages
35,785
Even setting aside the statement that "counseling" is what's best for realistic healing, it being the only resolution of the quest is inherently moralizing. And it's even more irritating when I know the people that wrote it don't even get how didactic they're being.
The point of that quest is to lead players to the doctor who gives you implants. Any resolution that doesn't have you visiting that doctor would be missing the point.

You can also just kill her for the "quest failed" resolution.
 

As an Amazon Associate, rpgcodex.net earns from qualifying purchases.
Back
Top Bottom