Vampire: The Masquerade – Bloodlines patches, fixes, and the rest...

[Roqua]

Yes, they are still on top. It is a shame the monkeys didn't support Troika when they were making games and really needed the support and less whining about a couple bugs here and there, instead of the monkeys throwing all their money at shitty console games that sucked then and suck more now.

Weren't all three games shot down on account of unplayable bugginess? How was their reception upon release?

An Arcanum version was pirated like virgin bum at a highway rest stop 6 months before release which hurt sales a lot, and people complained about bugs and how shitty the game looked. ToEE was hit the hardest since people complained about every single aspect relentlessly. The Atari forums was about 99% negative posts either about the lack of RTwP, Bioware companions, bugs, TB combat sucking, full party creation, the graphics, etc.

Bloodlines, being consolish and a non-crpg, mainly had complaints about bugs and lack of Bioware companions from what I remember. People may have complained about the combat, but lets face it - people love Skyrim combat where it consists of just power attacking so people are fucking idiots. I wasn't a huge fan of the Bloodlines combat (nor the Arcanum combat) so I probably wasn't specifically butthurt about those whining about it as I was with people actively trying to shut down Troika and use some bugs as an excuse to pirate, or use the lack of rtwp as an axcuse to pirate, etc. Of course, Atari looked at what people were complaining about and that just ensured no game like ToEE would ever be financed again.

 

[Roqua]

Weren't all three games shot down on account of unplayable bugginess? How was their reception upon release?

They were acknowledged as flawed gems. I think Bloodlines caught the most flak though -- its Top 10 brilliance wasn't acknowledged until years later.

Though it's worth noting The Temple of Elemental Evil was literally unplayable at launch.

ToEE was perfectly playable at launch. I played it with pretty much no issues. I did lose an ironman game to a corrupt save, but the game was an instant classic and perfectly playable. It just didn't appeal to the console sensibilities of people who think they like rpgs.

 

[thesheeep]

I agree, it was very playable at launch.
Bugs, yes, with the worst one being save game corruption at random occasions.

Still, with multiple save slots, all was fine.
Of course, with Temple+ and Co8 it is MUCH better.
So good, in fact, that I really wish it had multiplayer. That would be really fun to play with a friend or two.

 

[Roqua]

I agree, it was very playable at launch.
Bugs, yes, with the worst one being save game corruption at random occasions.

Still, with multiple save slots, all was fine.
Of course, with Temple+ and Co8 it is MUCH better.
So good, in fact, that I really wish it had multiplayer. That would be really fun to play with a friend or two.

I completely agree. Not with the MP since that doesn't appeal to me, but the sentiments about the game being more than great and the awesome work by Co8 and the Temple+ people (and keep on the border, etc).

 

[FeelTheRads]

Though it's worth noting The Temple of Elemental Evil was literally unplayable at launch.

Bullshit.

The Atari forums was about 99% negative posts either about the lack of RTwP, Bioware companions, bugs, TB combat sucking, full party creation, the graphics, etc.

Is this true? Not that it would surprise me.

Of course, Atari looked at what people were complaining about and that just ensured no game like ToEE would ever be financed again.

And to this day agents of decline will tell you to not complain. Of course, companies will still give more importance to numbers and there's always going to be more people asking for decline than not, but just keeping quiet and waiting to see(TM) will never get you anything.

 

[Coma White]

Bugs, yes, with the worst one being save game corruption at random occasions.

This. This happened to me multiple times in multiple save instances.

There were also a ton of little retarded glitches like bonuses being calculated incorrectly, damage not totaling properly, and so on. Hindsight really is nice isn't it.

 

[Telengard]

Let's not kid ourselves. Not only did the game have save corruption, there was a - thankfully rare - bug that corrupted every save you own (personal sufferer). The game also had numerous CTDs for bugged equipment, quests and the like. And so, swirling those three things together, one's ability to complete the game back then was based entirely around either being very lucky or having a high level of tolerance for redoing everything you just did thanks to numerous CTDs and corruptions, and then maybe losing everything in one grand mega corruption and facing the daunting task of starting back over again from ground zero, with the CTDs and single game corruptions lying in wait ahead of you. But you persevere anyways, and finally make it to the head boss girl, and the game CTDs on the last hit on her. Doesn't matter if you reload, doesn't matter if you load a back save, doesn't matter if you reload and redo the entire back end of the game. CTDs every time.

That was the experience of TOEE at launch for far too many of us.

 

[ghostdog]

VTMB also had a couple of game breaking bugs at launch and many other smaller bugs/problems that played a big role in damaging the game's reception. Save game corruption could happen, after certain quests the game could reset, stopping you from further progress and there was also the notorious boat bug that could completely fuck you up. Not to mention many performance problems and crashes from memory leaks. The official patch fixed some of the game breaking bugs, and the game was then mostly playable, if still buggy, but it was already too late. IIRC the patch came rather late, one or two months after the initial release and it was solely from the good will of the developers since Troika had basically dissolved by then and there was no other funding from Activision. It was only when the first unofficial patch was released (by Dan Upright) that the game became really playable.

VTMB is the one troika game where I don't hold Troika overly responsible for the technical problems, since they were forced to release the game before HL2 and they were given an alpha version of the engine. Also Activision's QA was complete shit.

 

[Lujo]

Didn't have a clue the game aged so well. Troika's legacy is such a wonderful thing...

I re-read an old thread here on the codex and started up a playthrough of Bloodlines again, because... it's somehow the best despite all that's wrong with it.

Wesps patch, then restart for the addedd content. Funny thing is the bugs are still mostly there including

- automatic conversation entering where you can't effectively end the conversation without swinging the mouse wildly hoping your chararacter ends up facing another direction
- lily quest bug where the game locks you in place by misfiring several animations/animation components depending on which angle you approach a certain NPC from to initate conversation (not helped by the maniacal auto-initate convo bug)
- randomly getting stuck somewhere
- converstaintons getting re-started while you're at the barter screen with the person you're talking to
- subtitles not working most of the time

It's funny because I've got restored content in and it's obvious that the guy who made the patch worked his ass off (guys probably), but the gamebreaking and experience ruining (to anyone with less than my extreme patience, I suppose) bugs are still right there.

Oh, and the female models and characters feel like they were mostly made specifically to make your wife think you're a moron for playing it every time she walks by and looks at the screen.

HOWEVER, it aged extremely well.

I'm trying to pin down exactly why, too. Back in the day the conclusion about the game (where I'm from) was that "it's that very buggy game where sad nerds fail at being goths and always pick a Tremere, the women are ridiculous, and the ending is a slog." Still, fun, very nice character development / XP system, a messed up combat system which either adds a bit of excitement because you can always die due to awkwardness or you can breeze through it to get the quest done. Sneaking, too, and a cool noirish story with a nice ending (story wise.).

I picked Malkavian the first time around, and the second time around, and the third time around. Thought the game was great.

 

[Coma White]

I'm trying to pin down exactly why, too. Back in the day the conclusion about the game (where I'm from) was that "it's that very buggy game where sad nerds fail at being goths and always pick a Tremere, the women are ridiculous, and the ending is a slog." Still, fun, very nice character development / XP system, a messed up combat system which either adds a bit of excitement because you can always die due to awkwardness or you can breeze through it to get the quest done. Sneaking, too, and a cool noirish story with a nice ending.

The dialogue is some of the best-written I've ever encountered, and the still-excellent facial animations really breathe life (ironically enough) into the characters. Also the game never takes itself very seriously, and I think that also helps give the game long legs tonally speaking.

 

[Lujo]

The dialogue is some of the best-written I've ever encountered, and the still-excellent facial animations really breathe life (ironically enough) into the characters. Also the game never takes itself very seriously, and I think that also helps give the game long legs tonally speaking.

Oh yeah, the voice acting really is great, guys like Fat Larry and that bail bondsman guy kick ass. Some serious moments are surprisingly well done, too, like the whole Heather thing and even the Therese and Jenette showdown.

I'm not sure the dialogue is so much well written as much as a lot of it is well delivered. There's some highly cheezy stuff in there. It being the best says more about the other stuff. The quest design is also hugely helped by the generally awkward combat system and the somewhat confusing navigation in the hubs themselves. The clunkiness of it all makes you feel a sense of achevement and involvement in somewhat simplistic quests. I'm trying to imagine it working in an isometric setup - and it wouldn't, it would seem shallow. It's amazing how much work 1st person perspective does for this game. Same for the voice work, too.

Also, back in the day the loading times were preventing me from bothering with a Nosferatu, which is my default 2nd choice in vampire p&p games after Malkavian, as I like my Obfuscate. Now that's not a problem anymore, i'm kinda let down by how I don't actually have to use the sewers all that much. Apparently Nosferatu can walk on the street fine enough.

 

[Coma White]

I'm not sure the dialogue is so much well written as much as a lot of it is well delivered. There's some highly cheezy stuff in there.

That's why it's so great though. Bloodlines is brilliant because, not only does it tell a superb vampire story; it also willingly parodies and even goads itself. I've said this before, but whenever I replay Bloodlines I'm always struck by how FUNNY the writing is. The setting is so dark, and yet the narrative tone of the game is often at odds with that. It's like peanut butter and chocolate.

 

[Lujo]

I'm not sure the dialogue is so much well written as much as a lot of it is well delivered. There's some highly cheezy stuff in there.

That's why it's so great though. Bloodlines is brilliant because, not only does it tell a superb vampire story; it also willingly parodies and even goads itself. I've said this before, but whenever I replay Bloodlines I'm always struck by how FUNNY the writing is. The setting is so dark, and yet the narrative tone of the game is often at odds with that. It's like peanut butter and chocolate.

Oh, god yes. The great thing is that you got characters calling each other out on it, too.

The very best instance, in the history of gaming probably, is one of Grouts messages. He starts out by s****g all over the entire Vampire: the Masquerade setting, the pompousness and senslessness and unbelievably cheezy flavor of it all and then realizes that "Damn! Now I'm doing it too!"

Also, the game makes walking from point A to point B feel like an achievement. Really, it does, which is why folks "notice" it starts to suck around the Hollywood sewer level, but fail to notice it's been "sucking" ever since the moment you leave Santa Monica because everything you do becomes the same. It's that awkward 1st person and the even more awkward 3rd person, and not having visual indicators of where your goal is or how to get there on the UI that makes it all seem engaging. There's 5 different appartments in Skyline Appartments where all you do is just one and the same, yet it somehow it all feels like an achievement.

If you took stealth out of the old Commandos games or something, you could recreate the whole game as a gorgeous and non-buggy isometric game with actual hand-made cutscenes, but I'm not sure it'd be able to replicate the sense of accomplishment you're supposed get from turning on your invisibility and just slowly walking through 4 floors of hapless morons who aren't an actual threat. Or just climbing up ladders, going through a chute, climbing down ladders, repeating for a long while. There are all these ridiculous mechanics, and the player still doesn't lose interest.

 

[uaciaut]

I remember playing Camarilla Edition a while back and other than them kind of breaking Malks (i.e. making them too powerful) i actually remember enjoying it a bit.

So i'm looking to reinstall now and figured not to make a new thread.
Should i go with
1. CE again for old times sake?
2. UP plus 9.6
3. The final nights (i vaguely remember giving this a shot when it came out and not liking it very much)
4. Clan quest mod latest version (how is this btw?)
5. Bloodline: Antitribu (how is this also?)

 

[sardonix]

Is there any way to fix the cloth physics in this game? i got the cool looking female Tremere final costume, but everytime i jump or use a melee weapon it just breaks, revealing crappy leg models.

 

[Leorgrium]

It's a shame that VTMB doesn't have any multiplayer mode...

 

[Xathrodox86]

It's a shame that VTMB doesn't have any multiplayer mode...

Never forget the only MMO that could have so much potential... :/

 

[Whiny-Butthurt-Liberal]

I distinctly remember that after completing Santa Monica and appearing in the Downtown area, I took one look at the giant skyscraper which served as Prince LaCroix's headquarters, and immediately read the huge neon sign as VENTRUE TOWER.

For the rest of the game I kept thinking "Huh, this is a bit weird. Why is the Camarilla so cavalier about putting the name of one of their clans into the open? Is it not a breach of the Masquerade? Maybe they count on normies having no idea what it means... but it still feels like an odd genre shift just having the clan name out in the open like that."

Only on my subsequent play-through did I take a proper look at the sign and realized it was saying VENTURE TOWER all along...

One of the many odd things that can happen when you play a game where the devs paid attention to details and atmosphere.

Also, from the bottom of my heart, a deep and sincere FUCK YOU SHITSTAINS!! to Rich and Jack for sitting through the opening cutscene of the game and going "Ugh... this is, like, sooooooo pretentious... I bet whoever wrote this felt really proud of himself." It is such an odd quirk for these two assholes who (ironically and unironically) watch and enjoy the most childish and retarded of fiction genres, but get completely hung up on the concept of vampires like two grandpas who never saw any pop culture in their lives.

Yes, whoever wrote that scene probably felt proud, and he should - it's an excellent introduction to an excellent game. The kind of intro that conveys way more information that you could possibly catch the very first time, but becomes even more interesting when you watch it a second time...

 

[santino27]

 

[Semiurge]

Let's not kid ourselves. Not only did the game have save corruption, there was a - thankfully rare - bug that corrupted every save you own (personal sufferer). The game also had numerous CTDs for bugged equipment, quests and the like. And so, swirling those three things together, one's ability to complete the game back then was based entirely around either being very lucky or having a high level of tolerance for redoing everything you just did thanks to numerous CTDs and corruptions, and then maybe losing everything in one grand mega corruption and facing the daunting task of starting back over again from ground zero, with the CTDs and single game corruptions lying in wait ahead of you. But you persevere anyways, and finally make it to the head boss girl, and the game CTDs on the last hit on her. Doesn't matter if you reload, doesn't matter if you load a back save, doesn't matter if you reload and redo the entire back end of the game. CTDs every time.

That was the experience of TOEE at launch for far too many of us.

Still no worse than pre-special edition Skyrim.

 

[Storyfag]

it's an excellent introduction to an excellent game. The kind of intro that conveys way more information that you could possibly catch the very first time, but becomes even more interesting when you watch it a second time...

Bloodlines is a game MEANT to be replayed.

 

[Whiny-Butthurt-Liberal]

Let's not kid ourselves. Not only did the game have save corruption, there was a - thankfully rare - bug that corrupted every save you own (personal sufferer). The game also had numerous CTDs for bugged equipment, quests and the like. And so, swirling those three things together, one's ability to complete the game back then was based entirely around either being very lucky or having a high level of tolerance for redoing everything you just did thanks to numerous CTDs and corruptions, and then maybe losing everything in one grand mega corruption and facing the daunting task of starting back over again from ground zero, with the CTDs and single game corruptions lying in wait ahead of you. But you persevere anyways, and finally make it to the head boss girl, and the game CTDs on the last hit on her. Doesn't matter if you reload, doesn't matter if you load a back save, doesn't matter if you reload and redo the entire back end of the game. CTDs every time.

That was the experience of TOEE at launch for far too many of us.

Still no worse than pre-special edition Skyrim.

Yes, but that was back in the day when games were released as-is, and then maybe got a few patches to fix glaring issues, and that's it.

If VTM:B was released today, no one would even be surprised by the bugs, because the devs would be naturally expected to keep updating and working on the game for months after its "release" date. In fact, it would be in "playable pre-alpha" for a year before the official release date.

 

[Jrpgfan]

People posted an animations comparison with VtmB on the Starfield thread and guess what? I reinstalled the game.

Haven't played it since forever though. I know Wesp's patch is a must, but is there any other mod?

Any graphics mods that actually improve the visuals instead of making it look like shit?

 

[Delterius]

Any graphics mods that actually improve the visuals instead of making it look like shit?

the soundtrack tells me you should just be drunk and disheveled during gameplay for max immersions

 

[Wesp5]

Any graphics mods that actually improve the visuals instead of making it look like shit?

I use SweetFX and Reshade to get some decent anti-aliasing at least. You can polish the graphics some more using shader suites and specific presets, but I never bothered !