what was the last *great* RPG??

[Karwelas]

I don't know LAST great RPG. But there were some of them in last 10 years. Dragonfall, NV are best for me. Alpha protocol is also great.

Jesus, some of you are really edgy.

 

[Black]

When you're so easily entertained everyone else seems edgy, yeah.

 

[Lurker King]

shitty writing

Try to be thinner next time.

Well, I like some things in the setting (for instance, the AI, Apex, is cool), but none of this matters, because the quests are implemented in the dumbest way possible. “Kill this”, “disarm the bomb!”, “kill again”, “everyone wants to kill you, kill them first!”, etc. The way that the story pans out is also cheap “Someone dies -> zillion overkill quests -> put some fluff espionage stuff between the quests –> one choice -> boring and expected “twist” -> final boss -> another choice –> the end”. It feels like a cheap action movie that wants to look like a noir classic film without really putting the effort.

My theory is that Dragonfall is just mediocre enough to come the closest to the Codex's perfect RPG, because this is the way the Codex works.

It may be mediocre in all areas, true, and personally I found it extremely boring and limited, but at least it doesn't really fail at anything either, which ironically makes it the closest to the Codex's perfect dream RPG that would excel at everything at once, from combat to writing.

I think that the evaluation depends on the moment the game is released, the player’s expectation and the way that the developers are perceived. The previous SR sucked and Harebrained Schemes is not an “all starts” studio, so the expectations were low, little hype involved. None of the other big kickstarter games were released, so people weren’t so picky (or bitter, depends on the point of view) about it. An impartial evaluation should be based on the actual features and the higher standards of the game industry, but in practice, especially after the cRPG drought, people are disposed to believe in anything. In my book, anything that is mediocre is bad, because it is not fulfilling. A game that it is mediocre is worse than any game that does something memorable, being the combat system, the writing, etc. That it is assuming that all the features in the game are mediocre. IMO the quests and the combat are awful, not just mediocre.

 

[Grimwulf]

“Kill this”, “disarm the bomb!”, “kill that other one”, “everyone wants to kill you, kill them first!”, etc. The way that the story pans out is also cheap “Someone dies -> zillion overkill quests -> put some fluff espionage stuff between the quests –> one choice -> boring and expected “twist” -> final boss -> another choice –> the end”.

It's not "writing", it's quest design. If you don't like it, I feel sorry for you.

"Wake up", "Amnesia", "Find our what's going on", "Kill one boss", "Kill another boss", "Kill yourself - oops, you can't", "Go to the last boss", "Choose one of the endings". There you have it - Planescape: Torment has shitty writing! Who would have guessed!

 

[Rake]

Oh, god! The lack of good cRPGS for so many years made people insane! The game has shitty combat system, shitty writing and shitty itemization. The only positive thing we can say about it is the setting, which is a breath of fresh air among the usual generic fantasy setting of most cRPGs.

My theory is that Dragonfall is just mediocre enough to come the closest to the Codex's perfect RPG, because this is the way the Codex works.

It may be mediocre in all areas, true, and personally I found it extremely boring and limited, but at least it doesn't really fail at anything either, which ironically makes it the closest to the Codex's perfect dream RPG that would excel at everything at once, from combat to writing.

You got it wrong. Codex generaly seems to vastly prefer flawed gems, that are exceptional in one or two areas, and fail horribly at others, than an all around mediocre but passable experience like DA:O, PoE etc.
Dragonfall is liked for the same reason BG2 is liked. While it isn't truly exceptional at anything, everything in it is above average to good. It's not mediocre in all areas, it's good in all areas.

As for the last "great" RPG, for me it was MotB. After that the closest we got is Dragonfall, but i'm not comfortable putting it in the great category. Maybe Hong Kong and ToN will achieve that.
Shit like Witcher, AP and New Vegas don't come even close to great. They were good for what it is games, but nothing compairable to the games we got 15 years ago

 

[Ovplain]

Wasteland 2.

 

[Ludo Lense]

Codex generaly seems to vastly prefer flawed gems

All hobbies have this issue and I fully admit to prefer it so. Basically polish and reiteration has a diminishing return to people who invest a lot since they have seen it all before, thus they prefer "new" things even if they are more rough around the edges.

EDIT: I said Witcher 1 earlier in the thread because I thought, for some reason, the OP said CRPG. If we are referring to RPGs in general then Dark Souls.

 

[Elim]

I liked Wasteland 2. Divinity:OS has great combat, but for me the setting and the writing ruins it. Mind you, I do not mean that it is bad. But it's childish, you know what I mean?
PoE really rubs me the wrong way, the way the attributes work just break immersion for me and it just feels very sanitized.

Dark Souls and so on would be my choice if we go after the "RPG" definition of the masses, but it
is not a RPG, so...

Wasteland 2 it is, solid writing, loved the party stuff, combat was "meh" but still okay.
And the Shadowrun games would follow after that.

 

[Kem0sabe]

The last great rpg is still in beta... But when underrail is released properly it will define the genre.

 

[Lurker King]

“Kill this”, “disarm the bomb!”, “kill that other one”, “everyone wants to kill you, kill them first!”, etc. The way that the story pans out is also cheap “Someone dies -> zillion overkill quests -> put some fluff espionage stuff between the quests –> one choice -> boring and expected “twist” -> final boss -> another choice –> the end”.

It's not "writing", it's quest design. If you don't like it, I feel sorry for you.

"Wake up", "Amnesia", "Find our what's going on", "Kill one boss", "Kill another boss", "Kill yourself - oops, you can't", "Go to the last boss", "Choose one of the endings". There you have it - Planescape: Torment has shitty writing! Who would have guessed!

At the very least, “writing” encompass story, choices, characters, dialogue and quests. The common, but mistaken assumption that “quest design” is something unrelated to “story” and “writing” shows how bad the things are in the game industry. You can’t resume PS:T writing like that, but explaining why would take my time. Believe whatever you want.

 

[roshan]

I thought that Dragonfall was all around an excellent experience. Here's my bulletpoint list:

1. Incredible setting and atmosphere.
2. Zero filler combat.
3. Interesting and well realized CNC. Not just towards the end of the game, with all the major decisions, but even earlier on, such as when you spare the ghouls and they help you out in one of the later missions.
4. Interesting moral dilemmas that felt real within the context of the world.
5. Turn based combat! With just about enough depth to the systems to keep it interesting.
6. Great inventory system where you bring your mission essential items, instead of hauling around a whole load of trash all the time.
7. Memorable characters, good writing that brought even minor characters to life, giving them an actual personality. Plus it was always concise, as opposed to being heavily descriptive and text dumpy.
8. Lots of skill and ability checks. And loved the charisma system based on choosing etiquettes for your character.
9. Great system for character development and progression (karma).
10. Interesting plot that ramped/scaled appropriately as you went though the game. Also interesting investigative style that revealed more of the picture as you progressed.
11. Gameplay aside from dialogue and combat. You could be researching terminals, looking for someone's password, inputting information into a text parser.

There's probably a lot of other stuff it did well, but this is what currently springs to mind.

On the other hand:

1. Berlin did not feel like a well realized city. The Kreuzbasar was nice, but I really would have wanted more city zones, mini hubs, and a city map, and proper subway routes, with characters to interact with and side quests, to make it feel like you were wandering around an actual city. Had the game just not been mission based, it could have been close to best RPG of all time.

 

[adddeed]

The last great was Risen.

 

[nomask7]

Dark Souls II

(It distills story into action, rather than text-heaviness - but otherwise it has all the CRPG elements clearly on display.)

 

[Morality Games]

Don't know I would describe it as a great RPG, but Dragonfall felt great to play.

 

[Rivmusique]

Witcher 3

Change title and move to general gaming so this makes a bit of sense ... for people that are bad at action games and like Arkham/Assassin's Creed because "my PC looks so cool!"

Game's more of a step forward for GTA/RDR-types (now giving you choices during the "mission briefing" cutscenes that alter future missions/content) than anywhere for cRPG's. Also fits in with them with the extremely guided missions (quest compass, witcher sense golden trail, gerald monologuing and QUEST UPDATE! spam for every little step so you never have to think).

 

[Caleb462]

Fallout 2. In fact, FO1 and FO2 may be the only "great" RPGs I've ever played.

 

[hivemind]

The last great rpg is still in beta... But when underrail is released properly it will define the genre.

why ?

Fallout 2. In fact, FO1 and FO2 may be the only "great" RPGs I've ever played.

how come ?

 

[Black]

You ask too many questions, boy.

 

[hivemind]

You ask too many questions, boy.

I like reading the answers

 

[a Goat]

Weird. It's like there's 2 types of ppl; either you love Alpha Protocol AND hate D:OS or you love D:OS AND hate AP. Does anyone out there either hate both or love both? I played D:OS thru 3x back to back to back. . .I uninstalled AP after an hour and never looked back. Why the dichotomy?

Gameplayfags vs. cinematic storyfags.

 

[Lord Azlan]

Interesting thread - what was the last "Great" RPG I played?

How does one define great anyway - something new and groundbreaking, where all the different parts somehow produced a greater whole - something that gave you profound memories of joy or about the storyline?

I look down the All Time top 71 list of RPG and also consider some good RPG I have played since.

Deus Ex: Human Revolution - from 2011. Certainly in my opinion was a very good game and I really enjoyed it. But is it a Great game? If I found myself amongst a group of like minded RPG gamers would I go on about this game and how it made me a better person or gave me some life changing moments - some points of reflection on my life? Nope.

Risen - lovely environment and I really enjoyed it. But if I was in the pub and talking to some guys about RPG and how they are important and how they should be saved from destruction in this world where everything is about cash and reduction to the lowest standards = would I mention Risen?

Geat RPG games are what I include in a list of games "Games That Made Me" and in that list we have Ultima IV, Bards Tale, Ultima Underworld, Dungeon Master, System Shock 2 and going back even further Larn for Unix in 1987.

Fallout New Vegas - certainly a very good game but it did not reach the parts of my soul as those games above. In the end I quite forced myself to finish it. The best part was the beginning where all futures were possible. Did it innovate? Create some special memories that would keep me up at night thinking of the possibilities? Nope.

So, if you were to catch me waiting around in the airport or in a doctor's surgery and we had time on our hands to chat about RPG - the last great one I would talk about with passion and joy would be Morrowind from 2002 - and that is quite disappointing.

I am quite a Bethesda fan and I won't knock Oblivion or Skyrim. I like those games and really enjoyed them. But they aren't no Morrowind.

Silt Riders, Levitation, Bound Armour, Mystery of the Dwarves, Ascended Sleeper, Glass Weapons, Yagrum Bagarn, Dagoth Ur, Tel Aruhn, Red Mountain - the music

That game was just awesome and shows you don't have to have good combat to make a great RPG

 

[TwinkieGorilla]

hivemind bro I don't know how many goddamn times people need to say it when all you need to do is pay attention:

The overall art direction, the atmospheric music, the incredible diversity and attention to detail in combat (which in turn makes for some of the best cRPG combat I can think of), the best crafting system of any game ever, the unique and engaging story, the tasteful touches of humor, overall replay value, blahblahblahPLAY IT FOR YOURSELF ITS ONLY 10 BUCKS FOR FUCKS SAKE JESUS.

 

[razvedchiki]

Dont forget the pixel art

 

[Multidirectional]

Best out of recent ones is D:OS for me so far. It wasn't just driven by nostalgia and actually tried to innovate. Easily best turn based combat I've experienced in rpgs too.
Couldn't get into Wasteland 2 or POE, got bored early with them. New Shadowrun looks like something I might genuinely like though, will have to find time for it in the future, bought DC on sale not long ago.

 

[ProphetSword]

Pool of Radiance. Nobody's ever topped it.