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Which RPG has the worst combat?

ERYFKRAD

Barbarian
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Strap Yourselves In Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Then point me any game that is not Fallout Tactics with good combat system involving guns that is comparable (at quality scale) to JA2 combat.
Because i would fucking gladly play it. And i don't even mean TB. Real Time will also do. Because that is state of those games on PC. There are like few of them in last 10 years and almost all of them are shit. Only recently Xenonauts broke that curse but it isn't anywhere near JA2 level.
7.62 HC +M
 

undecaf

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Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2
You can't flank without another party member providing fire suppression. In the end it's as you said, even if you add those options, with one character you inevitably end up with puzzle combat rather than tactical combat. At best you will pick the best stance, pick the best firemode, pick the best cover for the given situation, rather than actually thinking up possible maneuver tactics outside of kiting. It becomes a game about logistics instead of tactics.

True enough.

But I guess the underlying point is there was no need for higher level tactical desicions when your character is the only one you can fully rely on and that the tactics that do come into the play, come from the you adapting to the ever changing situation. Fallout 2 compensated a bit with the behavior control; and I think it was a fine concept even if it didn't fix all the problems. And then, I never played Fallout or Fallout 2 thinking about it as a combat game; I was fine with most things being left as abstract.
 

RK47

collides like two planets pulled by gravity
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Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
ick. this thread.
Someone grab a mop.
So much cum here. Jeez.
 
Self-Ejected

Ulminati

Kamelåså!
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It's a toss-up between planescape: torment and arcanum. Both games had atrociously bad combat with little to no redeeming qualities.
 

Cholo

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No mention of The Witcher yet? It's just a rtwp game of wait for the bright color on the screen and then click on your mouse, for hours. The pre fight preparation isn't interesting, and the level ups are plain boring as far as they change your combat options.

Planescape Torment at least had a fully controllable party, Arcanum ambitiously let you chose between turn based with APs and real time, also had a great level up system which really changed combat. Alpha Protocol had messy stealth capabilities which would let you maneuver to advantageous positions before the shooting started, and maybe let you whittle down the enemy force. The Witcher was nowhere near as fun as any of them in terms of combat.
 

Rake

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In order of shitiness:
U7
Arcanum
Darklands
DA2
NWN

No doubt there are other games with shit combat out there, but from the ones i played, these take the cake.
 

sea

inXile Entertainment
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Anyone want to chime on on what made Planescape's combat so poor? Granted, it did not have much room for tactics, but at least the controls worked, there was clear cause:effect in what happened, the animations for spells etc. were pretty, and it was reasonably balanced. Not especially good, but there are certainly RPGs that have combat that's just outright broken.

Same reason as Arcanum - yeah it's unbalanced, but it's definitely functional and occasionally fun, and that's more than can be said for other games.
 

DraQ

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Gah! I just got reminded of my party happily running towards the door I rigged with an explosive charge and getting blown to bits, in spite of my efforts to get them to move the fuck away.
>.<
I just got Arcanum triggered.
 
Self-Ejected

Lilura

RPG Codex Dragon Lady
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It's more just that the combat has no challenge, and there isn't enough variety or numbers with enemy spawns and encounters, to reflect the power TNO and the companions possess.
This might be by design, but regardless, I felt always playing PS:T, even back when it came out, that there was something wanting.

1) TNO and companions can quaff healing and buffing items during battle as many times as is needed during inventory pause, removing all challenge
2) Buffing items stack, so just keep using them until you have max resists or whatever
3) Morte's innate dmg reduction means his jaw rarely hangs by a thread, he's a dmg sponge and can train the aggro on him with Litany of Curses
4) Dak'kon's blade is OP, to say the least
5) TNO regenerates like a troll, and I'm pretty sure crits are bugged with his fists
6) At level 13 TNO can have 25 STR, 25 CON and grandmastery in a weapon he can swing 3.5 times per round. and still get the WIS and INT dialogues.
7) The encounters are just really easy, just 90% trashmobs
8) There aren't really any tactics, and environment or terrain is rarely used to create bottlenecks or anything tactical on the playingfield
9) You can just run from "encounters", if you wanna call them that, and there's no penalty because most XP comes from quests
10) It doesn't matter if TNO dies, and he can resurrect companions with no penalty
11) Pathfinding is the worst of all IE games, meaning just positioning your guys for a fight is annoying. They also get stuck on each other all the time.

All I can really think of, it's a great game and I don't like criticizing it. But the combat is horrid.
 

Telengard

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Man, you lightweights don't even know from bad combat. Moebius: The Orb of Celestial Harmony, now that's bad combat. Arcanum, Neverwinter Nights, Planescape: Torment, they're not even in the same league of shittiness. Their combat is merely dull.
 

DraQ

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PS:T combat is genuinely bad, but not to the point of actively detracting from the game (less so than in BG1, even, where pathfinding and general clusterfuckery were serious showstopper when it came to enjoying the game) - you don't really catch yourself thinking "I feel like playing some PS:T... wait... oh god the combat, I just remembered the combat...".
 

Darkion

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It's more just that the combat has no challenge, and there isn't enough variety or numbers with enemy spawns and encounters, to reflect the power TNO and the companions possess.
This might be by design, but regardless, I felt always playing PS:T, even back when it came out, that there was something wanting.


1) TNO and companions can quaff healing and buffing items during battle as many times as is needed during inventory pause, removing all challenge
You are the player: Don't have them quaff potions and buff themselves.

2) Buffing items stack, so just keep using them until you have max resists or whatever
You are the player: Stop stacking buffing items on them.

3) Morte's innate dmg reduction means his jaw rarely hangs by a thread, he's a dmg sponge and can train the aggro on him with Litany of Curses
Oh the horror!

4) Dak'kon's blade is OP, to say the least
Opinions vary. If all else fails give him a butter knife. You are the player.

5) TNO regenerates like a troll, and I'm pretty sure crits are bugged with his fists
He is immortal.

6) At level 13 TNO can have 25 STR, 25 CON and grandmastery in a weapon he can swing 3.5 times per round. and still get the WIS and INT dialogues.
You are the player: Don't give him overpowered stats.

7) The encounters are just really easy, just 90% trashmobs
That has never happened before in any game. Oh the horror!

8) There aren't really any tactics, and environment or terrain is rarely used to create bottlenecks or anything tactical on the playingfield
That has never happened before in any game. Oh the horror!

9) You can just run from "encounters", if you wanna call them that, and there's no penalty because most XP comes from quests
That has never happened before in any game. Oh the horror!

10) It doesn't matter if TNO dies, and he can resurrect companions with no penalty
See 'He is immortal' above.

11) Pathfinding is the worst of all IE games, meaning just positioning your guys for a fight is annoying. They also get stuck on each other all the time.
You didn't play Icewind Dale?

They also get stuck on each other all the time.
That's just love.
 
Self-Ejected

Lilura

RPG Codex Dragon Lady
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It helps that most combat can be avoided, you can run to the exit (PS:T has an actual run option, not just a BG fast walk, nothing can keep up), experience loss is minimal. This means you can focus on the game's strengths, that is dialogue, questing, characterization, lore and world.
 
Self-Ejected

Lilura

RPG Codex Dragon Lady
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You didn't play Icewind Dale?

Yeah, I did. Both. The pathfinding was far superior to PS:T's. And Dak'kon can't be given a butter knife, he's connected to his blade. The rest of your post isn't really worth responding to, I'm afraid.
 
Unwanted

CyberP

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Beyond it, anything which doesn't have an "end turn" or, at worst, "pause" button qualifies as "worst RPG combat".

In the words of Excidium: Crock shit.
Dark Souls is real-time without pausing & features one of if not the best RPG combat systems.
 
Unwanted

CyberP

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I don't remember BoD having better systems than DS, but it has been years since I played it and my memory is a little hazy. Time for a replay, I do remember very much enjoying it.
 

himmy

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Oct 13, 2012
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SW:KotOR has, by far, the worst, most boring and unimaginative combat of any RPG I ever played. While NWN's is poor and Arcanum's is highly disappointing, I really cant see how anyone can claim they are worse than KotOR.

Seriously, it even has worse combat than The Secret World.
 
Unwanted

CyberP

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SW:KotOR has, by far, the worst, most boring and unimaginative combat of any RPG I ever played. While NWN's is poor and Arcanum's is highly disappointing, I really cant see how anyone can claim they are worse than KotOR.

Seriously, it even has worse combat than The Secret World.

It's a Bioware game, so this goes without saying. If it's a Bioware game alarm bells for shitty level design & combat systems should ring immediately.
 

Sensuki

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Codex 2014 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
The Witcher 2 is pretty bad.

For me it's the Elder Scrolls games.

Morrowind and Oblivion (and probably Skyrim too, haven't played it).

edit: Oh yeah, Fallout 3 too, since it uses that engine. Played the prologue, went outside, fought one battle and that was enough for me. Uninstalled (won the battle though btw, wasn't a RQ).
 
Last edited:

Serus

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A vote for Ultima 7, it simply is atrocious in every way. No meaningful input from the player whatsoever iirc (i tried to play it a very long time ago).
 

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