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[Interest Gauge] Pathfinder/Shadowrun 4th ed over RPTools

Which system is most monocle?

  • Shadowrun 4th Edition

    Votes: 1 33.3%
  • Pathfinder (D&D 3.5++)

    Votes: 2 66.7%

  • Total voters
    3
Self-Ejected

Ulminati

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It looks like I may have enough free time to juggle one more pen&paper campaign sometime in the foreseeable future. I'm considering bypassing the usual suspects in my pen&paper circles for this one and running something entirely through RPTools.

Mandatory URL to show what the fuck I'm on about
-SR4 framework
Pathfinder Framework

Basically it's a free, java-based die roller/chat client/group whiteboard. It's scriptable, and people have made frameworks for a bunch of different systems. Depending on the framework, tokens can contain pretty much an entire character sheet and keep track of all kinds of weird status effects. It's all pretty neat. Frameworks are all run server-side, so players don't need to worry too much about them. (Although they do modify the UI while running). The rptool client (maptool) can either be downloaded and run locally or launched directly through their website. No registration/purchase needed.

So here's what I was thinking: If there's sufficient interest, I'd sit down and prepare someting. I'm thinking there'd be room for 4-6 players. (Less than that and everyone would be screwed if someone missed a session. More than 6 and I'd be stressed to keep everyone engaged). It'd be either shadowrun 4th edition or Paizo's pathfinder, as those are the systems I'm most familiar with. I can either dig up a published adventure (more railroaded, but less work fo rme reduces the risk of GM burnout. Paizo's adventure paths for pathfinder are pretty decent) and tweak it, write an epic of my own or we can run something sandbox-style where it falls to the players to motivate their characters to go & do shit while I just provide flavour text and random encounters.

Regardless of system chosen, a few things would be in effect.
- Character options limited to core books and 1-2 sourcebooks. For pathfinder it's be the core book, the advanced players guide and possibly Ultimate Magic/Ultimate Fighter. For shadowrun it'd be the core book and possibly street magic, arsenal and/or augmentation. I really hate having to keep track of shit across multiple splatbooks.
- Sessions would be bi-weekly on a set weekday (probably friday, saturday or sunday). Additional sessions might be squeezed in if both GM and players all have the time and inclination. Time would be afternoon/evening central european time. Specifics to be hammered out if this thing gets off the ground when I have an idea of the timezones of potential players.
- Someone (not the GM) will be in charge of logging the session and posting a writeup for the amusement of the rest of Codexia.
- First session would be chargen. I'm a big fan of players being able to bounce character ideas back and forth when they roll up their little dudes. It helps a bunch in creating a balanced party and giving characters IC reasons to want to stick together.
- Players won't be chosen on a first-come, first-serve basis. I'll try to work out something that has the greatest chance of everyone being able to actually showing up. (similar timezones/preferred playing times). I'll maintain a list of reserves in case someone drops out midway through. I might possibly recruit one-shot cameos from the reserve list in case of NPCs joining the party temporarely.
- I'm going to assume people are able to gain familiarity with whatever system we choose to use on their own. I can provide PDFs of the rulebooks if needed and answer questions to the best of my ability. But some reading will probably be required of the players.

So what do I need from you people?

First and foremost, I need to know who's mad enough to want to suffer under the tender ministrations of my GMship. Nothing is binding at this point. I just need to know if there's actually enough people ready & willing for this to get off the ground.

I need to know timezone and preferred day(s) to play on. also, if showing up on a fixed day on a biweekly basis may be a problem during some periods, I'd rather know about it now rather than 4 sessions in.

If you have any preference for system to use. Convincing arguments to sway the opinions of others allowed.

Whether we should go with a published (tweaked) adventure, a dungeon crawly adventure I write/cannibalize from a bunch of sources or something sandboxy where I cook up a gameworld and players decide what the fuck they want to do. (EG: Players get a ship and a map of an archipelago. It's up to them to decide if they go hunting for buried treasure, sign up with the navy, trade cocaine etc.)

If you've already played/read some of Paizo's adventure paths and it looks like publised campaign might win, please mention it as well. It's no fun for anyone if someone in the group knows exactly what's going to happen around the next corner ;)

Whether to use the default setting (Pathfinder in Pathfinder, Seattle in SR4), an alternate setting (Eberron/forgotten Realms/Darksun/etc in Pathfinder, Denver/Hong kong in SR4) or something homebrewy (Shadows of Copenhagen with lots of action in the Christiania Free Trade Zone anyone?)

Any other input/cool ideas for setting/campaign focus. If they make me cackle with malicious glee I might end up using them. More specific details on the campaign will be hammered out if/when we settle on a system and a campaign style.

DISCUSS!
 

Azira

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Definitely interested and intrigued, but whether I'd be able to devote the time necessary when also considering my job and two young children (ages 5½ weeks and 19½ months) is a wholly different matter.

So this is a tenuous declaration of interest.. :oops: :salute:

[EDIT]

By the way, I'm deeply grateful for those links. It's a given that I'll be using those tools when it's my turn to GM in my current PnP group! :love:

Thank you, you're a true :bro:
 

Azael

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Consider me interested as well, especially now that our Dark Heresy sessions are on a bi-weekly basis. No real experience with Pathfinder or Shadowrun, but they both sound a lot a more :obviously: than DnD 4e.
 
Self-Ejected

Ulminati

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Azael said:
No real experience with Pathfinder or Shadowrun, but they both sound a lot a more :obviously: than DnD 4e.

Pathfinder is essentially 3.5ed D&D with a bunch of bugfixes. If you've played NWN/ToEE you've a pretty good idea how it works. The entire crunch of the rules is licensed under the OGL. You can look everything up here: http://www.d20pfsrd.com

The base setting - Golarion - is something of a middle ground between Forgotten Realms and Greyhawk. It's as vanilla as fantasy settings get. On the upside, there's a bunch of really good published adventures and campaigns for it. Being 3.5E, it's also fairly easy to port old D&D settings (Eberron being my favourite) to work with it.

Shadowrun is cyberpunk with a dash of fantasy. The base concept is that the entire world has a background magic level that ebbs and flows. When it's high, stuff like mages, elves, orks, trolls and dragons appear. When it's extremely high, lovecraftian horrors appear and DEVOUR soul. When it's low, everyone turns into humans. Shadowrunners are freelance deniable assets, hired by middlemen from megacorporations who've been granted extraterritoriality to go and fuck shit up for their competitors.

Shadowrun rules differ from D&D in that they're skill-based instead of level-based. You gon't have base attack bonusses and saves that go up. You got 12 attributes (4 physical, 4 mental, 4 special) and a bunch of skills that are all keyed to an attribute. You roll skill+attribute+/-circumstancial modifiers # of D6'es vs. a target number. Counting 5's and 6'es as successes. Starting shadowrun characters are (usually) more badass than level 1 d&d characters, but they advance at a much slower rate. Combat is also way more deadly (and usually un undesirable thing to end up in), with the game usually revolving around investigation, legwork and infiltration.

While there are no classes per se in shadowrun, characters usually fall into one (or more) of several archetypes.
- Street Samurai. Lots of weapons, cyberware modifications. Cyborg combat monsters.
- Hackers. Usually dabbling in remote-controlling drones. (Everything from miniature helicopters with SMGs attached to miniature crawlers, to heavily armored vans)
- Spec-ops specialists. similar to street samurai, typically with some cyberware but with a broader focus on non-combat skills
- Mages. (Several flavours). They cast spells and summon spirits to fuck shit up. Tend to wear a giant bullseye and get shot dead because of how absurdly OP they are
- Adepts. The magical version of a street samurai. Use magic to boost their bodies rather than casting spells.
- Faces. Tend to have a ton of contacts and social skills. The face usually has a secondary role as well, as their main role is mostly useful in the planning phase of a job.

The biggest difference between the two systems is where the focus of the rules lie. D&D is mainly concerned with determining how people fight monsters. The typical D&D adventure eventually ends up with the players kicking down multiple doors into rooms with monsters and stabbing them dead. SR4 is mainly built around infiltration and investigation. There are combat rules, but they're nowhere near as elegant/rigid as d&d's rules. Also, one system has magic swords and interesting monsters to slay. The other has trolls with miniguns.
 

Mrowak

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Pathfinder all the way. :salute: Call me cheap, but I never get tired of D&D especially in Pathfinder style.

Regarding the setting, let's do something different than run-off-the-mill Sword Coast. Planescape or Dark Sun sound fun. Hell even FR Thay, Rashemen, or Kara-Tur would be awesome. We could opt for native Pathfinder as well, but we'd better start somewhere more exotic.

If we go Pathfinder will you allow new base classes from Advanced Player's Guide? :bounce:
 
Self-Ejected

Ulminati

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Mrowak said:
We could opt for native Pathfinder as well, but we'd better start somewhere more exotic.

Golarion (native pathfinder) comes with all the classic (cliche) environs. You got the Xen'drik/Chult mysterious jungle in the Mwangi Expanse. There's a FR-style underdark. There's your standard ebil empire in the demon-worshipping cheliax. There's your asian rip-off country whose name escapes me at the moment. There's your icewind dale ripoff lands of the linnorm kings (with added vikings!). Ustalav is basically transsylvania/Karrnath complete vith vampire rulers. Etc. Etc. Etc.

If we end up running a published campaign, I've heard good things about Rise of the Runelord (sword-coast style), Kingmaker (sandbox-y frontier kingdom management), Council of thieves (Urban intrigue in demon-worshipping cheliax) and Carrion Crown (gothic horror in transsylvania-inspired Ustalav). If we're doing something homebrew sandbox(y), I've been meaning to run a pirate campaign for a while. And The Shackles west of the Mwangi expanse make for a nice caribbean-esque setting. If we're doing something homebrew points of light (non-sandbox adventure) I'd probably push for Eberron.

If we go Pathfinder will you allow new base classes from Advanced Player's Guide? :bounce:

Sure. Just as long as we're all agreed that the Chevalier is gimped without his horse and they don't fit inside dungeons. The witch has awesome flavour text but is completely useless 90% of the time. Gunslingers are cool, but reload times are a kick in the nutsack in actual combat (we'd be using the early firearms table). And the Stink Bomb discovery for alchemists is all kinds of broken and banned forevar!
 

lightbane

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I wish I could join, but unfortunately I'm sure I'll not be able to make it for the sessions. PAthfinder is awesome, especially the Alchemist (a playable Dr Jekill? Fuck yeah!!).

EDIT: Actually, screw that, I might be able to make it depending of the day and the hour we'll play.
 

Angelo85

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I'm totally interested.

My timezone is GMT+1, I'm based in Germany.

Friday/Saturday I have nothing regularly planed. Every second Sunday evening (GMT) there's the Codex Movie Night.

Prior PnP experience is only with the German system The Dark Eye. I never played Shadowrun (but familar with the basic set-up and gameworld) and know DnD/Pathfinder only through CRPGs.

I would prefer a fantasy setting, so Pathfinder would be my game of choice. But my mind is open to Sci-Fi Shadowrunning as well.

Regarding the campaign I would absolutely be OK with with a published campaign / string of adventures.

Maybe to start off the series we could even play a seperate one shot, 1st level introductory module (optionally with pre-gen chars) in order to get to know the group and the mechanics a little better?
I heard there are some good modules in this respect (for DnD at least, not sure about Pathfinder/Shadowrun?). It would also benefit you as GM to see where we players as a group want to take the sessions through our behaviour throughout the introduction session.

Regarding communication were you thinking of Skyping/voice or typed only?

Along with a write-up we could also record or even stream the sessions live.
 
Self-Ejected

Ulminati

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Angelo85 said:
Friday/Saturday I have nothing regularly planed. Every second Sunday evening (GMT) there's the Codex Movie Night.

If at all possible I'll try to avoid collision with the KKKodex Dark Heresy campaign and movie night. But if they run alternating weekends this will probably be impossible.

Regarding communication were you thinking of Skyping/voice or typed only?

Typed, definately. The walls in my apartment are somewhat thin and I try to be considerate towards my neighbours whose bedroom is on the other side of the wall from my computer desk.

Along with a write-up we could also record or even stream the session live.

Since everything will be run through RPTools, I figure I can just post the password/ip when we're about to start and people who are interested can log in as spectators. I'd still prefer to have forumside writeups as well, since they're handy for me to fall back on when I can't remember what happened 3 sessions earlier.

Maybe to start off the series we could even play a seperate one shot, 1st level introductory module (optionally with pre-gen chars) in order to get to know the group and the mechanics a little better?

I was thinking of running a oneshot introduction to RPtools either before, during or after shared character generation. It's too early to say how involved it'll be.
 
Self-Ejected

Ulminati

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Since pathfinder seems to be taking the lead by a comfortable margin already, I'd like to hear peoples input on style of campaign.

Do we want:
-Kick in the door, kill the orcs, take their loot dungeon crawling. Main focus would be exploring dangerous localities pummeling monsters and getting hilariously killed by deadly traps.
-Mystery/Intrigue. some dungeoncrawling, but with more focus on LARPing, skill checks and non-combat encounters.
-Sandbox. The players are given a long-term goal, some resources and some simple mechanics. They formulate a plan and I roll on a bunch of tables. When something happens that catches the players interest we'll expand on that. Main focus will be on LARPing/resource management. Probably with a lot of overland travel.

Should we use:
- A published campaign. This'll reduce the workload and risk of GM burnout. It offers the highest chance of a "fair" and "balanced" adventure. On the other hand, it'll also be more railroaded and we run the risk of someone having already run the adventure before in another group.
- A scratch-built, preplanned campaign. We'll have a detailed DISCUSSion about character goals and player desires and I try my best to cook up a campaign in the style the players want. Encounters will be less balanced and my workload will be bigger, increasing the risk of GM burnout. But it'll allow people to do whatever the fuck they want to a larger degree.
- A loosely detailed playground where we collaborate to fill in the details. Players will be given some control to help define NPCs and localities which reduces GM workload. Areas are "filled in" as we explore the world. This may lead to a lot of OOC DISCUSSion during and between sessions. The overall narrative will probably be weaker than in a scratch-built or prepublished campaign, but it will also be easier to adapt to the fickle whims of the players if they decide whatever we happen to be doing at any one time is banal, boring, shit.
 

Azira

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Now, seeing as I haven't yet committed to this not knowing if I have the resources (read, time) to spare, take my input with a grain of salt.

That being said, I think I'd prefer a campaign that focused mostly on dungeon crawling/combat encounters and less on LARPing.

As for the second vote, I'd say take a published campaign. The less risk of GM burnout the better. And having to rely heavily on OOC discussion isn't something that appeals to me very much.

That's just my take on things. M:
 

SCO

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Does the software have the ability to organize the "next schedule" time.

So for instance the GM writes: next game 7pm in australia, the the guy in western europe gets a nice fat 4am schedule? And cries: "fuck that" in the chat of course.
 

lightbane

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MY timezone is GMT +1 (right now it's 4:54 PM): http://wwp.greenwichmeantime.com/time-z ... ion/spain/

I vote for pathfinder, I'll play as an alchemist, if possible (especifically a chaotic neutral mad-scientist in training).

I too vote for an oneshot introduction adventure, so that everyone learns a bit more about the mechanics and so on (someone should play as a paladin/lawful good knight for extra hilarity).

I've played Rifts (don't ask, that was terrible), Dark Heresy, Rogue Trader and Cthulhutech, but for some strange reason I've never played Dnd, but I assume Pathfinder isn't too hard to play.

About the game's style, a published campaign is fine, I don't care if the game is heavy in dungeon crawling as long as my character is not insta-killed (unless you allow the ability to resurrect to a nearby bonfire or something).
 

Angelo85

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@ Ultimati

Mystery/Intrigue. With possibilities to LARP and a hearty portion of conversation, exploration, non-combat encounters, puzzles/riddles/mysteries. But of course we need dungeon crawling as well... ratio wise 60/40 or 50/50 I wouldn't dare to ask for too much work from you or the group :lol:

A unique and preplanned campaign that ties into the PC's stories and NPC's that are met along the way would be the dream of course, but I still say we should start with a published campaign. We could always branch out from there and it's less workload for you.
Also when playing with an unknown group that also probably will have mixed previous experience with real RPG it's hard to say how the individual players and the group as a whole reacts. Before spending too much effort let's see how it all plays out first. That's my take on it at least.
 

Damned Registrations

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I'd definitely be interested in something like this. I'm somewhat familiar with both DnD and Shadowrun and don't really have a preference for either. I've been dying to play a PnP game for years but never managed to get one off the ground with my friends (lazy fucks won't even make their characters despite claiming interest) and anything I try to get into online dissolves before anything happens.

Regarding campaign type, I'd probably lean a bit towards the dungeon smashing if we're playing Pathfinder. Bit of everything is good though. Wouldn't mind a published campaign at all, you can always tweak things if you want anyways. Though I'd rather see a setting not too cliche. Ebberon always piqued my interest, but I know nothing of Pathfinder setting and little about other DnD settings so again I've got little input there.

Regarding schedule I'm an unemployed bum so I've got free time to spare and won't miss any scheduled time. This usually seems to be what makes these things not happen (A different person not showing up every week and it getting pushed back until everyone gives up) so I'm curious how you're going to handle that. Will you just play an absent player's character for them?
 
Self-Ejected

Excidium

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I've always been curious about Pathfinder, but I can only play on saturday (got another larping group on sunday and I don't like playing on weekdays) and the timezone can be a problem, so I'll just follow the write ups.
 

JagreenLern

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I'm down for some PnP. I've never played Pathfinder, but I find it pretty easy to learn PnP rules. I had DH down after my first game. I can play pretty much any time, so long is it isn't the middle of the goddamn night over here in the wonderful land called New Jersey.

Will someone link to a most certainly not removed from any inventory whatsoever copy of any rulebooks we need?
 

Mrowak

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I volunteer.

GMT+2 here. I am okay with Friday and Saturday evenings/nights.

Campaign type... well I am a storyfag, but lately I've embraced the ways of dungeon rumble. As long as our motivation won't be - look there, GOLD! - but something more sensible I'm fine with 'traditional' dungeon crawling. Published campaign is ok, at least if it's new stuff. I am familiar with some of the classic D&D campaigns, but back in the day played mainly custom-made stuff.
 

Renegen

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Damn Eurothread had to popup before I even noticed it. :rpgcodex:

I'd like to throw my hat into the ring, GMT -5. This means that what's afternoon for you euros is morning for me, but my schedule is quite free. Nights for you is afternoons for me, of course the weekends would be the best.

I'm quite comfortable with Pathfinder and I prefer dungeon crawling, I dont havent too much LARP experience unfortunately.
 
Self-Ejected

Ulminati

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SCO said:
Does the software have the ability to organize the "next schedule" time.

So for instance the GM writes: next game 7pm in australia, the the guy in western europe gets a nice fat 4am schedule? And cries: "fuck that" in the chat of course.

Nah. The software's for running the game, not for bookkeeping and scheduling. I'll make sure the Codex Playground campaign thread always contains an up-to-date "next game night" time/date. If it helps, I'm in the CET timezone. Game time would be afternoon/evening for me. I know that might suck for aussies/kwans but until the world realizes it revolves around me and syncs it sleep schedule, there's not much I can do about that ;)

lightbane said:
I vote for pathfinder, I'll play as an alchemist, if possible (especifically a chaotic neutral mad-scientist in training).

I too vote for an oneshot introduction adventure, so that everyone learns a bit more about the mechanics and so on (someone should play as a paladin/lawful good knight for extra hilarity).

I'd prefer if specific character concepts aren't set down until the first session where we can do some group brainstorming. through the years, I've found the groups that worked best together were the ones where everyone rolled up their characters together as well. Otherwise someone often ends up feeling like they were "forced" to pick a class/race to fill out a party role. Same with alignments, I'd prefer if we had something akin to the party alignment in ToEE so we don't end up having Sir Hugglesnuggles the paladin wailing on Stabbitygal the rogue all the time. :D

JagreenLern said:
Will someone link to a most certainly not removed from any inventory whatsoever copy of any rulebooks we need?

Rules come in three flavours.
1) All the crunch is freely and legally available from http://www.d20pfsrd.com
2) Pretty pictures n shit can be found in the PDF version of the books. If (probably when, given the responses so far) we end up going with pathfinder, I'll upload high-quality bookmarked PDF's to a dropbox account for players.
3) If we end up using a published adventure path (which seems likely at this point), Paizo has released a free player's guide for each of them. It contains some basic background fluff on the area the adventure takes place in, offers adventure hooks for characters and advice for the various classes on how they can fit in with the plot. As well as powergamer tips such as hinting at likely favoured enemies for rangers or telling wizards which schools of magic aren't likely to see much use. Once I've decided which path we're going with I'll link to the relevant player's guide as well as a 3rd party mirror of the PDF if people don't want to sign up for a paizo account.
 

JagreenLern

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Wait, is Pathfinder a D20 game? If so, I should be able to learn it no problem. I used to play 3e DnD all the time, back in the day. Could anyone familiar with Pathfinder give me any hints on the best way to play any sort of necromancer?
 

Azira

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I'm torn here about participating. Living in the same timezone as the GM would work to my advantage, but putting aside x hours every second friday/saturday might not be feasible, so might be I should pass on this otherwise great opportunity.
I really like the Pathfinder system, and I'd love to get some personal experience with the RPtools system as well, as I intend to use it as a GM some time in the future. Having been on the receiving end might be a good idea first.

But what did you have in mind Ulminati? How many hours do you expect to put into this? Once I settled down and started a family of my own I gave up MMORPGs, as I couldn't devote the time necessary, and I didn't want to have to suddenly quit from a dungeon romp and leave the other players hanging, "just" because my child needs a change of diapers.

What I'm coming around to say is, that I'd love to participate, but I'm not sure it'd be fair to the rest of the group. :?

Maybe it'd be better if I were just a spectator. :/
 

Renegen

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JagreenLern said:
Wait, is Pathfinder a D20 game? If so, I should be able to learn it no problem. I used to play 3e DnD all the time, back in the day. Could anyone familiar with Pathfinder give me any hints on the best way to play any sort of necromancer?

Well it has this class called the summoner. His summons last longer or he can summon this permanent companion that you can customize each level up.
 

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