Putting the 'role' back in role-playing games since 2002.
Donate to Codex
Good Old Games
  • Welcome to rpgcodex.net, a site dedicated to discussing computer based role-playing games in a free and open fashion. We're less strict than other forums, but please refer to the rules.

    "This message is awaiting moderator approval": All new users must pass through our moderation queue before they will be able to post normally. Until your account has "passed" your posts will only be visible to yourself (and moderators) until they are approved. Give us a week to get around to approving / deleting / ignoring your mundane opinion on crap before hassling us about it. Once you have passed the moderation period (think of it as a test), you will be able to post normally, just like all the other retards.

Kotor2: I saw the light...

Vaarna_Aarne

Notorious Internet Vandal
Joined
Jun 1, 2008
Messages
34,585
Location
Cell S-004
MCA Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
Xor said:
Vaarna_Aarne said:

:salute:

Although I would argue that Kreia does fill the role of antagonist in KOTOR2 in addition to being the exile's mentor and ally. She's really too complex to be pigeonholed.
I don't think the word ally is a good one for her, at least if her viewpoint is concerned. I used mother figure on purpose there, that's another way in which she sees your relationship.

Yea, I forgot to talk about the whole aspect of her being the betrayer. But keep in mind that she expects you know there will come a time when you will have to face her.
 

tennishero

Novice
Joined
Jan 9, 2011
Messages
404
RPGcodex elitest fags said:
we hate everything and dont give any new games a chance unless they are indie games which no one has heard of so we can make ourselves feel superior by saying we are the only ones who payed them

question:

did it ever occur to anyone on this site, that maybe... just maybe, you can be an rpg fan and enjoy oblivion and bioware classics?

is it not ok to enjoy mainstream games aswell as enjoying indie hits?

is it really so bad having an opinion thats different?

pound for a penny i probably have played more, owned more games than anyone on this site.
i respect why some people dont "get" what makes oblivion a great game.
but you know what i dont get........ the mindless hate

oblivion is one of the few games that sold well enough to allow other companies to try making games in the rpg genre, instread of embracing that, you went against it out of hate

its cool to have an opinion thats different

its not cool to hate for the sake of hating

this site prides itself on its stubborn indie mindedness, but you know what

most of us RPG fans cut our teeth on commerical hits like ultima, wizardry and might and magic

in those days there would have been a small band of elitests who hated on those games because they were different

:salute:
 

am0k

Novice
Joined
May 7, 2007
Messages
16
tennishero said:
RPGcodex elitest fags said:
we hate everything and dont give any new games a chance unless they are indie games which no one has heard of so we can make ourselves feel superior by saying we are the only ones who payed them

question:

did it ever occur to anyone on this site, that maybe... just maybe, you can be an rpg fan and enjoy oblivion and bioware classics?

is it not ok to enjoy mainstream games aswell as enjoying indie hits?

is it really so bad having an opinion thats different?

pound for a penny i probably have played more, owned more games than anyone on this site.
i respect why some people dont "get" what makes oblivion a great game.
but you know what i dont get........ the mindless hate

oblivion is one of the few games that sold well enough to allow other companies to try making games in the rpg genre, instread of embracing that, you went against it out of hate

its cool to have an opinion thats different

its not cool to hate for the sake of hating

this site prides itself on its stubborn indie mindedness, but you know what

most of us RPG fans cut our teeth on commerical hits like ultima, wizardry and might and magic

in those days there would have been a small band of elitests who hated on those games because they were different

:salute:

Name new games that have the writing/quest design/atmosphere of games like F1&2, Arcanum, Torment or VTMB.

And people didn't dislike Obilivion because it was popular, they disliked it because it sucked ass.
 

Vibalist

Arcane
Joined
Jul 21, 2008
Messages
3,585
Location
Denmark
easychord said:
There is nothing about that which I don't understand although I'm nowhere near as big enough of a fan of Star Wars or the philosophy of free will to care all that much. But surely if that central theme has value then it has even more value if it is something the player can choose to follow more closely instead of being obliged to? I'm not really seeing how the party mechanics of the game are justified by this plot other than saying that it sort of worked out in the end so it couldn't have been made any other way.

Couldn't have said it better myself. I can completely understand not liking the fact party members are forced on you in KoTOR2, despite the fact that these party members are crucial to the plot. It could've been handled better.

Eyeball said:
Vibalist said:
Eyeball said:
Decent game, fucked up badly by the abortion of a plot-crucial character that was Kreia.

What is it with all these newfags making controversial claims without backing them up?

You're perfectly aware that most of The Codex consider Kreia a good character, right? So are you just another troll, or would you like to explain what exactly you dislike about her?

Essentially, Kreia was like this.

"Hi, I'm Kreia. I'm an exceptionally uppity old bitch who will never, ever shut up about how everything you do is wrong and stupid. I used to be a Sith and did, in fact, train more than one great Sith master, being indirectly responsible for the deaths of thousands. I clearly have a hidden agenda and attempt to manipulate you every step of the way."

"Right.....so, would you please get the fuck off my ship?"

"No, sorry, I'm a crucial plot characterlololololol! Also, I have a mind-link to you made of SPACE MAGIC, I mean The Force, so I gotta stick by you. Sorry, but the writers couldn't think of any other compelling reason to make you want to keep me around, so they had to resort to Spacemagic."

".....so essentially, I'm stuck with your wrinkly evil ass despite it being completely obvious you're going to backstab me?"

"You got it!"

"Right....how about you sit down in that corner of the spaceship while I ignore you and try to forget you ever existed, you shittily implemented atrocity of a character."

I wouldn't mind Kreia so much if she wasn't so omnipresent in the story. She'd have worked SO much better as some kind of Yodaesque wisewoman you had to visit several times during the story, always subtly trying to manipulate you. As it is, I very quickly got bored of her way too obvious hidden agenda and raged at the game for not letting me get rid of her!

She is the worst party member in history. I would play a mod replacing her with a paedophile Jar Jar Binks. That is how fucking shitty she is.

Other than Kreia, Kotor2 is a good game. Has better combat than KOTOR1, except for the still quite hilariously overpowered force lightning.

Right. This all makes sense, but it still only explains why you dislike having Kreia forced into your party, not why you dislike her as a character.
 

Deleted Member 10432

Guest
Xor said:
Eyeball said:
Essentially, Kreia was like this.

I'm guessing you talked to her once or so before dismissing her entirely, so you missed about half of what was actually going on in KOTOR2. Good job. Either that or you're just an idiot.

She is the worst party member in history.

No. Not even close. Not even remotely close. In fact, you should probably be dumbfucked for saying that.

The King of Comedy said:
A broken, half-assed, unfinished game by Obsidian that totally fucking suck? Never heard that one before!
Oh King of Cock, you so edgy. You so edgy like a fooseball.

Eyeball said:
would have been less irritating than her permanent presence in the spaceship and would also save the developers having to explain why Kreia, an extremely powerful Sith lord, can't just solo every single encounter in the game and doesn't start at level 99. "Oh, she keeps getting killed in battles in order to teach you a lesson!" just doesn't hold much water.

Congratulations, you missed huge swathes of KotOR II's plot!

Xor said:
Also, darth Sion's creepy romance with the female Exile is better written than every Bioware romance ever.
:love:
 

Eyeball

Arcane
Joined
Sep 3, 2010
Messages
2,541
Vibalist said:
Right. This all makes sense, but it still only explains why you dislike having Kreia forced into your party, not why you dislike her as a character.
Because it is so COMICALLY obvious that she's an evil bitch manipulating you at every turn. Her heel turn was about as huge a revelation as Liberace being gay. She even admits to not being truthful to you, being a former Sith and training other Sith lords

AND YOU STILL HAVE TO HAVE HER IN YOUR PARTY! You don't get to give her the boot! This could easily have been implemented into the storyline - if you gave her the boot, she could perhaps manipulate you via a proxy non-suspicious character or Space Magic Mindcontrol one of your more trusted companions to manipulate you instead. But no, you gotta do what the cunting bitch says, despite her clearly evil and manipulative.

This is NOT GOOD STORYWRITING! Fuck, even a JRPG like Chrone Trigger did this better. When you got the option to recruit a superevil megavillain, the game allowed you to recruit him or kill him. In a western RPG, Kreia is an INEXCUSEABLE pile of shit as a character.

Which is a shame, as she could have been a GOOD character if she'd been kept as a peripheral can-I-trust-this-hag-or-not ambiguous advisor rather than as an annoying fucking nag weighing in on every single goddamn situation. Or if it had been just mildly surprising when she turned on you in the end.

And please, what is the non-apologist answer to Kreia not being level 99 at game start when she is also the end-boss with tons of hitpoints and high damage attacks? I don't remember her having any POWWAH UP! moments like the one Vhailor had at the end of PsT. Note that "Oh, she just wanted to teach you to fight, not make it too easy on you!" is a weak excuse. If that was the case, she should have refused to fight entirely and be a non-party NPC like I suggested.
 

Xor

Arcane
Joined
Jan 21, 2008
Messages
9,345
Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Divinity: Original Sin Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Divinity: Original Sin 2
It's obvious that KOTOR2's writing was over your head. I would suggest you play it again, but stupidity isn't something you really outgrow, so I don't know how much good that would do.

I also notice that you aren't responding to any of the comments explaining why Kreia is written the way she is. Even so, at the risk of being ignored, I will attempt to once again explain exactly why you are wrong.

Because it is so COMICALLY obvious that she's an evil bitch manipulating you at every turn. Her heel turn was about as huge a revelation as Liberace being gay. She even admits to not being truthful to you, being a former Sith and training other Sith lords

It's true that Kreia obviously has alterior motives from the moment you meet her, and you can coax a cutscene out of her where she explains that she used to be a Sith after a few influence gains. Her dubious nature isn't supposed to be a secret. The fact that you think it was supposed to be the game's big reveal that Kreia was evil just shows that you have no idea what was actually going on throughout pretty much the entire game.

AND YOU STILL HAVE TO HAVE HER IN YOUR PARTY! You don't get to give her the boot! This could easily have been implemented into the storyline - if you gave her the boot, she could perhaps manipulate you via a proxy non-suspicious character or Space Magic Mindcontrol one of your more trusted companions to manipulate you instead. But no, you gotta do what the cunting bitch says, despite her clearly evil and manipulative.

What is so important about being able to kick people out of your party at will? Seriously, it makes no fucking sense that you would latch onto this as a legitimate complaint. I could see it being a reasonable argument if, for example, the game allowed you to pick and choose other companions but forced Kreia on you, but in both KOTOR and KOTOR2 every single companion is mandatory. I don't see how you could go into KOTOR2 expecting to be able to not take some companions with you when that's the route the original game took.

Also, there is no magic mind control or anything like that involving Kreia. She's with you because what the fuck else would you do.

This is NOT GOOD STORYWRITING! Fuck, even a JRPG like Chrone Trigger did this better. When you got the option to recruit a superevil megavillain, the game allowed you to recruit him or kill him. In a western RPG, Kreia is an INEXCUSEABLE pile of shit as a character.

Yes, speaking of Chrono Trigger, every character is mandatory except Magus. Why don't you hate them?

Also storywriting isn't a word.

Which is a shame, as she could have been a GOOD character if she'd been kept as a peripheral can-I-trust-this-hag-or-not ambiguous advisor rather than as an annoying fucking nag weighing in on every single goddamn situation. Or if it had been just mildly surprising when she turned on you in the end.

No. You do not need to trust Kreia for her to be an effective character. That's the Bioware method, producing a twist at the end of the 2nd act. on the other hand, Kreia herself tells you not to trust her. It is assumed that you won't. When she kills the Jedi counsel and goes to wait for you on Malachor it's not because she's evil, it's because she needs to finish teaching you; it's your final lesson. You overcome the force itself by defeating two Sith incarnations of the dark side, and then surpass your mentor.

And please, what is the non-apologist answer to Kreia not being level 99 at game start when she is also the end-boss with tons of hitpoints and high damage attacks? I don't remember her having any POWWAH UP! moments like the one Vhailor had at the end of PsT. Note that "Oh, she just wanted to teach you to fight, not make it too easy on you!" is a weak excuse. If that was the case, she should have refused to fight entirely and be a non-party NPC like I suggested.

Did you even play the game? Because this is actually explained pretty well. Kreia had her powers stripped by her apprentices, which is why she's just a level 1 nothing when you meet her. She comes to feel the force again, and slowly throughout the entire game her powers return, until they come back fully toward the end. It's a huge part of her character and goes a long way toward explaining her motivations.

What amazes me is that you seem to have latched onto this one instance of railroading and are deriding the hell out of it as "bad writing" when Kreia is one of the best done examples of railroading I can think of. It makes no logical sense at all to abandon her, because you will supposedly die if she does. Why the fuck wouldn't you want her where you can keep an eye on her? That isn't a fucking magic plot device, it's an extension of an actual part of fucking Star Wars lore, it make sense in the setting, and it's fucking explained thoroughly throughout the game.

What pisses me off is whiny little cockbites who come into these threads and piss all over KOTOR2 without even having the decency to try to understand the fucking game. Although I suppose that makes sense, because KOTOR2's plot isn't so obvious that you can understand it without paying attention to the dialog and characters. Still, it doesn't excuse this constant stream of bitching about the game. There are legitimate grievances one can have with KOTOR2 - for example the game moves too slowly in areas, the combat tedious and weak, and the controls are screwy - but the writing is not one of those areas. The story is on par with Torment, weaker in some areas but actually surpassing it in others, especially in the characterization of Kreia, who is far more interesting than Ravel for the active role she assumes in the story's development.

In conclusion, go to hell. You clearly have no idea what you're talking about. Either play KOTOR2 again and actually pay attention, or just shut the fuck up you ignorant fuckwad.
 

Eyeball

Arcane
Joined
Sep 3, 2010
Messages
2,541
IS there actually some kind of dialogue or cut-scene or anything having Kreia explain "My powers are returning!" or something similar? That would explain her suddenly becoming powerful, but if there isn't, this is just fanboy rationalisation of the game writers poorly justifying her turning into a superpowerful antagonist from a wimpy PC.

And I do not think it is unreasonable to want to be able to get rid of a character when said character clearly does not have your best interests at heart. And as for the force-bond: Wouldn't that just make it even MORE nonsensical to bring Kreia along as a party member where she could get killed and take down the both of you? Me, I'd stick her evil conniving ass on a safe planet somewhere and tell her to stay put until I got done saving the galaxy. I could occasionally consult her for hints/tips/manipulation, but she would not be getting in my grill constantly.

Kreia would have been a way better character if you had the option of NOT doing everything she says. If I'd designed the story, I'd have given you the option of telling Kreia to piss off early on, possibly having her return in cutscenes such as the one with Hanharr behind your back, and then having another character give you the same general types of "go here do this" directions that Kreia gave you. Kreia could be Space-Magic mindcontrolling this character or whatever and then reveal herself as the master manipulator and final boss late in the game, haHA!. As it is, her character was simply disappointing.

As for the force-bond itself: I am not a star wars nerd and disregard anything SW apart from the first 3 movies, but as far as I understand it, the entire "force bond" business was invented by the game writers in the first place, meaning this isn't some kind of continuation of time-honoured SW narrative tradition but simply a stupid plot device the writers pulled out of their ass to justify the huge plot hole I keep bitching about here. If I am wrong and the existence of force-bonds was indeed established in the SW comic books and whatever other media there is, I will gladly retract this point.

KOTOR2 doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the same breath as PST, which is the best video game in history, had a more complex story than KOTOR2 and still managed to leave far fewer gaping plot holes than KOTOR2 ever did.

It's still a fun game, but the existence of Kreia makes me actually prefer KOTOR1, despite the even more poorly balanced combat and mildly facepalm-inducing plot twist 2/3rds through the game.
 

Lemon

Arcane
Joined
Dec 7, 2002
Messages
4,592
Eyeball said:
IS there actually some kind of dialogue or cut-scene or anything having Kreia explain "My powers are returning!" or something similar? That would explain her suddenly becoming powerful, but if there isn't, this is just fanboy rationalisation of the game writers poorly justifying her turning into a superpowerful antagonist from a wimpy PC.

Your genuinely retarded, how unfortunate.
 

Jaesun

Fabulous Ex-Moderator
Patron
Joined
May 14, 2004
Messages
37,256
Location
Seattle, WA USA
MCA
Lemon said:
Eyeball said:
IS there actually some kind of dialogue or cut-scene or anything having Kreia explain "My powers are returning!" or something similar? That would explain her suddenly becoming powerful, but if there isn't, this is just fanboy rationalisation of the game writers poorly justifying her turning into a superpowerful antagonist from a wimpy PC.

Your genuinely retarded, how unfortunate.

Yeah, obvious troll is obvious.
 

Lockkaliber

Magister
Patron
Joined
Apr 27, 2009
Messages
2,542
Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
The force bond between Bastilla and Revan was a major theme in the first KotOR. Avellone just made it more interesting.

Also, for the people that haven't figured this out yet: we are dealing with a droog-kun
 

Xor

Arcane
Joined
Jan 21, 2008
Messages
9,345
Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Divinity: Original Sin Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Divinity: Original Sin 2
Yeah it occurred to me that I was getting trolled. Still pisses me off.
 

Commissar Draco

Codexia Comrade Colonel Commissar
Patron
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Messages
20,856
Location
Привислинский край
Insert Title Here Strap Yourselves In Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Divinity: Original Sin 2
Xor you're true Bro :love:

I'm nearing the end of my dark side playthrou with my Darth Draco:

118440_1.jpg



Kinda looks lie Hans Closs. :roll:

And enjoying it ten times more than Dragon Turd 2. Only thing lacking is the opurtunity to kill force and free the galaxy from it's bonds so KOTOR3 MMO popamole woud not exist but even Chris Avelone is not that Allmighty I guess. :salute:
 

Vaarna_Aarne

Notorious Internet Vandal
Joined
Jun 1, 2008
Messages
34,585
Location
Cell S-004
MCA Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
Eyeball said:
IS there actually some kind of dialogue or cut-scene or anything having Kreia explain "My powers are returning!" or something similar? That would explain her suddenly becoming powerful, but if there isn't, this is just fanboy rationalisation of the game writers poorly justifying her turning into a superpowerful antagonist from a wimpy PC.

And I do not think it is unreasonable to want to be able to get rid of a character when said character clearly does not have your best interests at heart. And as for the force-bond: Wouldn't that just make it even MORE nonsensical to bring Kreia along as a party member where she could get killed and take down the both of you? Me, I'd stick her evil conniving ass on a safe planet somewhere and tell her to stay put until I got done saving the galaxy. I could occasionally consult her for hints/tips/manipulation, but she would not be getting in my grill constantly.

Kreia would have been a way better character if you had the option of NOT doing everything she says. If I'd designed the story, I'd have given you the option of telling Kreia to piss off early on, possibly having her return in cutscenes such as the one with Hanharr behind your back, and then having another character give you the same general types of "go here do this" directions that Kreia gave you. Kreia could be Space-Magic mindcontrolling this character or whatever and then reveal herself as the master manipulator and final boss late in the game, haHA!. As it is, her character was simply disappointing.

As for the force-bond itself: I am not a star wars nerd and disregard anything SW apart from the first 3 movies, but as far as I understand it, the entire "force bond" business was invented by the game writers in the first place, meaning this isn't some kind of continuation of time-honoured SW narrative tradition but simply a stupid plot device the writers pulled out of their ass to justify the huge plot hole I keep bitching about here. If I am wrong and the existence of force-bonds was indeed established in the SW comic books and whatever other media there is, I will gladly retract this point.

KOTOR2 doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the same breath as PST, which is the best video game in history, had a more complex story than KOTOR2 and still managed to leave far fewer gaping plot holes than KOTOR2 ever did.

It's still a fun game, but the existence of Kreia makes me actually prefer KOTOR1, despite the even more poorly balanced combat and mildly facepalm-inducing plot twist 2/3rds through the game.
Force-bond was used very badly in KotOR1, and it was used in the Expanded Universe before that.

Already on Peragus, Kreia tells you that her connection to the Force is returning, and on Telos she explains it's because of the Force-bond.

I think I should bring up that Kreia is not the only one who has a Force-bond with the Exile, she's simply the only one whose bond was revealed and who knows about the nature of the Exile. EVERYONE in the party has a "Force-bond" with the Exile, because it is the nature of the Exile as a hole in the Force to bond into Force Sensitives in a fashion similar to actual Force-bonds. And because of their bond with the Exile, the Exile's power over the Force returns, further augmented by the fact that like Nihilus he also consumes the Force of beings that die around him. And the party member's connection to the Exile enhances their Force Sensitivity (a lot of them probably couldn't master the Force without it, with only Brianna and Atton being fairly certainly strong enough in the Force), and in Kreia's case restore her connection to the Force.

Kreia is with you because she is the only one who can teach you, and because she is the only one who understands what the Sith you face are. And she makes it perfectly clear that her utmost concern is to train you and teach you. Kreia is also the only one who understands the Exile's condition, which is why she prepares you for the time you have to make a choice between destroying the Force or not to. And she is teaching you to become a teacher yourself, by helping you see beyond the Jedi and the Sith. In fact, most of this bitching seems to come from the fact that Kreia chastises you from being Bioware Good or Bioware Evil.

It also bears mention that you aren't out to save the Galaxy in KotOR2. It's a personal journey. Even the Jedi misunderstood the situation, because the only actual threat to the Galaxy was Darth Nihilus and after Miraluka he had condemned himself to certain death before he could cause widespread destruction. Telos would have been his last victim no matter how it turned out.
 

Commissar Draco

Codexia Comrade Colonel Commissar
Patron
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Messages
20,856
Location
Привислинский край
Insert Title Here Strap Yourselves In Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Divinity: Original Sin 2
It's personal journey but it's mentioned a few times by Kreya, Visa Marr and Vaklu that your PC can become thanks to his talent to forge bonds and influence either Force Killer or the fist Emperor and thus influence entire galaxy. Being hole in the force means thay you cannnot be manipualted by it and you can forge your own destini in contrast most Jedi and Sith are close minded pupets fighting over religius dogma. Played light sider a few years ago due to my undying hatred and contemt towards hippie psudo pacifism and budhist fagotry but IRC you're to rebuild new Jedi order closer to real live and true humanity. Jedi and Sith are only titles in KOTOR and Kreya is just a wounded human without the force in the start, neither good nor evil. She guide you to destroy both corrupt Jedi masters and Sith Lords but you have to in in the end confront and outgrow her. Kotor plot is very Nitchean so I'm not suprised that halo fed sheeple can't undertand it. :rpgcodex:
 

denizsi

Arcane
Joined
Nov 24, 2005
Messages
9,927
Location
bosphorus
Is there a fixes only mod that, duh, only fixes the whatever bugs remain after the last official patch?
 

Quetzacoatl

Liturgist
Joined
Feb 13, 2011
Messages
1,819
Location
Aztlán
Why doesn't Eyeball go to rpgwatch? I heard the place is more tolerant of retardation than here.
 

Xor

Arcane
Joined
Jan 21, 2008
Messages
9,345
Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Divinity: Original Sin Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Divinity: Original Sin 2
Vaarna_Aarne said:
Plot explanation


............./´¯/'...'/´¯¯`·¸
........../'/.../..../......./¨¯\
........('(...´...´.... ¯~/'...')
.........\.................'...../
..........''...\.......... _.·´
............\..............(
 

Eyeball

Arcane
Joined
Sep 3, 2010
Messages
2,541
Vaarna_Aarne said:
Force-bond was used very badly in KotOR1, and it was used in the Expanded Universe before that.
Well argued post, VA.

But I don't recall it being the type of "I die you die!" plot device I'm raging against here, which I maintain was used by lazy writers who couldn't come up with anything better without resorting to SPACE-MAGIC!

If she did indeed mention something about her powers returning during the cause of the game, I retract my complaint about her suddenly turning superbadass. That would be adequate explanation.

And my dislike of her is not just due to her constant bitching, it's due to her obviously manipulating you without the game giving you the option to, you know, do something else, consult someone else, do anything but constantly following the advice of HitlerStalin. This could have been done ten times better and would most likely have been done better if the devs had time to actually finish the game. I seem to recall reading about them working on multiple endgame paths where the whitehaired lady could become Darth Treya and the final game boss.

Incidentally, Krap, I find it adorable how you try to suck up to the big boys by dogpiling on the more senior newbie who has an unpopular opinion. Really, it's quite precious.
 

Vaarna_Aarne

Notorious Internet Vandal
Joined
Jun 1, 2008
Messages
34,585
Location
Cell S-004
MCA Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
I don't remember what the cut content restored by Droid Planet restoration patch was, but Lonna Vash had some information pertaining to the Force Bond you and Kreia have, and there's more to the lethal connection than it seems at first sight.

Kreia isn't ever really manipulating you in any fashion. Now, she is working behind your back to set up your final lesson, but she is never manipulating you in any way that isn't meant to be part of your training. I'm not entirely sure where you keep pulling these HitlerStalin comparisons either. Kreia isn't exactly good, but she certainly isn't evil either. She's very much a pragmatic and realist, but leaves morals for you to find, only scolding you if you don't think of the consequences of your actions.
 

Commissar Draco

Codexia Comrade Colonel Commissar
Patron
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Messages
20,856
Location
Привислинский край
Insert Title Here Strap Yourselves In Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Divinity: Original Sin 2
Eyeball you can lie to her about being able to read thoughts of Bao Dur for example, pick and influence the companions she don't aprove, make other choices it's not that you're completly at her mercy. just don't skip the dialogue and invest your points in persuesion skill from the very start. :smug:
My inteligent lawfull evil sith playthrou just crashed thanks to USM mod. :x If you want to play KOTOR2 with RP don't install any mod changing dialogue... or to be save any mod at all. Ah and choose Revan to be light sided. Seems it's time to embrace the way of pasivness and pacifism. My pansy do gooder Jedi Jesus awaits. : x
 

Commissar Draco

Codexia Comrade Colonel Commissar
Patron
Joined
Mar 6, 2011
Messages
20,856
Location
Привислинский край
Insert Title Here Strap Yourselves In Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Divinity: Original Sin 2
Completed it as Jedi Mother Theresa. ;), At last it's game worth playing unlike modern popamole. All quests and lines are completed aside Boa Dur's. Glory to Moders, Shame on Publishers for rushing it. :love:
 

KOTORN00b

Novice
Joined
Jun 1, 2010
Messages
6
I won't comment on the obvious trolling (over whether Kreia was a well implemented character) as I think it has been ably defended both in this thread, in other threads here on Codex, and here. I will ask those that played TSLRCM 1.7 on what they think could be improved upon that could be implemented in version 1.8 of TSLRCM.
 

As an Amazon Associate, rpgcodex.net earns from qualifying purchases.
Back
Top Bottom