Questions concerning Classic RPGs

[Otaku_Hanzo]

Not only that, but climbing and slowfall potions let you effectively give a thief levitation without relying on magic skills.

Hehe. One of my fondest memories of Daggerfall is my rooftop runs in Sentinel to avoid the guards. In the residential areas of that city, the buildings are close enough to each other that if you have a high jump skill, rooftop escapes were easy. Add to that a good climb skill and all you had to do was run and jump your way to the city wall, climb up and over, and make your escape. Being a thief in Daggerfall is probably one of the best experiences of the game.

 

[Amerestatistic]

Heh wow, that last post alone makes me interested as hell in DF. It's definitely on my list of "Old RPGs I actually have to go pay for here soon" right in between Wizardry Gold and Darklands.

 

[Otaku_Hanzo]

Heh wow, that last post alone makes me interested as hell in DF. It's definitely on my list of "Old RPGs I actually have to go pay for here soon" right in between Wizardry Gold and Darklands.

Darklands is another good game for playing a thief character, just from a different perspective. Be warned though, Darklands is one of those games that border on realism. Being a thief is not easy, but once mastered, pays off extremely well in the end.

I love the thief experience from Daggerfall better myself though. It's almost like that game was made for thieves. I just wish the Thieves' Guild was more fleshed out than it is.

 

[jsaving]

Getting back to the original question...

If you are interested mainly in seeing how the CRPG genre has developed over time, the obvious path would be Proving Grounds and Exodus and Wasteland, then some of the Gold Box titles, then Ultima IV through the Black Gate, which will take you to the end of the "classic" RPG era. At that point you'd move on to Fallout and Planescape and the original Baldur's Gate, and from there to Fallout 2 and BG2, perhaps throwing in a Morrowind title for good measure. You'd conclude with Neverwinter Nights and Temple of Elemental Evil, two games that hint at possible new directions for the genre (directions you may not like but should be aware of nonetheless).

On the matter of defining a CRPG, it's obviously no easy task, but to me it's important to define some of the genres that are "in the neighborhood" first. Once you've done that, the definition of a CRPG starts to come into focus. There are "adventure" games that focus on traveling from one place or another, "action" games that focus on killing monsters, and "strategy" games that focus on moving your characters in exactly the right way. If CRPGs are different from these genres, they're different in two respects. First, you control how your character develops over time. And second, your interactions with others in the game world affect how they develop over time.

On the Ultima series, I'd say it's closer to a CRPG than an adventure game, but you make a legitimate point about having only limited control over character development (yours and others). Call it an "adventure RPG" or an "RPG with adventure elements"...

 

[Mad_Dog]

How do you order Daggerfall from bethesda? It isn't listed anywhere on their site....

 

[Amerestatistic]

Getting back to the original question...

If you are interested mainly in seeing how the CRPG genre has developed over time
, the obvious path would be Proving Grounds and Exodus and Wasteland, then some of the Gold Box titles

Getting first-hand knowledge of the history of the genre is definitely a big part of it, yes.

...then Ultima IV through the Black Gate,which will take you to the end of the "classic" RPG era. At that point you'd move on to Fallout and Planescape and the original Baldur's Gate, and from there to Fallout 2 and BG2, perhaps throwing in a Morrowind title for good measure.

Outside of Morrowind I've played all those to varying degrees.

Infinity engine games run terribly on my PC but I've managed to play Torment and BG2 a bit as well, although I've finished neither.

You'd conclude with Neverwinter Nights and Temple of Elemental Evil, two games that hint at possible new directions for the genre (directions you may not like but should be aware of nonetheless).

Genuine experience with NWN is probably good even if it doesn't sound particularly appealing. As soon as I manage to play Arcanum, ToEE is next.

 

[Otaku_Hanzo]

How do you order Daggerfall from bethesda? It isn't listed anywhere on their site....

Hmmm... I noticed that too. Well, they did have it up for sale on their site as well as Arena. Maybe they are reworking them and gonna rerelease both titles. One can always wish.

 

[Elwro]

[. Well, they did have it up for sale on their site as well as Arena. Maybe they are reworking them and gonna rerelease both titles. One can always wish.

I also heard something about that - as if they were adapting both games to modern operating systems and changing the graphics. Nothing official, though.