Preview Age of Decadence Combat Peek at RPGVault

[Kos_Koa]

To be honest, I expected much less. It really looks great.

 

[Vault Dweller]

The dodge animation will be replaced. The overall pace will be improved (faster animations, running instead of walking, etc).

Just out of curiousity, were these changes already planned or are they a result of the feedback?

Feedback. Every time we post something, I carefully gather all criticism/suggestions/requests and then we go through them, item by item and discuss. It's very easy to overlook something when you are spending months and years on it, so the feedback is very important.

 

[Lord Chambers]

Boy, the bitter, exaggerated, mocking that comprises 50% of the Codex sure never gets old. I'm glad to see it on a another site like RPG Watch.

 

[Twinfalls]

Looks terrific, the animations are smooth and impressive. Once it's all sped up, combat's going to rawk!

 

[xedoc gpr]

As I said in the other thread, I like the look and feel of the game, the animations are much more fluid then I expected, and agree with the criticism about the pacing (the walking especially was odd), but since you'll fix it, then there's no problem. I thought the music was well-done, though I think that if the same music appeared in Oblivion, everyone would probably be bashing it.

 

[Romitch]

I like it, look forward to playing. I agree with many of the sentiments expressed already so no need to rehash. Overall, nice work VD and team.

Regarding the sound effects, do you not have the team resources available (I'm sure your resources are pretty limited all around), or are you waiting until later in development to decide what your team will be able to implement?

One minor nitpick that I debated mentioning at all (since the purpose was to check out combat) is a typo in the text - there's a double "and" when the Ranger's death is described (I definitely like the descriptions btw). Of course, the greater concern is with the gameplay, design, etc. which are looking great.

The Fallout influence is a huge plus - seems like you guys are on the right track.

 

[Rei]

Waiting for the video to d/l.

July 30, 2007 - In the centuries since the empire crumbled, no faction has achieved dominance; what exists is an unstable balance between true equilibrium and anarchy.

I thought balance was equilibrium... what is 'true equilibrium'?

No, whoever taught you chemistry is wrong.

 

[Mr.Rocco]

My critique:

Music was disappointing. I was expecting something little more different or original but it's same ol' genetic fantasy crap I hear all the time in other games. Even though I hated Arcanum music, at least it was some what original.

Dodging animation was odd and didn't quite look right. When you get stab/cut, you won't open your arms and flap like a bird.

Someone already mentioned before, disappearing act on your weapon also looked strange.

 

[Pegultagol]

I must say, the combat footage certainly brought recollections of good times had by turn based combat within the RPG setting. Thank you for bringing it up with the rest of the folks here, not to mention considering the feedback thoroughly given out. The interface looks good, so do the animations in their current state. Please keep up the good work.

 

[Prunesquallor]

I expected far less in terms of graphics. Really pretty and shiny.
I think implementing a few basic soundeffects would really add much more to combat then further tweaking the animations. I am not too fond of the music, but it doesn't bother me as I always turn the music off after the first few hours.

 

[The_Pope]

Woah this new combat system is an innovative way of enhancing immersion. Why didn't anyone ever think of it before?

 

[franc kaos]

Wow! Haven't really paid much attention to this game before (checked out a few screen shots ages ago), but the graphics are looking superb. Not a great fan of turnbased either, but played it in Fallout etc, prefered Baldurs Gate pause system, but this looks really nice, and the story sounds good.

Just one tiny nitpick, hardly worth mentioning (and may be a result of turn based gameplay), but when you critical strike that guy, with nice descriptive text, would he really be able to then dodge any moves after that (what with torn and bleeding internal organs and all)? I would have thought a crit strike would have then left any NPC awaiting the killing blow.

With this and Afterfall (if it ever comes out), the future is def looking better for A(ctual)RPG's.

 

[Nedrah]

You should really, really try to get some sound in there. Generic sounds for normal actions, something with some "BAM" for the crits - maybe some flesh into steel sound for swords, a bones being broken for the hammer, something sickening. Also, there seems to be too little visual feedback. Needs more varying degrees of gore, at least there should be different amounts of blood being splattered depending on damage - and it'd be nice if some of it would persist on the ground. Dodging animations and combat pacing have already been mentioned.

 

[hiciacit]

Apart from what others have already mentioned (slow motion, disappearing weapon when dodging) this looks great.

Seemed like combat AI was decent as well, although it could have been an artifact of the PC standing against a wall in a narrow corridor, but I liked how the NPCs surrounded the PC and the archer seemed to make sure to keep his distance. Is there any sort of 'group AI', whatever that may mean, or did they just look for the optimal position one at a time?

Also, the music is very 'in your face' now. Turning it down a little and adding sound effects could really boost the atmosphere, I think. Judging from your comments earlier on, I'm assuming there's noone wotking on sound effects yet?

 

[Naked Ninja]

VD, if you are looking for some cheap sounds give this a try : http://www.garagegames.com/products/137/

Its a pretty affordable sound effect pack, I've bought it for my own use for Scars, it has a variety of environmental, movement and weapon-clash sounds. It's quite decent.

The Arcane FX pack I mentioned before would help you easily create blood sprays and ground splats (decals) too. One of the example spells does something very similar (although it uses more cartooney graphics in the demo).

Hehe, I probably sound like a GG pimp, don't I? Ah well. Just passing along some stuff that I found helpful. :wink:

 

[Bradylama]

The creature demo sounds like gay sex through a voice filter.

 

[Naked Ninja]

Yeah :D , but the weapon sounds aren't bad.

 

[Ismaul]

Looks real nice in action. I like the new grid colors. And good job fixing the stretched textures. The menu for combat action is sure to come in handy, and the interface looks even better live. This is full of win.

But (had to be a but, right?), pacing has to be fixed, like you'll do. Still, the anims are pretty good on their own. Other than that, I think the audio needs some boost. Good sound effects will really enhance the combat experience, make it more believable. A raw *clang* is very satisfying, even if it means the opponent blocked.


The only disappointing part of the video is the music, sadly (or not? I'm glad the rest is shaping up great). Generic and uninspired come to mind. the game presents a post-apocalyptic setting. I don't think the music fits. It doesn't sound nothing like decadence, not even a hint of it. It's more like "The time is doom, but I teh hero will prevail". I also don't think bowed strings give the impression of a roman-inspired setting. A harsher sound might be more appropriate. Metal and wood, I say. Metallic and woody percussions added to the usual ones, wood winds and brass (their quantity and proheminence depending on their sound quality). For strings, go with plucked ones : lute-like instruments, harp, maybe add something oriental like the sitar. Also, might be a good thing to check out the Rome series for ideas on sonority and inspiration.

Plus, the low quality of the virtual instruments used really doesn't help when exploited to that extent, in so many layers. The violins and the other instruments doing the pad (the background "ambiance") are leading the track, so their low quality is all over there. Brass and especially bowed strings are really hard to recreate virtually. I'd suggest keeping those types of instruments as support for others that sound better. Percussions are a good thing to rely on, maybe even bring to the front. They usually sound decent enough. Plucked strings too. But mashing many layers of badly sounding strings that all have their own theme is a receipe for failure. Basically, play the instruments you have to your advantage: use their strength, try to hide their weaknesses.

Last, silence is your friend. I know what we heard was the combat music, but still. Silence lets the music and the listener breathe. Silence breaks the monotony. That in particular is a fault of the combat song, rythm is constant, instruments too. No accentuation. The bowed strings keep on an on, not a single stop. Makes for a lack of character. Also, there is a distinct lack of playing with the sonority. It might be the low quality of the instruments that are playing against the track, but the (seemingly) invariant volume levels and absent accents don't help. Silence and nuance really enhance the sounds that are played, makes them come out. As a plus, silence is never low quality.


Well, that might all be more useful to the composer. Hope it helps.

 

[Section8]

Meh, didn't seem overly slow to me, but make sure that slider is in there anyway, since it's one of those simple things you can do to make turn-based more accessible without actually compromising the system.

On the whole, it looks to capture Fallout-style combat pretty well, and that's pretty fucking good from where I sit. Hope we'll get to see some of the more interesting tactics like use of nets and alchemical weapons sometime soon.

:thumbs up:

Edit: Oh, and can we scroll/rotate the screen with the keyboard, and turn off screen edge mouse scrolling/rotating? I prefer keyboard interaction since it's more immediate, and keeps camera positioning from become a trial of patience.

Edit2: I think the combat taunts need a starker contrast to what is likely to be a fairly typical background colour. I didn't even notice them first time through.

 

[Longshanks]

Impressive. A few minor gripes that have already been mentioned, but the overall level of animation was good and the graphics were fine.

 

[jeansberg]

I would just like to say a few things...

First off, the spear in the chest made me say, "Yarrrr!" out loud (yol?)

Also, the music was great. Did we ever get a name of the composer who is doing it?

A couple of gripes, the dodge animation basically looks like he's in a movie chase scene and is hitting the brakes at the edge of a cliff. It'll get old watching that, but it's not a terrible concern. Perhaps a mere shift of weight away from the attacker and high arms, but no jazz hands, would work.

The combat seemed very much to be a slow continuous turn-based type of deal. Are actions queued? I think the ability to queue actions with a "clear" for the backlog might help, but may also take away from the involvement in combat. Basically it's just real-time with sluggish pace and no pause, then? Hmm.

It would be great to have options. A continuous turn-based with a pace slider and pausing/queues might be nice (as it incorporates many elements and allows players to choose their poison.)

It'll be a nice compromise between the "It's too fast!" and "It's too slow!" crowds, but you'll probably get that either way.


All in all, still very interested in many future yollings I'll have.

Just to make it clear. The combat in the game will be turn-based.

 

[Black]

God damned, it's not turn-based, it's completely new system called XTREME or something... Can't you people read? Turn-based is previous-gen, no one is making turn-based games anymore.

 

[MF]

It looks good. I don't care about the animations much, but speeding them up may be better.
I do care about sound, however. I'm an auditive person. I know you're not going to do voice-acting of course, but combat sounds are easy to come by and add a lot to the atmosphere. Clashes, grunts, footsteps. In cities, you will also want ambient chatter noises.

It's not hard to implement, and completely ignoring the stimulation of one of our senses is rather harsh.

As for the music. It's definitely not bad, but like someone already mentioned, I believe it doesn't convey a sense of decadence or any feeling of a post-apocalyptic nature.
Listen to The intro music for Warcraft 1. It's haunting, dark and deep. If you listen past the ancient MIDI render, you'll hear the same bombastic quality in instrumentation, but a much more haunting feel. A composer not afraid of using diminshed chords and dissonant harmonies to create a sense that something is 'wrong', rather than a sense that something is 'awesome'. Fallout also did great with the ambient music, but I don't think that would fit AoD.

If the music is already final, are there examples of a more post-apocalyptic feel in the score? The first few seconds with the viola sound more fitting, even though I'd prefer an unbowed instrument when picturing a setting inspired by ancient Rome. The battle music is far too bombastic for my tastes though.

BTW, what's up with "but chokes on blood filling his throat and and collapses" in 1:40? Unedited text or a string concatenation error?

 

[Sitra Achara]

Hmm, one thing the Codex forgot to bitch about is the AI. Since you're wearing heavy armor, why aren't they using more power attacks or called shots? As far as I can tell the AI never used those, just normal/fast attack (for melee anyway).

As for the animations, if you can shave a second off the recoil from hit animation, make the dodge more snappy, and make fast attacks actually fast, then I'm happy.

Aside from this, I like it. The music, the disarm, the spear death animation, the attack selection menu (go Flashback!), all great. And you should be encouraged by the lack of complaints about graphics, I think that's a first

Postscript: Ah, one more complaint. When your character gets disarmed, where does the weapon go? I can't see it on the floor. Also, I think it would be more natural to leave the empty slot as the active slot rather than switch to the other one (currently the crossbow pops up immediately after the disarm).

 

[psycojester]

Overall i liked it, my two criticisms are the animation/ modeling of the PC's hand-cross bow and the dodge animation.

Possibly something with a bit more of a duck and weave feel to it, less of the chicken dance evasion.