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Torment Torment: Tides of Numenera Thread

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Lurker King

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It definitely isn't going to be good if it tanks completely. Chances are the lesson to learn here ends up being the wrong one, and shit's only going to get worse for everyone (what ever people might think of inXile and their practices and what ever their product quality thus far, it's one of those few studios that at least tries).

There are two lessons to be learned here. The first one is that Fargo is still the same from the times of Interplay, but this time he is not surround by the same talent that made him look good despite his fuck ups. The second one, is that it doesn't matter how bad developers fool and mistreat their audience, or how bad their games are, you will still find deluded players rationalizing their fuck ups with all kinds of excuses ("they are indies!", "they were trying to be original, we must support them", "they choose TB", "PS:T wasn't so good", etc.).
 

Chris Avelltwo

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Do you beeeelieeeeve in life after love?
 
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What the fuck is up with inXile support?

Inspiring Presence bug still not fixed. In fact, zero patches since launch. Outsourced development to India?
Fargo is too busy firing most of his people due to bad sales.

It's like Silicon valley...
The big boss takes full responsibility for his company's failure and fire everyone who had something to do with the product...
 
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Lurker King

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Honestly, guys, why is this game flopping so hard?

The reviews were fine, especially the PC ones.

What a mystary!

Dude, more than half of the positive reviews are one liners from people who barely played the game. Just look and see for yourself. It doesn't matter what people say, what matters is what they do. In fact, I'm starting to suspect that most people that are saying they enjoyed the game are deluding themselves because they think they should support inXile no matter what.

So what seems to be the problem? Is it the weirdness of the setting? Is it isometric RPG fatigue? I'm really hesitant to say it's codex shitstorm that made much of a difference.

How about "the game is flopping because it's an overdescriptive garbage with unimaginative quests, shallow mechanics and non-existent combat"?
 
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Luckmann

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lol
I've created a thread (on inXile forum) criticizing Torment for SJW propaganda (giving examples) and they've deleted it and gave me a warning (Zombra specifically). Political correctness uber alles.

They did nothing wrong
You're confusing inXile with Hitler. I know it's a common mistake these days, what with the unwarranted vilification of Hitler, but the distinction is crucial.
 

hexer

Guest
that Greek reviewer's diss from day 1 is still unparallelled
who woulda thunk he was right about everything

Yeah, I doubt those 10/10 reviews were honest.

Because all the 0/10 are? People never get butthurt over some petty shit and then start actively trashing the game all over the webz to "punish" the devs like the aspie manchildren they are?

Nothing deserves 10/10 except maybe a superposition of the entire universe.
Read the Greek review and you will find that explained all his arguments for scoring it at 6/10
 
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Lurker King

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There are two lessons to be learned here. ...

Lessons learned by them on their road to getting better at what they do is what I meant. The ones you gave are common knowledge.

If you think they have the humility to improve and change, you are deluding yourself. Fargo is still the same and persists in the same mistakes. He will blame everyone, from backers, and the Codex to the people he hired, but not himself.

They definitively spoiled us back then.

Spoiled my foot. They were competent back then and everything was better: combat systems, 2d art, portraits, etc.
 
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Habbonovio

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Honestly, guys, why is this game flopping so hard?

The reviews were fine, especially the PC ones. I think overall they were better than the ones for Wasteland 2. The game had a lot of publicity behind it, clearly more than Wasteland as well.

So what seems to be the problem? Is it the weirdness of the setting? Is it isometric RPG fatigue? I'm really hesitant to say it's codex shitstorm that made much of a difference.

Niche, tl;dr-race, very vocal ass/v/urgers with no criteria complaining loudly about every aspect of the game on the specialized communities, InXile cutting tons of content and not delivering +10 achieved stretch goals...

Pick your poison.
 

t

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Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
Dude, more than half of the positive reviews are one liners from people who barely played the game.
I meant press. Day 1 purchases are usually not informed by people who already played the game and post on steam, but by people who played before ("journos" or hacks).

How about "the game is flopping because it's an overdescriptive garbage with unimaginative quests, shallow mechanics and non-existent combat"?
Yeah, that is all fine and dandy, but is it really how the video game market works? That people wait until the steam reviews, read them carefully and decide? Well, not in AAA cases, that's for sure. So I think the actual reason for why the game did poorly at release cannot be connected to merit, but to some general principle, like looks -- the game looked too weird -- or general isometric RPG fatigue.
 

Maculo

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Strap Yourselves In Pathfinder: Wrath
The Greek review caused some butthurt in the comments: http://ragequit.gr/reviews/item/torment-tides-of-numenera-pc-review-english

Cranky_messiah
this is legitimately one of the absolute worst, most ridiculous reviews that I have ever read in my life, and I implore everybody to take it with a huge grain of salt (if not outright ignore it). It's like you somehow managed to completely miss the point of the game. There is nothing objective about this review. You obviously had a very specific, concrete idea of what you personally thought the game should be, and are lashing out because it didn't fit your own personal vision. The game is fantastic. The writing and the characters are fantastic, and the dialogue and lore have a huge amount of depth. If you actually take the time to experience it, which you obviously didn't do. You say thing that are so ridiculous that it's almost like you didn't even bother trying to experience the game once you realized it wasn't what you personally expected. The comments about there not being multiple ways to solve problems or progress are just completely absurd. You either didn't even try to replay things multiple ways, or you're lying. There is no other way to explain such an inaccurate comment. I replayed my first visit to Sagus Cliffs numerous times, and each time was completely different from the others. You either didn't actually try different methods, or you're being disingenuous. And saying that Planescape is better looking is just blatantly idiotic and dishonest, and completely discredits everything else you say. I love planescape, but it's graphics are downright awful compared to numenera. It's sincerely idiotic to even compare the two. Planescape isn't even in the same league. Not even remitely approaching the same league. Take off your rose-colored glasses and join the real world. and while you're at it, stop acting like a petulant child and try to gain some modicum of objectivity. Because this review is an absolute embarrassment. I hope you look back on it some day and realize how awful and embarrassing it truly is.

Does YES! have another alt?
 

Mortmal

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I think one of the reasons why it's not selling, beside inXile pissing off core audience with simultaneus console versions is the marketing and trailers. They spell out the fucking story in the trailer, if they'd left enough to be a mystery and for players to find out, I think there'd be more positive buzz around the game.
10 min in the game,you already know the story and can pretty much guess what will happen.
 

Jarpie

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Codex 2012 MCA
The peole giving negative reviews because of the huge cuts and undelivered promises during Kickstarter are COMPLETELY right to leave negative reviews. One of the few ways to teach them a lesson on not fucking around and behaving like asshats is to tank the game due fucking up the development.

Let inXile sink and be a warning to the future devs.
 

a cut of domestic sheep prime

Guest
  • Novella. Originally 7 planned. 1 cut.
Honestly, are there any bigger wastes of development time than novellas? I'm paying you to make a game, not write fan-fiction for it.

Well, if I actually payed you, which I didn't. :M
 

Jarpie

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Codex 2012 MCA
I think one of the reasons why it's not selling, beside inXile pissing off core audience with simultaneus console versions is the marketing and trailers. They spell out the fucking story in the trailer, if they'd left enough to be a mystery and for players to find out, I think there'd be more positive buzz around the game.
10 min in the game,you already know the story and can pretty much guess what will happen.

Well, they would've needed to change that too...although I do wonder if that became necessary due cuts, as the mainstory (as far as I've gotten into the game) seems pretty damn shallow.
 

Parabalus

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The Greek review caused some butthurt in the comments: http://ragequit.gr/reviews/item/torment-tides-of-numenera-pc-review-english



Does YES! have another alt?

That Greek review is pretty on point, just a bit too hard on the game for my taste but a good read. :incline:

Well, they would've needed to change that too...although I do wonder if that became necessary due cuts, as the mainstory (as far as I've gotten into the game) seems pretty damn shallow.

I wasn't too bothered by the initial reveals, fully expecting a plethora of subtle (and less so) twists and turns in the plot, since the information you are given is mostly from an imperfect rumor-mill, leaving lots of room for maneuvering in the details. Nothing of the sort happened.:M
 
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Lacrymas

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Pathfinder: Wrath
Planescape Torment reviews at release -

IGN: http://www.ign.com/articles/1999/12/18/planescape-torment

Excerpt -

I realize that there are a lot of things that I haven't covered here, but it's all really a moot point. If you're a roleplaying fan, you need to go buy this game for several different reasons. First, it's a great example of the genre. Second, it's got enough depth to keep you entertained for a very long time. Third, and perhaps most importantly, it's a hell of a lot different than anything else that's ever been released. People who have traditionally shied away from Tolkeinesque fantasy RPGs may find the Planescape world a little daunting at first, but may find that the game's incredible script and powerful characters will help them understand why the rest of us are so addicted to this type of game. A must have for every serious gamer and a powerful contender for RPG of the year.

Gamespot: http://www.gamespot.com/reviews/planescape-torment-review/1900-2535119/

Excerpt -

In fact, it's evidence of Torment's impressive achievement that its problems, which would be detrimental to most any other game, seem so negligible. It's clearly the best traditional computer role-playing game of the year and is bound to be an all-time favorite for many of its inevitable fans. That's because it's a great-looking game that's lengthy but never boring, and it begs to be played through more than once, just as its unique hero and his story promise not to be forgotten.

New Work Times: http://www.webcitation.org/5iqx3F0nL

Excerpt -

Is it possible for a computer game to have the intellectual heft and emotional impact of a good book while remaining as captivating as a well-paced film? If so, the first candidate may well be Planescape: Torment.
 

FeelTheRads

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Well, it felt like McComb wanted really hard to become the next MCA in the heart of the people. Seems like it won't happen and he's angsty.

Maybe if he keeps whining about political correctness in 20 year old games it will help, though.
 
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Lurker King

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Yeah, that is all fine and dandy, but is it really how the video game market works? That people wait until the steam reviews, read them carefully and decide? Well, not in AAA cases, that's for sure. So I think the actual reason for why the game did poorly at release cannot be connected to merit, but to some general principle, like looks -- the game looked too weird -- or general isometric RPG fatigue.

Some factors:

(1) Most reviewers didn’t play Torment, and it shows. They tried to praise the game, but without any enthusiasm. IGN even said that the game was made by Obsidian, for fuck sake. You just need to compare these reviews with the ones that PoE received by the same paid journalists to notice the difference. So, while these reviews were positive in a technical sense, given the expectations players have about reviews, their compliments were already perceived as trashing the game. They can capture this even on a subconscious level after years of "10/10 best game ever".

(2) The game was released amidst other bigger releases because Fargo has no business sense.

(3) The game has one of the worst intros in the history of mankind. If you buy the game expecting for PoE or D:OS, you will ask for a refund immediately.

(4) InXile doesn’t know how to connect with their audience properly or keep them stimulated, and the broken promises didn’t help either. The natural consequence of this is that most backers were not trying to promote the game.
 
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