"Fucking liberals are trying to change my conservative fantasies into... into... LIBERAL fantasies!"
No. Again, what I am talking about is hamfistedly inserting modern political topics into a game.
There's no reason to interpret the opposition as anything but the reverse of liberal activism. When grognards tell Beamdog developers to fuck off with their liberal agenda pushing, that's conservative activism speaking.
No, most of what we've been discussing is changes made from within the studio. And even in the second case, no, advocating the exclusion of a liberal agenda does not equal advocating a conservative agenda being inserted in its place.
Again, show me the pro-Trump plotlines. Or show me the video game character who is a Pepe-posting 8chaner inserted by one of /ourguys/ and trying to redpill the audience on the holocaust.
The worship of traditional masculine values is conservative
Nah. It is liberal - or rather feminist - to hate them, but no, not conservative to "worship" (really? Including hyper masculine characters is worship? k.
I guess Bull in DA:I was conservative worship of masculine values.) them.
Uh, you do realize the worship of violence as THE solution in video games accomplishes the same effect?
Have you said your Hail Bloodsheds today?
Just because conservatives don't get called out for it - actually, they do, but the Codex tends to dismiss the people doing it as social justice warriors - doesn't make it any less obvious. Games like Call of Duty, Battlefield, etc. DO have a message and that message usually IS "guns are cool; violence is necessary; support the military."
Yeah, I knew you were gonna try this. No, having violence be a possible solution is not tantamount to making a statement on the modern gun control debate. And it certainly isn't a pro-military message either. If they inserted an entire plotline where there was a vote and all the heroes in the city had their swords confiscated due to that popular political vote and then someone attacked and no one could defend themselves, that'd be closer.
The way you put it, any movie that has heroes that use gun violence is conservative, pro-military and making a statement about gun control specifically.
They - and like I said, people who share conservative values aren't necessarily 'conservatives' because it's not a binary divide - want to go back to a time when government was less ubiquitous
Which is more libertarian than strictly conservative btw. But continue and I'll show you why that's still wrong.
Whether kings, wizards, or tentacle squids rule, it doesn't much matter.
No, it really does. Monarchy is a form of government that can be very authoritarian and very much ubiquitous. A king can have agents within his country policing everything from free speech to - in the squid monsters case - thought.
And on the subject of squid monsters, you really think that being ruled by monsters who control your thoughts, use you for slave labor and eventually eat your brains is both a less ubiquitous form of government and part of conservative ideology?
What draws many people to fantasy is the fact that fantasy's government structures are much more primitive, which lends itself to the practice of adventuring, as well as the values of heroic violence, vigilantism, binary morality, etc.
Longing for simplicity, more freedom and adventure are not exclusively conservative values. And morality need not be binary in fantasy.
No one wants to be party to an agenda they don't agree with.
No, that's not my point. I don't want to buy propaganda. I want to buy a video game made to entertain me, not one clearly designed to sway my politics.
My point is, when you make a game, your purpose is to entertain. Creative license exists, yes, but you should also place your audience's desires above your own and not use it as an opportunity to put your pet ideas or values into it - especially if it pisses off a large segment of your customers. They paid you money for a certain type of game and that should be the type of product you deliver.
You don't put Barbie minigames or a Barbie-loving NPC into GTA 6 - even if you REALLY, REALLY like Barbie Dolls and want everyone to understand just how great they are and how important Ken is to the franchise.
Understanding that games typically push conservative agendas - not necessarily the crazy, alternate right sort, but the more status quo, traditionalist, or even nostalgic sort
Nice goalpost shifting. We started out this discussion with me quoting your post about how Trump supporters would be doing the same sorts of things to shoehorn their agenda into videogames, but then you deflected and said that they don't have to do that because their agenda is innate to fantasy.
Now you are saying that only traditionalism/nostalgia is innate to fantasy. So I'd again put to you that your point about Trump supporters specifically not doing the same things SJWs do to insert their agendas is invalid because they aren't doing it, even though their agendas are not present in fantasy.
Also, nostalgia is not inherently politically conservative. Anyone who grew up in the 60s-70s can be nostalgic about free love and liberal drug use. The status quo is also not exclusively politically conservative. Obama was a black, liberal president for 8 years. I didn't see any conservatives trying to preserve that status quo.
Pretend I'm a developer. Pretend that I only released games about Nazi Germany. Pretend that in these games, you could only play as a Nazi soldier, and that the game doesn't judge you in any way but offers you a glorious death fighting the Allies. Sooner or later, you'd accuse me of being a Nazi sympathizer, and you would have cause to do so, because even though it's completely right by history, the subject matter & setting I keep choosing reflect an obvious agenda.
No, I wouldn't. If it was supposed to be a historical simulation, I would take your word for it. If, however, it also featured scenes with evil Jews plotting to rape german women or showed concentration camps as resorts with swimming pools, I might get a bit suspicious.
If you want to make Das Boot, the game though, go right ahead.
It's the same with fantasy.
For the Nth time, we aren't talking about selective historical allegory. We are talking about deliberate inserts of far-left talking points and agendas into video games. Again, show me the conservative inserts. Put up or shut up.
Fantasy genre conventions tend to be conservative.
'K. Still playing that fantasy race-mixing simulator Baldur's Gate btw. Any tips on beating Drizzt - the iconic fantasy hero who has been appearing in games and books for
over 20 years and who is also black? The one who is constantly used by his author to represent issues about race relations?
Magic Missile doesn't seem to werk fsr.
Of course, there are always works attempting to break out of these conventions, and there's a movement, especially in literature, that could be considered a liberal shift.
How recent is this movement? 'cuz 20 years seems like a long time ago.
If you keep having to time travel back into history to find an era where this totes conservative version of fantasy supposedly exists, maybe fantasy isn't really that conservative and your point about that being the reason conservatives don't try to change/insert characters and lore in order to foster their own ideals the way SJWs do is total bollocks?