Eternity Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire + DLC Thread - now with turn-based combat!

[Quillon]

Console release seems to be at March 31. THQ Nordic on top of VE. https://www.amazon.com/Pillars-Eternity-II-Deadfire-PlayStation-4/dp/B079Q9B86V?th=1

Spoiler

 

[Roguey]

What lousy, lazy box art. Like they wanted to have a close up of a guy because that sells but they couldn't be bothered to make new art so they do an extreme zoom on a scene where it doesn't really work.

 

[Zed]

What lousy, lazy box art. Like they wanted to have a close up of a guy because that sells but they couldn't be bothered to make new art so they do an extreme zoom on a scene where it doesn't really work.

agreed but it could very well be temporary cover art

 

[ColonelTeacup]

Console release seems to be at March 31. THQ Nordic on top of VE. https://www.amazon.com/Pillars-Eternity-II-Deadfire-PlayStation-4/dp/B079Q9B86V?th=1

Spoiler

I knew that looked familiar.

 

[Safav Hamon]

I started another playthrough and have been experimenting with the new subclasses.

Arcane Archer makes the ranger class less boring. At the beginning it sucks because of the accuracy penalty to normal attacks, but once you get fireball arrows and a multi-shot weapon it's broken as fuck.

Furyshaper is another fun class. You place sigils during combat that provide active buffs and debuffs. The downside is that you get debuffed if the sigil is destroyed, which is a good strategy is to place frenzy sigils near your ranged units.

Tactician/Rogue is deadly against individual ranged targets like mages. Sneak your way across the battlefield and spam knockdown endlessly.

Steel Garrote/Blood Mage is another fun combo. Garrotes regenerate health every time they attack an enemy with an affliction, and blood mages sacrifice health to regain spells. Cast affliction, hit enemy, sacrifice blood, blow shit up, repeat.

Ancients have some good spells each power level, but I still prefer Watershapers and Furies for their raw power. Not a bad addition though.

Priest of Woedica is now my favorite class in the game, and I used to hate priests. Writs take a lot of strategy, bu when used wisely they can turn any battle in your favor.

 

[Safav Hamon]

Furyshapers and Priests of Woedica are so interesting to play that they should be upgraded into full classes. One based exclusively on placing sigils, and the other reading writs.

 

[SlumLord]

but the main plot is a train wreck

Wasn't aware the game had one.

What lousy, lazy box art. Like they wanted to have a close up of a guy because that sells but they couldn't be bothered to make new art so they do an extreme zoom on a scene where it doesn't really work.

What does a top-of-the-line concept artist like Daarken charge? $500 a pop? Even if it's 1k, that's still chump change for a company. I wonder who went into that meeting and said, "Hey, let's save a few cents by slapping a crappy low-rez pic on the game box! That'll sure sell!"

 

[2house2fly]

Based on sales of the game and likely sales of the console version, they're probably justified in saving every penny they can. Though I'd have just had the logo on a dark green backrgound, maybe with some bubbles to make it look underwater

 

[Roguey]

Though I'd have just had the logo on a dark green backrgound, maybe with some bubbles to make it look underwater

Market research is pretty clear that "tough looking guy" is what sells, not some art crap.

 

[SlumLord]

Market research is pretty clear that "tough looking guy" is what sells

Not when 'tough looking guy' looks like a farmer; the aesthetics look like a throwback to the 60s; and the art composition itself screams 'budget garbage'.

Here's a few examples of 'tough looking guy' done right:

Spoiler

Spoiler

Spoiler

 

[Butter]

It looks shabby. I think anyone who hasn't seen the original art could still look at that and tell it's been cropped from a wider picture.

 

[Immortal]

Though I'd have just had the logo on a dark green backrgound, maybe with some bubbles to make it look underwater

Market research is pretty clear that "tough looking guy" is what sells, not some art crap.

Hmm
*Checks Top Selling Games of All Time*

Spoiler

 

[AwesomeButton]

Market research is pretty clear that "tough looking guy" is what sells, not some art crap.

Tough looking white guy, to be more specific.

 

[TemplarGR]

There's also probably a case to be made that Fallout 4 does indeed have a pseudophilosophical main story that really when you think about makes no sense

Not really. Fallout 4 never takes itself too seriously. It is not Torment. Its writters never at any point think "omg we are so kewl, edgy 12 year olds are gonna worship us like GODs". It is just a boring story so you can get your sandbox going, a stupid story you are going to ignore for 99% of your playthrough anyway, because who gives a fuck.

It is the type of story Diablo games have. Does anyone play Diablo for the story? I have met a few spergs who take Diablo lore seriously for reasons my brain can't comprehend, but for most mortals Diablo story segments are something you skip so you can grind more lewt.

You can attack FO4 for many things, but not for attempting to have a pseudophilosophical story. It does not even try. If they could just say to you "here is your sandbox, press start", without the spergs crying foul, they would.

 

[Sailor Woedica]

Console release seems to be at March 31. THQ Nordic on top of VE. https://www.amazon.com/Pillars-Eternity-II-Deadfire-PlayStation-4/dp/B079Q9B86V?th=1

Spoiler

empty Deadfire console cases have actually been on display in the game shops in my area since the start of the year and they look awesome! They really stand out next to the other cool games they sell

 

[Roguey]

*Checks Top Selling Games of All Time*

Some games/genres can do just fine without it, but when you lack a marketing budget or viral marketing or aren't completely confident in those efforts and have to rely on selling something by getting people to pay attention to your box on the shelf so they'll take a look at it, the tough guy is tried and true.
https://www.mobygames.com/game/elex/cover-art/gameCoverId,432199/
https://www.mobygames.com/game/deus-ex-human-revolution/cover-art/gameCoverId,226615/
https://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/witcher-2-assassins-of-kings/cover-art/gameCoverId,220929/
https://www.mobygames.com/game/kingdoms-of-amalur-reckoning/cover-art/gameCoverId,455393/
https://www.mobygames.com/game/divinity-ii-the-dragon-knight-saga/cover-art/gameCoverId,218343/
https://www.mobygames.com/game/divinity-ii-ego-draconis/cover-art/gameCoverId,160953/

Market research is pretty clear that "tough looking guy" is what sells, not some art crap.

Tough looking white guy, to be more specific.

Something I found terribly amusing is that Activision found that in America, a tough looking black guy's back is the kind of cover they would need to sell https://www.mobygames.com/game/sin/cover-art/gameCoverId,29202/

But in Europe, they believed a front-facing sexy woman would work much better https://www.mobygames.com/game/sin/cover-art/gameCoverId,16437/

 

[AwesomeButton]

Strong back muscles and triceps transcend race.

 

[Lacrymas]

As always, Europeans know where it's at.

 

[2house2fly]

I'll take the front-facing sexy woman, please.

 

[Immortal]

*Checks Top Selling Games of All Time*

Some games/genres can do just fine without it, but when you lack a marketing budget or viral marketing or aren't completely confident in those efforts and have to rely on selling something by getting people to pay attention to your box on the shelf so they'll take a look at it, the tough guy is tried and true.

Honestly, I think the glaring issue in my argument and yours as well is just Brand Recognition in general.

People didn't buy GTA5 or Skyrim because.. "Omg Teh Stronk Man On Teh Cover".
They bought it because they played GTA4 / Oblivion or knew someone that did and told them to buy it and knew what they were likely going to get.

Deadfire's shitty sales are a direct response to PoE 1 burning the demographic that likes these kinds of games.
Contrary to your specific tastes, most people didn't enjoy it.

I think "Teh Big Stronk Man" covers may entice some 14 year old who plays fortnite all day.. but that same person is likely way more influenced by youtubers and hypetrains than the box cover.

 

[TemplarGR]

Honestly, I think the glaring issue in my argument and yours as well is just Brand Recognition in general.

People didn't buy GTA5 or Skyrim because.. "Omg Teh Stronk Man On Teh Cover".
They bought it because they played GTA4 / Oblivion or knew someone that did and told them to buy it and knew what they were likely going to get.

Deadfire's shitty sales are a direct response to PoE 1 burning the demographic that likes these kinds of games.
Contrary to your specific tastes, most people didn't enjoy it.

I think "Teh Big Stronk Man" covers may entice some 14 year old who plays fortnite all day.. but that same person is likely way more influenced by youtubers and hypetrains than the box cover.

I am of the same opinion. I did enjoy Pillars 1, i mean the finished 3.x version with expansions attached, but i remember it was a shitshow when initially released, lot of bugs, gameplay changes gallore etc. Also it was a too much of a clone of BG1, it didn't try enough to create a new identity.

Deadfire's low sales are obviously influenced a lot by PoE 1 dissappointment, there is no doubt about it. Unfairly even, as Deadfire improved on many faults of the predecessor and is a superior game. I think given time it will become a cult classic as people will begin giving it a chance.

 

[Immortal]

Honestly, I think the glaring issue in my argument and yours as well is just Brand Recognition in general.

People didn't buy GTA5 or Skyrim because.. "Omg Teh Stronk Man On Teh Cover".
They bought it because they played GTA4 / Oblivion or knew someone that did and told them to buy it and knew what they were likely going to get.

Deadfire's shitty sales are a direct response to PoE 1 burning the demographic that likes these kinds of games.
Contrary to your specific tastes, most people didn't enjoy it.

I think "Teh Big Stronk Man" covers may entice some 14 year old who plays fortnite all day.. but that same person is likely way more influenced by youtubers and hypetrains than the box cover.

I am of the same opinion. I did enjoy Pillars 1, i mean the finished 3.x version with expansions attached, but i remember it was a shitshow when initially released, lot of bugs, gameplay changes gallore etc. Also it was a too much of a clone of BG1, it didn't try enough to create a new identity.

Deadfire's low sales are obviously influenced a lot by PoE 1 dissappointment, there is no doubt about it. Unfairly even, as Deadfire improved on many faults of the predecessor and is a superior game. I think given time it will become a cult classic as people will begin giving it a chance.

Just a quick glance at my anecdotal steam page. I can see that I have like over 10 friends who own Pillars 1.. I have zero friends that own Pillars 2.
I have again over 15 friends that own D:OS 1 & 2..

Although a small and unreliable sample seed - I don't think it's a biased one.
Most of my steam friends are normies who never visit the dex or other RPG websites. Their buying choices are pretty much a microcosm of the gaming world in general. (They play the latest shit that I would never buy)

It's really quite telling. I'm sure Fig didn't help either but again, the churn on PoE1 > PoE2 is almost non-existent. Sequels 9/10 times will always sell more unless a game has over saturated it's market, which is clearly not true based on D:OS2 success.

So again I say, All the armchair designers who constantly praised PoE1, you were wrong and your shitty game sucked.

 

[TemplarGR]

Just a quick glance at my anecdotal steam page. I can see that I have like over 10 friends who own Pillars 1.. I have zero friends that own Pillars 2.
I have again over 15 friends that own D:OS 1 & 2..

Although a small and unreliable sample seed - I don't think it's a biased one.
Most of my steam friends are normies who never visit the dex or other RPG websites. Their buying choices are pretty much a microcosm of the gaming world in general. (They play the latest shit that I would never buy)

It's really quite telling. I'm sure Fig didn't help either but again, the churn on PoE1 > PoE2 is almost non-existent. Sequels 9/10 times will always sell more unless a game has over saturated it's market, which is clearly not true based on D:OS2 success.

So again I say, All the armchair designers who constantly praised PoE1, you were wrong and your shitty game sucked.

Perhaps we were not "wrong", perhaps we were "obsolete". There is a difference.

PoE 1 IS a good game. I mean, the IE games are some of my favourites, i have played them multiple times, the last time i made a full 100% playthrough of the full BG Saga was this spring... And a week ago i finished a full PoE playthrough. So the memories are fresh to me, and doing a comparison, i can't for the life of me understand why people complain so much.

PoE was nothing more than a redo of BG1. If you liked one, you liked the other.

So we can't be "wrong" in saying it is a good game, because if it is not a good game, then that means BG is not a good game either...

In my opinion, PoE IS good, BUT, the market for it is not there anymore. People have moved on, the gaming experiences have evolved, and people don't want to play games like this anymore.

So it is not that we were "wrong", more like "we are obsolete". Our tastes no longer reflect market tastes.

 

[Immortal]

PoE was nothing more than a redo of BG1. If you liked one, you liked the other.

That's actually not true, most of the outspoken criticism were from bg "fanboys" which I was lumped in with several times.
PoE1 actually diverges from BG in many ways that were annoying, namely Combat & Encounter Design / Itemization / Progression / Exploration.

It was Sawyers vision of BG and it was the worst of both worlds. (Sawyer hates BG2)

I would actually argue that the reason people were so annoyed with PoE1 is because it was markted as a BG clone in the kickstarter but then vastly diverged from it.

 

[TemplarGR]

That's actually not true, most of the outspoken criticism were from bg "fanboys" which I was lumped in with several times.
PoE1 actually diverges from BG in many ways that were annoying, namely Combat & Encounter Design / Itemization / Progression / Exploration.

It was Sawyers vision of BG and it was the worst of both worlds. (Sawyer hates BG2)

I would actually argue that the reason people were so annoyed with PoE1 is because it was markted as a BG clone in the kickstarter but then vastly diverged from it.

I am not most people, and quite frankly i wasn't participating on the codex much at the time of release so i wouldn't know (too busy with work and divorce at that time), BUT, the way i see it, the two games are extremely similar:

1) Classes are more or less DnD classes

2) Spells are more or less DnD spells

3) The combat system is more or less the same thing, just more streamlined with stuff like endurance/health to attempt to make resting less important, as well as per rest/per encounter abilities to try to do the same. Also making AC become a "saving throw" and making armor more about DR was a good design choice. In my opinion it was a more streamlined version of BG combat system, but still pretty much similar

4) The story was parallel to BG1 story. You escape a big evil badguy barely with your life, him slaughtering your companion(s), and you try to find out what happened to you. On the way you encounter a whole region in crisis by the bad guy who has a secret plot to enslave the whole region and you face him and spoil his plans... In the end it is revealed you are connected to the bad guy like you were connected to Sarevok...

I really don't understand why people complained. It seems to me they never played BG, or they played it so long ago they didn't remember how it was like...

Also, i am with Sawyer on his opinion of BG2, it was not that great. BG1 and IWD1 were far better games in my opinion. He is a good designer, very underrated.