Artifact - a Valve card game based on DotA

[Dawkinsfan69]

At least MTG:A is fucking great, I just hope its going to survive, because its freemium model seems way too fucking generous. Third time is the charm, God willing.

It's kinda crazy tbh, think there's like 15 unique decks and their cards that you get for free and on top of that they practically give you 3 packs a day for just logging in and playing 5 or so games.

Important that they do this though since they're releasing 4 xpacs per year

 

[v1rus]

At least MTG:A is fucking great, I just hope its going to survive, because its freemium model seems way too fucking generous. Third time is the charm, God willing.

It's kinda crazy tbh, think there's like 15 unique decks and their cards that you get for free and on top of that they practically give you 3 packs a day for just logging in and playing 5 or so games.

Important that they do this though since they're releasing 4 xpacs per year

Well, like I said in MTGA thread - Ive been playing since open beta, so, 2 months, and I'm ona great track. Got almost complete Grixis Dragon and Boros Angels decks almost, which are both pricey as fuck (w/o sideboard tho), and use shitton of dual lands - and i only bought the 5$ welcome bundle. Missing a bit of rares for mono-red and mono-blue - in other words, Ill pretty much have a good collection, or most of it before the next set gets out.

So, I collected a good deal of five sets in 4 months. With that tempo, collecting a new set every 3 months is trivial, at worst. Even if they started adding old sets, it cant get bad - only if they started adding like 5 sets every 3-4 months.

Thus, Im worried for the future of the game, as I cant see it being profitable enough. Profitable? Sure, but the system really is generous. Mind you, I'm only crafting meta cards, and I got great economy discipline and experience from HS, so I might be way different from the average, casual player. Also, from what Ive seen, unoptimized, or in MTG terms, Jank decks, not only are way more popular than in HS, but are also way more viable, so people might actually care for collecting shitton of cards that are not meta role-players.

 

[Dawkinsfan69]

Thus, Im worried for the future of the game, as I cant see it being profitable enough. Profitable? Sure, but the system really is generous. Mind you, I'm only crafting meta cards, and I got great economy discipline and experience from HS, so I might be way different from the average, casual player. Also, from what Ive seen, unoptimized, or in MTG terms, Jank decks, not only are way more popular than in HS, but are also way more viable, so people might actually care for collecting shitton of cards that are not meta role-players.

Yeah I'm concerned too especially because mtga is my favorite card game right now, I really hope it does well. Once of the reasons is def jank decks. I love the deck building in that game there are just so many ways to play

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

Gwent, doing fine

Another nice casual deck under $5 - Revtel Jihad. Used to win against an Axe & Tinker guy today and it's very sweet to win against those $20 fuckers with the $0.04 shitty Rix.

Ha! I was offended by how shit Rix looked but I had the exact same idea. Strap the C4 bracers to him and Allah akbar to victory. Surprised you were still able to take out an expensive red/black deck, especially since Axe should be fat enough to take 3 suicide bombs. Not to mention the cash generated from collecting furry-oil while they suicide bomb him means he can buy armor plating and healing pots. I see you've got a video up for it though so I'll have to watch that later, still partway through your Meepo deck which looks pretty fun too. Thinking about gritting my teeth and spending $4 Steambux to pick up the missing cards, but I may use it to scoop up Dusk instead so I can continue just playing precons and draft and see if the card prices go even lower in 2019.

 

[hivemind]

just imagine how mentally cuckolded you would have to be to unironically pay money to play ranked*



*that doesn't even have ranks

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

God damn Pope Amole II , just finished watching your Meepo video. Your second/final game with it showcased some of the good shit in Artifact pretty well. Despite your opponent having some of the "Better" (Read: More expensive) cards and despite you getting fucked relatively consistently by unit placement and arrow RNG you still ended up winning. Good back and forth on the match and satisfying end, though I had to look up Wrath of Gold to make sure it wasn't pierce damage, since if it was I absolutely would've nuked left lane from orbit to get rid of that Mazzie and Bristle. I also probably would've put that second Ignite in the center lane to mow down the 2/1 dog tokens, but the Meepo poofs did a good job slowing it down while the 1 piercing point from Ignite helped grind heavily armored fuckers down on the left lane along with dual heartstopper.

Speaking of RNG, only had one match thus far myself where I felt like I lost completely due to RNG rather than feeling like I fucked up and/or was outplayed. It was in draft mode and my opponent had a turn 1 kill on a hero in a black lane and had Track in hand from bounty hunter, and killed a creep elsewhere. No biggy, puts him at 16 gold which is a strong first turn but far from something you can't recover from. At least until turn 2 I notice he didn't spend any gold, then in one black hero lane he played Payday to put himself at 32 gold, then in the next black hero lane he played another Payday to go to 64. 64 enemy gold heading into round 3 was unfortunately too much of an uphill struggle for a janky draft deck. Looked at his deck after the fact and the fucker only had 2 Paydays in his deck, and only had one BH so 3 Tracks, and apparently had at least one Payday in his opening hand since he didn't spend any gold. And even then that wouldn't have been quite as devastating if the game opening hero placement hadn't lined up my weakest hero in front of a BH or PA or whatever the hell got the kill. Stars were aligned to punish me, but shit like that is fairly rare since there's no mulligan and no tutor cards so matches usually end up with at least SOME back and forth.

 

[Pope Amole II]

Well, truth to be told, it's the casual mode so it's mostly due to me playing on the ok level and my opponents playing really, really badly. It wouldn't be so sweet against an evenly matched level - the RNG would matter a lot there. Another thing is that early turns RNG matters much less than the late turn RNG due to the game's scaling - I'm getting better at this game and now I can fully agree with that statement of Garfield that, unless you're playing black gold deck, early kills don't really matter and, for many decks, overextending yourself for those kills can easily screw you.

And yeah, double payday is cancer - I've lost to a mono black constructed deck in a similar fashion where he had 70+ gold by turn 2 and converted it into double Horn of the Alpha. No real way to be fighting that. There is Dominator but it's difficult to generate as much gold unless you're a golden deck yourself.

 

[MajorMace]

Game is fun, lots of ways of improvement, tons of possibilities to release interesting expansions and add new game modes.
Economy is fucked and absurd, and only justified by Valve surprisingly succesful "trading" policy. They make 2cents per transaction through steam, and the income goes in the wallet and is to be spent in the steam shop anyway.
It's like Valve made the decision to sit on the fact that people want to own shit. You can play free draft in artifact with no limitations - you obviously don't end up owning anything... but since constructed atm is almost completely pointless due to imbalances and too few a selection of cards, it actually matters fuck all.

It's very weird, it's like taking part in a figurines shop event for 20 bucks, being able to play any game at any table there - and then the organizer comes to you and goes like "hey, what about you pay and OWN some of these miniatures ???!!1!1"
"Why the fuck would I want that ?" as an answer, before proceeding to play another free game. I have yet to see how they handle expansions - I assume they'll replace the current set draft by the new set draft, and the former set will only be accessible via boosters... But again, why bother ? Add on top of that the fact that prices will inevitably go down after a new set is released... And you get to the conclusion that the best way to play artifact, for at least several months (depends on how quickly they release new shit) is for free. Hence, a completely incoherent economy there.
I understand why someone would want to own physical cards/miniatures - sort them in their card book and all. But why would anyone want a collection of digital cards, especially when constructed is so much less interesting that drafting. What the fuck.

Then, there's this other important aspect that has been noted earlier itt : artifact is closer to card games such as the 5 rings, agot 2.0 etc... it's a game where the decision making takes place during the confrontation, rather than prior to it via deckbuilding. These games have typical characteristics : rounds take a long time, games can last 40 minutes (although artifact is obviously shorter, in its nonsensical attempt to seduce a big market - an attempt which doesn't accord with their business model but whatever), and most importantly, usually, a tiny player base (compared to mtg, kids card games etc).


Here's a quick guide on how to start in artifact :
- Open your boosters, if you're very lucky, you get one of the 10+€ rare heroes and can already refund half your game or more.
- Play a few free drafts to get a hand on cards and gameplay and all (really, doesn't take that many games, something like 10 should suffice actually).
- Play keeper draft by spending your tickets, draft for value (again, if you're lucky etc).
- Don't ever spend another penny on the game, if you want to play actual artifact - which is draft - it's completely free.
- What the fuck.

 

[grimace]

Valve's Artifact is GARBAGE. Now let me tell you how I really feel... | The Linux Gamer Review

https://youtu.be/Atb_JDLe0O0?t=29




The micro-transactions make you believe you can pay to win.

Losing "feels" bad.

 

[hivemind]

so much saturated soy

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

I was thinking about it a little, and the lack of a ladder/ranked mode/pro tryhard 360 noscope constructed mode outside of expert which costs a ticket to play may be beneficial. If you've got a tier 1 kickass deck you're rewarded and incentivized to play expert constructed so you can win packs of cards. If you've got a tier 1 kickass deck and you play in casual constructed you can beat up and farm casuals which nets you... Absolutely nothing. You don't rank up, there's no visible MMR, there are no good boy points or stars, just win or lose. And while there are probably people out there who would enjoy smashing people in casual for hours on end it actually may be more "Casual" than in shit like Hearthstone and Gwent, because in those games you're still incentivized to take your tier 1 deck into casual just to farm a few quick wins to knock out a daily quest.

Haven't played enough/any casual constructed in Artifact yet so I have no idea how true that actually is so take it with a grain of salt, but it'd be nice. Just been playing draft and the precon decks lately. Speaking of which, I hope they always keep some sort of no collection/low collection "Event" running. Precon decks, pauper matchmaking, peasant matchmaking, etc. Just so there's always a non-draft option easily available.

 

[you know what time it is]

Forgot to include chat and adding people after the match, still took more effort than artifact's ui.

 

[Pope Amole II]

Made a fun mono red deck. It's a bit of a bitch to play but it feels very rewarding when you win with it so yeah. All under $4.

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

Fuck, just saw your game with the revtel jihadi Rix deck against the guy playing the tier 1 red/black deck in casual and you kicked his ass. True, you had good luck with the cards in your hand and play (The caravan, then healing it with the flask, then the double payday to ramp to obscene damage) but you also got screwed by the RNG in the opening turn too. But you weren't even guaranteed to win with that hand, you had the sense of mind to hold off on spending your gold too easily so you could payday like mad and ramp the convoy into the danger zone which comes down to playing your deck well rather than the standard Artifact practice of wanting to spend your gold since unused gold isn't doing anything for you. Which isn't the case with convoy of course, but that's the whole "Playing to the deck" part.

Stronger cards/stronger decks are absolutely a factor but it does look like they weren't completely blowing smoke up our asses when they talked about skill being a large part of the game. Like you said earlier a fair amount of it is because they're playing like shit while you're not, but it still speaks favorably to the game that a Rix deck can still take out arguably the most faceroll deck which is red/black Axe/legion/etc. Dude might've (MIGHT'VE) been able to save himself had he not completely given up the left lane too. That didn't do him any favors since he didn't have a buffer when the convoy came a-knocking.

 

[Frusciante]

Made a fun mono red deck. It's a bit of a bitch to play but it feels very rewarding when you win with it so yeah. All under $4.

I tried a deck close to this just now, it just feels very slow, buffing individual heroes at a time.

I prefer to play mono decks by the way, duo color deck are supposed to be more powerful but I like to have enough things to play in any given lane. Black seems like a very good choice to start with constructed. Mono red is of course also good but its better cards are very expensive, things like time of triumph, axe, spring the trap etc. With Black you have tinker and lich who are around 2 dollar which is much less than the top red cards, and the rest of black is just a few cents per card.

 

[sebas]

I keep trying to give this game a chance, I just can't enjoy it. I'm not going to rehash everything that has been said so far (lack of progression, buy2pay system, little variery in viable decks etc), I'll just say that while you can definitely see the potential from its design (3 lanes, different card types etc) in its current state it is DOA as far as I am concerned. I assume they will push for some big update and make it F2P later down the line in order to revive it.

 

[Pope Amole II]

Stronger cards/stronger decks are absolutely a factor but it does look like they weren't completely blowing smoke up our asses when they talked about skill being a large part of the game.

Nah, luck is a huge part of the game. It's more about Convoy deck being actually good and probably overlooked - if you throwaway Rix jankiness and put more expensive cards, it may easily become a top contender.

 

[Frusciante]

Stronger cards/stronger decks are absolutely a factor but it does look like they weren't completely blowing smoke up our asses when they talked about skill being a large part of the game.

Nah, luck is a huge part of the game. It's more about Convoy deck being actually good and probably overlooked - if you throwaway Rix jankiness and put more expensive cards, it may easily become a top contender.

Haven't tried the deck yet, but isn't it very vulnerable to things like slay? Or just a simple 2/2 creep being placed in front of your 40/40 convoy? You need to place the convoy exactly in the right place, make enough gold and then have at least one payday in your hand also. Seems very difficult to pull off consistently.

 

[Pope Amole II]

Don't play the convoy on a lane with the enemy black hero? Or play it after they spend their mana? Dark seer the creep around? Slay the creep yourself? What to do, what to do.

 

[Frusciante]

Don't play the convoy on a lane with the enemy black hero? Or play it after they spend their mana? Dark seer the creep around? Slay the creep yourself? What to do, what to do.

Yes makes sense, like I said I never played that kind of deck so was just wondering..

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

I have been pretty positive about Artifact, and overall I've been enjoying it quite a bit. Really sharp gameplay. I'm pretty ass at it but overall I'm quite impressed.

However, FUCK CHEATING DEATH WHAT THE GODDAMN FUCK IS THIS HEARTHSTONE BULLSHIT
THE RNG IN ARTIFACT IS MOSTLY MANAGABLE AND NOT TOO SWINGY IN ANY ONE CASE BUT WHAT THE FUCK IS UP WITH THIS CARD AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGHHHH


Thank you and god bless. PS: REMOVE THAT FUCKING CARD FROM THE GAME HOLY FUCKING SHIT. Stuff like Axe is obnoxious since he's a good body and has a good card, but losing to an Axe is so much more respectable than "Well well well looks like I won 7 coinflips in a row looks like you got outskilled buster".

 

[Frusciante]

I have been pretty positive about Artifact, and overall I've been enjoying it quite a bit. Really sharp gameplay. I'm pretty ass at it but overall I'm quite impressed.

However, FUCK CHEATING DEATH WHAT THE GODDAMN FUCK IS THIS HEARTHSTONE BULLSHIT
THE RNG IN ARTIFACT IS MOSTLY MANAGABLE AND NOT TOO SWINGY IN ANY ONE CASE BUT WHAT THE FUCK IS UP WITH THIS CARD AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGHHHH


Thank you and god bless. PS: REMOVE THAT FUCKING CARD FROM THE GAME HOLY FUCKING SHIT. Stuff like Axe is obnoxious since he's a good body and has a good card, but losing to an Axe is so much more respectable than "Well well well looks like I won 7 coinflips in a row looks like you got outskilled buster".

Haha yes I agree It sucks. I bring improvement removal for things like that.

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

Haha yes I agree It sucks. I bring improvement removal for things like that.

Very true, and part of why it was so infuriating last night might've been because I was playing the preconstructed decks in the event, which may have been amplifying the annoyance. In regular constructed you can adjust your deck to include more improvement removal, and in draft since it's a rare it's not common enough to be a constant heartache. Two of the precon decks run it extensively though which is pretty obnoxious, especially if you can't get your hands on a demagicking maul.

Still pretty easily the card that sticks out the most like a sore thumb compared to the rest of the set though. Even with some RNG on other powerful cards like Luna's and lich's they don't really get my dander up at all.

 

[Frusciante]

Just had two consecutive perfect runs today in expert constructed with a mono red deck. 10-1 in total.

Game needs some sort of progression system, testing new decks in constructed is cool but in the end it's nice to work towards somethings also.

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

Just had two consecutive perfect runs today in expert constructed with a mono red deck. 10-1 in total.

God damn, well done! I've barely been playing at all and sure as hell not using my 5 starter tickets yet.