Age of Decadence is the best CRPG of the past 15 years

[Darth Canoli]

In most games this would have led to a forced fight. In AoD you can actually tell the guy "You know? I'm just a random dude. What if I tell you who are the real conspirators?" and the game actually keeps going forward.

AoD is pure incline.

How is that pure incline, the guy is just a hireling, he doesn't have the choice to spare you, either he kills you or he's a disgrace to his profession.

Pure incline would be :

• He just kills you if you're not cautious (possibly skill check or just based on the player noticing something is wrong and taking action)
• You beat the crap out of him and then you have options to get some infos and try to avoid to get other assassins sent after you.

 

[Humanity has risen!]

No way, I love Vince, but AoD has too many flaws. The main issue is that it is frustrating to figure out constantly where you have to go and what you have to do at your current skillset, because of the lack of rolling on skill checks.

Pick the stats you want to maximize and put the points in them. Don't spread the points too thin. I don't know what you mean by not being able to figure out where you have to go? You have a journal with the quests and a town/world map that lets you teleport around without any hassle.

The problem isn't that you have to optimize your points and build.

The problem is that the game purports to be an open world, non-linear adventure, but because the skill system is built so much around min-maxing, there is always ONE path that you can follow, and you can only figure it out through extensive trial and error.

 

[Corvinus]

the guy is just a hireling

You haven't played the game. Also, see my above comment.

 

[The Great ThunThun*]

AoD is one of the best games ever made. Of all places in the world on the web, I expect the codex to be one place where it should be hailed as such; if not then shame on you.

It has the most real C&C I have ever seen in a game, excellent turn-based combat mechanics, which has *very* few flaws and which Vince and team would definitely improve given how humble and professional they are, and an amazing setting, which I hope to see more of in the future.

 

[Viata]

most real C&C I have ever seen in a game

Wizardry has the best C&C, mate.

 

[pomenitul]

I can only guess at the staggering emotional rollercoaster this thread has been for VD's eromenoi so far.

 

[†††]

AoD is the shit. Also blabbering about "b-but it has a few flaws!" is retard tier given that the best games of the genre are full of flaws, CRPGs will never be perfect.

 

[Bocian]

I can only guess at the staggering emotional rollercoaster this thread has been for VD's eromenoi so far.

Didn't know VD has students. Is he teaching game development?

 

[pomenitul]

Didn't know VD has students. Is he teaching game development?

I don't know if game design is part of Goral's otherwise thorough education. You'd have to ask him.

 

[Zed Duke of Banville]

I keep hearing this sentiment and I strongly disagree. It is slightly insulting to the game to compare it to a CYOA. It has C&C, it is simply not telling you to go to page 66 and then to page 86. The choices presented are actually building up a story. I think what you and others really mean when they say that it is a gamebook like experience is that the story is developed through dialogue and I see, frankly, absolutely nothing wrong with that.

Gamebooks aren't choose-your-own-adventure books but rather the hybrid of CYOA books and RPGs that emerged following the success of the former. Unlike simple CYOA books, gamebooks have character stats, inventory, combat systems, et cetera, borrowed from RPGs.

It isn't an insult to compare Age of Decadence to a gamebook, but it does point to both its strengths and weaknesses.

 

[The Great ThunThun*]

Even if you meant that respectfully, and I agree in some sense that this is the case (that gamebooks have some correspondence with AoD), I would argue that *all* RPGs are like that. AoD is simply a distilled extract. Oher RPGs are simply different in the presentation of the same correspondence. Take P:K example. It has literal gamebook elements. And you know what? No one brings up that the game is like a Gamebook. I am at a loss to see why AoD gets this special treatment.

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

Damn, where were those gamebooks when I was growing up? I mean, I fondly remember renting out every Choose Your Own Adventure book the libraries had, but an actual RPG with dice and a pencil and paper needed, I would have nerded so hard at that growing up. Sadly they missed my part of town. Maybe I'll check them out someday...someday...*wistful music begins playing*

 

[Kyl Von Kull]

The problem is that the game purports to be an open world, non-linear adventure,

Since when? You won't find the words open world anywhere on Iron Tower's website or the game's steam page. The game purports to be this:

The Age of Decadence is an isometric, turn-based, single-player role-playing game set in a low magic, post-apocalyptic fantasy world, inspired by the fall of the Roman Empire. The game features a detailed skill-based character system, multiple skill-based ways to handle quests, choices & consequences, and extensive dialogue trees.

The focus of the game is not on killing monsters, but on dealing with fellow humans and factions, trying to survive – easier said than done – and making a name for yourself. Naturally, to accommodate all that scheming, plotting, and backstabbing, we give the player plenty of choices, from multiple solutions to quests to different paths you can take through the game. You (and your actions) will determine who your friends and enemies are. There are no default good and bad guys.

AoD isn't non-linear like an open world game. It's non-linear like a role playing game with a massively branching storyline.

You're saying that all this talk of C&C is an illusion because:

the skill system is built so much around min-maxing, there is always ONE path that you can follow, and you can only figure it out through extensive trial and error.

First of all, you're exaggerating. There's rarely just one path your build can follow. But—and this is the key thing—when VD talks about choice & consequences, that includes your build choices.

I think your real complaint is that you often can't get your preferred outcomes in AoD without extensive trial and error, which is true. However, you can get suboptimal outcomes that still progress the story. That's C&C.

 

[Butter]

My first AoD character lasted about 5 minutes. His (((merchant))) ass got conned by the promise of discount goods and was taken to an isolated house and murdered. I was so tickled that the game allowed me to be fucked like that right out of the gate, that I didn't even bother reloading. I just retired the character and learned my lesson. Very few games have that effect.

 

[deama]

Why do people have such a big problem with this game being too much of a CYOA game? I think it's fine and I like what they've done, it makes the scenes flow much better.

 

[Lone Wolf]

Damn, where were those gamebooks when I was growing up? I mean, I fondly remember renting out every Choose Your Own Adventure book the libraries had, but an actual RPG with dice and a pencil and paper needed, I would have nerded so hard at that growing up. Sadly they missed my part of town. Maybe I'll check them out someday...someday...*wistful music begins playing*

Look up 'Project Aon' and thank me later.

 

[TemplarGR]

It wasn't even the best CRPG the year it was released...

 

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

Look up 'Project Aon' and thank me later.

Fuck later, I'm thanking you right now. Just found the page and this is awesome. I will definitely check some of these out. Bookmarked heavy.

 

[Black Angel]

How is that pure incline, the guy is just a hireling, he doesn't have the choice to spare you, either he kills you or he's a disgrace to his profession.

The guy have quite a position, influence and experience in Assassin's Guild, and from what I remembered, he have conflict of interest of some sort with the current guildmaster of Maadoran branch. He does have the choice to spare you.... provided you give him the reason why.

Pure incline would be :

• He just kills you if you're not cautious (possibly skill check or just based on the player noticing something is wrong and taking action)
• You beat the crap out of him and then you have options to get some infos and try to avoid to get other assassins sent after you.

This part of the storyline is only possible for a Merchant playthrough, where the character will be fully focused on non-combat endeavor. I think it's possible to try and fight your way if you somehow managed to hybridize your character until that point. But the way your character's been making connection with power players across Maadoran, there bound to be confusion as to who's truly responsible to make the whole situation happened in the first place. Like I said above, since the guy you met that night is a veteran who wanted the guild to stay independent (iirc), your character can use that fact and let the guy know that the guildmaster wanted to make the guild Gaelius's lapdog (which is a rumor that you can gain knowledge of, if you're asking the right question at the right person).

 

[Bocian]

Why do people have such a big problem with this game being too much of a CYOA game?

Because it's a lie made up to piss off the "AoD disciples". Those that use it probably didn't see a single cyoa game in their lives.

 

[Roguey]

It's true though. While there are many paths, you're only given the paths VD gives you (e.g. as an assassin, I was ordered to take out this guy in his house however the only way to do so is to just stroll right in to an obvious ambush).

 

[Black Angel]

It's true though. While there are many paths, you're only given the paths VD gives you

How's that any different from other, similar RPGs like Fallout? I think I know why: because in other RPGs, you're allowed to click anywhere, on whatever you want, while ITS force you to make your choice from dialogue-esque window (or as Zed Duke put it, like a gamebook).
I think that doesn't make it as CYOA as people make it to be, but I'm glad they learned from this experience and is going to do it like other RPGs with Colony Ship RPG. Even though, from what I know, it seems like they'll still do dialogue-esque/gamebook format for stealth mission, or something.

 

[Roguey]

How's that any different from other, similar RPGs like Fallout? I think I know why: because in other RPGs, you're allowed to click anywhere, on whatever you want, while ITS force you to make your choice from dialogue-esque window (or as Zed Duke put it, like a gamebook).

Yes, in Fallout, I would have been able to get the drop on those people. Get them drunk with beer to lower their perception/ranged accuracy, plant timed explosives on their bodies, then mop up from a more advantageous position.

 

[Black Angel]

Yes, in Fallout, I would have been able to get the drop on those people. Get them drunk with beer to lower their perception/ranged accuracy, plant timed explosives on their bodies, then mop up from a more advantageous position.

You can also do that in AoD. For example, when dealing with the Aurelians at the mines near Teron, you can poison their supplies. With simple rat poison, you can simply lower their health, but with much stronger poison you can even have some of them killed and the rest much easier to deal with.