Vapourware System Shock 3 by OtherSide Entertainment - taken over by Tencent!

[anvi]

 

[Nyast]

SS3 is not going to be completed, neither as the game envisioned nor as a watered-down FPS.

OS has no publisher for this game and has to pay back $7 million to Starbreeze.

Even if they have a path to making a linear FPS by spending just another $1-2 million (I doubt it), it wouldn't be possible because they have to refund Starbreeze.

We don't know about the refund terms though. Nothing says they have to refund Starbreeze asap at the expense of all their other projects. It wouldn't even make sense for Starbreeze, they'd shoot themselves into the feet by destroying Otherside's chances to make some money and refund them later on.

IMO the refund contract is probably structured around royalties on their future revenue, for a total maximum of $7M.

 

[mindx2]

They just need to make it an EPIC Store exclusive then they'll have the money!!!!!

 

[unfairlight]

That might actually be a smart idea, because Epic will give them far more money than they would make off of sales.

 

[mindx2]

Yeah, I was half joking but I suspect that OSE has looked into that.

 

[MasterLobar]

Nyast That's possible, although I think if they thought SS3 is going to make money, they would have stayed in the deal.

Starbreeze is publishing their Q1 2019 financial report soon. That will likely provide some more info on the SS3 refund.

 

[BEvers]

Cut down to relevant passages:

Warren Spector: "If immersive sims disappear, I disappear"

...

While the System Shock 3 director can't speak for other companies' games, he does know Underworld Ascendant has "done well enough to get our next game funded" -- although he said he doesn't know the exact sales figure.

"My business partner handles all this stuff because I just want to make games," he said. "I do not want to think about it. I spent a few years with Disney thinking about the studio as much as I was thinking about the game, and I don't want to do that anymore. I suspect you're right, that sales weren't quite what we hoped for, but I really don't know."

Regardless of whether his company's latest release sold well enough to fund another, it's impossible to ignore the number of companies struggling to sell this type of game in sufficient quantities. Given how risk-averse this industry can be, particularly at the top, does this mean the end is nigh for immersive sims?

"It's not going to disappear," said Spector. "Well, if it does, I'm going to disappear. By choice.

"One of the ways to address this on System Shock 3 and at OtherSide in general is we're trying to keep our budgets in line with our expected sales. Given our budget, we don't have to sell 100 million copies, we don't have to make $1 billion for a major publisher to succeed and to make money. Our budgets now are by choice more modest, and that means we don't have to sell as many copies. We have a dedicated audience, people who love these games. We have people who love making them. So all we have to do is adjust our thinking to reach that audience."

...

The real challenge with System Shock 3 is living up to the legacy of its forebears. It's been 20 years since System Shock 2, 25 since the original, and striking the balance between staying true to the old games but adopting the advancements of newer ones is "terrifying," according to Spector.

"We're not even competing with System Shock and System Shock 2; we're competing with people's memories of them. And their memories are not of terrible-looking 2D animation, blocky graphics, simple levels.

He continued: "But it's interesting and strange to have the opportunity to go back and give Shodan some sensible motivation. In the earlier games it was like, 'Why did I do it? Because I'm mad of course.' It's a great character; people love Shodan and she's a terrific villain, but that's not the most sophisticated motivation you can come up with. So the opportunity to explain who she is, let her become something is kinda cool.

We're also going to bring back Citadel Station in some form -- was it entirely destroyed? If you go back to the original game, you can find the answer. There were some survivors of those early games, so being able to tell people what happened to those characters is fun.

"But the thing we always have to remember is that it's a balancing act. We have to make sure we reach beyond the core fans. The original System Shock and System Shock 2 were re-released in their original form with no changes about three years ago and sold over a million copies -- so we know there's an audience out there, but we need to reach beyond that. We're finding the balance between pleasing the existing fans and giving new fans something to grab onto without knowing all the lore."

System Shock 3 and Underworld Ascendant have given Spector the chance to revisit and improve on some of his earliest creations, although the rights to his other past works now lie in the hands of other publishers.

...

As mentioned, Spector remains confident that immersive sims won't disappear. Instead, he believes developers' ability to create more complex simulations of things like physics and other elements of the world will only improve the scope of them. Players will be able to "apply actual logic" to a world and the decisions they make, using these simulated systems as a tool to solve the in-game problems they face.

"Also, it's probably time for us to go multiplayer," he concluded. "I think we have to see that. We've been talking about it for years, nobody's done it right."

The history of the immersive sim is one of single-player campaigns, so how on Earth would a multiplayer version work?

"If I told you, I'd have to kill you," Spector said. Or perhaps use a stealth takedown, or hack this article -- there's always another choice.

https://www.gamesindustry.biz/artic...ector-if-immersive-sims-disappear-i-disappear

 

[Nyast]

Bwahahahahahan no way that's true, must be a late April's Fools.

 

[LESS T_T]

"Also, it's probably time for us to go multiplayer," he concluded. "I think we have to see that. We've been talking about it for years, nobody's done it right."

The history of the immersive sim is one of single-player campaigns, so how on Earth would a multiplayer version work?

"If I told you, I'd have to kill you," Spector said. Or perhaps use a stealth takedown, or hack this article -- there's always another choice.

This almost sounds like SS3 or Boston team's next game will have a multiplayer element. (Well, FWIW there's an attempt by other developers.)

 

[BEvers]

I wonder if the addition of multiplayer is something that has emerged during their discussions with prospective publishers

 

[Infinitron]

Reminder that System Shock 2 already had multiplayer.

 

[forumvisitor#451]

Reminder that System Shock 2 already had multiplayer.

How was that btw? Did anyone ever play it? I am just finishing Chaos Theory coop with my friend and we would like to play something good.

 

[BEvers]

 

[Steamboat Willie]

You know what else Shock3 doesn't have atm? A publisher.

 

[BEvers]

 

[Child of Malkav]

These people are unbelievable.
I don't usually play multiplayer games anymore but don't you need like a lot of resources for it? For example, money, lots of it and people, the competent kind?
After playing UA I can safely assume that they lack both of those.
Not to mention servers, maintenance, bug fixing, lag, anticheat and whatever other stuff necessary for this type of game. All of this constantly draining resources that they don't have.
Someone should check their offices, see if they're ok. Might need professional help. Recovering after a disaster like UA is no small feat and the mind can be overwhelmed leading to various interpretations and perception of reality.

 

[Infinitron]

That would be their "Thick as Thieves" game: https://trademarks.justia.com/880/46/thick-as-88046652.html

Co-op stealth puzzle type game similar to Portal 2 multiplayer mode?

 

[anvi]

No crafting? Mahgerd.

 

[glass blackbird]

These people are unbelievable.
I don't usually play multiplayer games anymore but don't you need like a lot of resources for it? For example, money, lots of it and people, the competent kind?
After playing UA I can safely assume that they lack both of those.
Not to mention servers, maintenance, bug fixing, lag, anticheat and whatever other stuff necessary for this type of game. All of this constantly draining resources that they don't have.
Someone should check their offices, see if they're ok. Might need professional help. Recovering after a disaster like UA is no small feat and the mind can be overwhelmed leading to various interpretations and perception of reality.

Assuming it's small group co-op (which comparing it to Portal implies) you don't need anticheat and can ditch various other things too. Maybe even do p2p if they're cheap enough, then there's not even server costs.

The problem of course is they have nobody who knows how to program a game so they can't do it

 

[MasterLobar]

Warren Spector:

While the System Shock 3 director can't speak for other companies' games, he does know Underworld Ascendant has "done well enough to get our next game funded" -- although he said he doesn't know the exact sales figure.

https://www.gamesindustry.biz/artic...ector-if-immersive-sims-disappear-i-disappear

Their lying is getting obscene.

 

[MasterLobar]

Starbreeze cancels 10 Crowns publishing deal with Mohawk games, will get refund of investment:

Mohawk Games and Starbreeze have now reached an agreement whereby Starbreeze returns the publishing rights for the game to Mohawk and will be able to recoup the development costs at a premium.

https://www.starbreeze.com/2019/04/...-10-crowns-publishing-rights-to-mohawk-games/

By November 2018, they had invested about $2 million. (based on SEK-US$ exchange rate 10:1)

https://www.starbreeze.com/sbz-media/2018/12/Appendix-2-Balance-reports.pdf

That is further evidence that my suspicion that Starbreeze didn't believe SS3 would be completed anytime soon is correct.

The company was given into administration in December 2018. On February 11, 2019, they cancelled the SS3 deal. That was as fast as it can get.

Now, almost 3 months later, they are cancelling 10 Crowns, too. They took a closer look over several months and ultimately decided against it. Unlike SS3, it was obviously a tough call.

They have not withdrawn from several other projects, announced new deals in the past months. They are still publishing Psychonauts 2.

https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2019-02-25-psychonauts-and-surviving-the-publisher-shuffle

So it's not like they are desperately trying to caugh up cash by cancelling all of their publishing deals. They are looking at each case one-by-one to decide if it the project is still viable.

Given how fast their decision was to cancel SS3, it was obviously a no-brainer.

 

[Terenty]

Starbreeze cancels 10 Crowns publishing deal with Mohawk games, will get refund of investment:

Mohawk Games and Starbreeze have now reached an agreement whereby Starbreeze returns the publishing rights for the game to Mohawk and will be able to recoup the development costs at a premium.

https://www.starbreeze.com/2019/04/...-10-crowns-publishing-rights-to-mohawk-games/

By November 2018, they had invested about $2 million. (based on SEK-US$ exchange rate 10:1)

https://www.starbreeze.com/sbz-media/2018/12/Appendix-2-Balance-reports.pdf

That is further evidence that my suspicion that Starbreeze didn't believe SS3 would be completed anytime soon is correct.

The company was given into administration in December 2018. On February 11, 2019, they cancelled the SS3 deal. That was as fast as it can get.

Now, almost 3 months later, they are cancelling 10 Crowns, too. They took a closer look over several months and ultimately decided against it. Unlike SS3, it was obviously a tough call.

They have not withdrawn from several other projects, announced new deals in the past months. They are still publishing Psychonauts 2.

https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2019-02-25-psychonauts-and-surviving-the-publisher-shuffle

So it's not like they are desperately trying to caugh up cash by cancelling all of their publishing deals. They are looking at each case one-by-one to decide if it the project is still viable.

Given how fast their decision was to cancel SS3, it was obviously a no-brainer.

Of course its a no brainer, these "veterans" couldnt make a good game even if their lifes depended on it.

And even if they were capable, with such tiny budget its impossible to make a shock like game that could compete with Prey anyway.

 

[LESS T_T]

Video interview from Reboot conference:



(22:45) The interviewer asked about things beyond System Shock 3, and...

What's on the horizon after System Shock 3? Well, we're certainly thinking about how we keep people engaged in that world, with our stories and our characters, so I think it's safe to say you'll see some downloadable content. Surprise, surprise! And you know we're already thinking about System Shock 4.

I would like to get back to creating original IP. I like creating worlds and original characters so I suspect you'll see some of that as well, but we'll see what happens. First thing is System Shock 3. Let's get that out of the door.

 

[Safav Hamon]

Hot Take: Warren Spector says the levels will be bigger than SS2, there will be more options than SS2, and there will be C&C unlike SS2. So unless he's talking shit, it will be a better immersive sim than SS2.

 

[~*´¨¯¨`*·~-.¸-AIN'T]

Hot Take: Warren Spector says the levels will be bigger than SS2, there will be more options than SS2, and there will be C&C unlike SS2. So unless he's talking shit, it will be a better immersive sim than SS2.

You're right, he's talking shit.