Epic Games Store - the console war comes to PC

[Reinhardt]

first world problems indeed

Maybe, just maybe, first world became first exactly because people there resisted anal raping...
Now they stopped doing it and fully submitted and look what happening.

 

[what am i doing]

first world problems indeed

Sort of like the first world problem of "WAAAAH PEOPLE WON'T INSTALL MY BAD SOFTWARE WAAAAH".

 

[Squid]

so you care more about your GOG experience, than developer bottom line, same thing.

How often do developers see the benefit of the extra that Epic is giving out? Or is it the publishers who get it? I need inside numbers here. And customers shouldn't care about their own experience and benefits? Because I think they should. I'd love if GOG offered the same ratio as Epic, I'd be even happier to buy games from there. But at the end of the day, I'm spending the same amount of money and asking me to do so in a way that is less beneficial in my eyes sounds kinda silly doesn't it? Publishers don't care about the user experience they care about convincing us to purchase the game. DRM-free is a good way to convince me to buy a game.

No one is calling a 12% cut vs. 30% cut evil. Not at all. That's awesome that the creators and publishers can make more off their own property. I'd love to see that become the standard. Hell, I'd argue that with better cuts they have less reason to push lootboxes and MTXs but guess what, they'll probably still do that. Because they aren't our friends. I'd wager that the people truly benefiting from the difference in the cut are not the people programming the game, doing the art, doing the design, etc. It's probably the bosses and executives who work at most 40 hours a week while telling other human beings they have to work over 60 hours a week. I care about the workers, not executives that get upset about criticism or people who don't want to spend over 100 bucks on a game yet see the most reward from the practices.

 

[GrainWetski]

How often do developers see the benefit of the extra that Epic is giving out? Or is it the publishers who get it? I need inside numbers here. And customers shouldn't care about their own experience and benefits? Because I think they should. I'd love if GOG offered the same ratio as Epic, I'd be even happier to buy games from there. But at the end of the day, I'm spending the same amount of money and asking me to do so in a way that is less beneficial in my eyes sounds kinda silly doesn't it? Publishers don't care about the user experience they care about convincing us to purchase the game. DRM-free is a good way to convince me to buy a game.

No one is calling a 12% cut vs. 30% cut evil. Not at all. That's awesome that the creators and publishers can make more off their own property. I'd love to see that become the standard. Hell, I'd argue that with better cuts they have less reason to push lootboxes and MTXs but guess what, they'll probably still do that. Because they aren't our friends. I'd wager that the people truly benefiting from the difference in the cut are not the people programming the game, doing the art, doing the design, etc. It's probably the bosses and executives who work at most 40 hours a week while telling other human beings they have to work over 60 hours a week. I care about the workers, not executives that get upset about criticism or people who don't want to spend over 100 bucks on a game yet see the most reward from the practices.

There's nothing probable about it. They'll keep nickel-and-diming everything and find new ways to do so regardless of if they get 100% or 2% of sales. The move to digital sure as hell didn't make games cheaper. In fact, they made AAA games more expensive on PC.

Most devs are complete cunts or spinless worms. I'd argue the less some retard on the other side of planet that hates my guts gets of my money, the better. Most of it goes to some suit and not the people that make the games anyway.

 

[Kutulu]

Developers can suck a dick, triple A is literal garbage full of politics and 56 ways to get teenagers to spend their parents hard earned cash via microtranactions...
And even if it isnt teenagers, swindling retards out of their money isnt moral either. Now why should i give 2 fucks about indies that instantly run after that corporate money that ruined triple a in the first place.


Epic is just another boil on a diseased industry.

 

[Squid]

There's nothing probable about it. They'll keep nickel-and-diming everything and find new ways to do so regardless of if they get 100% or 2% of sales. The move to digital sure as hell didn't make games cheaper. In fact, they made AAA games more expensive on PC.

Most devs are complete cunts or spinless worms. I'd argue the less some retard on the other side of planet that hates my guts gets of my money, the better. Most of it goes to some suit and not the people that make the games anyway.

That's essentially what I was saying. Some big boss gets most of the profits anyway, the people who work the hardest don't get the benefits that Epic's deal brings. I'm more favorable to development teams than publishers but they both have the bosses pushing the workers around.

 

[passerby]

Individual developer's salaries are already paid before the game is even released and they do not receive any benefits from games profits, hell many of them may not even work there anymore.
So the only logical conclusion of your line of thinking is that we all should just travel high seas...

Because profits have nothing to do with quality of job opportunities, or investment decisions regarding what kind of games are being produced, right ? For a while I thought I talk with adults. Signing off.

 

[Squid]

So the only logical conclusion of your line of thinking is that we should all just travel high seas...

Not what I said was it? I know the workers get paid before hand. I know that the game performing well helps them return. But that doesn't mean I want to be treated in a way I don't like. If I don't want Tencent making money off me, what's wrong with that? I've bought games in places that aren't Steam or GOG. Epic is the only place I've absolutely refused to buy something so far. I'm happy to buy games legally but I'm not happy to do it on Epic. And I think I should be able to complain about Epic exclusivity to these people and let them know there are people that feel this way. Customers and potential customers should be allowed to voice how they feel about something. If they don't change it, oh well, I might buy the game later I guess? Also know that I have no issue with exclusive titles if they're made by Epic and released only on their store. That's fine. But no, go ahead and imply that I'm a pirate and a child. Next time just say it outright.

Signing off.

Bye.

 

[passerby]

I didn't said you are a pirate, just pointed out an obvious logical fallacy and called you a child for committing it.

 

[what am i doing]

So the only logical conclusion of your line of thinking is that we all should just travel high seas...

Good suggestion - if you absolutely must play something sold by Epic, at least pirating it means they don't get any of your money. And it can only be a good thing for society, if left-leaning people like them profit less.

 

[Squid]

I get that the cut difference is better for developers and that they could get better pay/salaries or bigger budgets for games and benefits for the workers due to expecting more revenue from their game. I get that. What I'm saying is, do you think that actually happens or do the bosses just hoard it for themselves?

When developers that actually do work come out and say that their work life has been noticeably improved due to the Epic 12% cut, then I'll be a bit more supportive of it. And like I said, I want everyone to adopt this cut rate. What's the fallacy I'm committing? Show me it and I might be inclined to agree with you instead of you just saying "huuu logical fallacy u child." And me responding to that. You want an adult conversation? You gotta be one too. Committing a logical fallacy doesn't make you a child, calling someone out on something without explaining how they messed up and then saying they're a child seems more childish to me. I bet you're an adult but I'd appreciate it if you communicated with me more effectively and not resort to insulting me. Hell, I don't think I've insulted you once this entire time yet here you are doing it again. I don't care about insults or what you think of me but don't bring up the idea of an adult conversation while calling someone consumerist sheeple and a child.

 

[passerby]

If that make you feel better, I didn't realise I don't talk with an adult and thought you were more mature than half of the shitposters in this thread, so I expressed my dissapointment when your arguments became naive, it wasn't also directed just at you

 

[Silentstorm]

Is Epic still allowing developers to choose if there will be reviews for their games or not?

That's one of the things i dislike about them, yes, i know there was review bombing in many games on Steam many times, but you could generally find one or two useful reviews, allowing developers to just shut up gamers seems like a stupid move, particularly in a world where people can just make their own reviews on forums, Youtube and what not.

 

[Cromwell]

When developers that actually do work come out and say that their work life has been noticeably improved due to the Epic 12% cut, then I'll be a bit more supportive of it

Most of the time, publishers get the money first, then some more until the advances are paid. If developers get money from their games directly more often than not its publicly funded through soemthing like kickstarter which means you as a backer get fucked. The only people I can think of that directly worked on the game and get the money from it are probably smaller indies and theyre better off on steam anyways. But I forgot that giving money to publlishers claiming its better for devs while fucking the consumers is the adult stance here.

 

[Metro]

When developers that actually do work come out and say that their work life has been noticeably improved due to the Epic 12% cut, then I'll be a bit more supportive of it.

We already know that any such statement would be a crock of shit. Travis Baldree made enough money with Rebel Galaxy 1 on Steam and GOG to develop 90% of Rebel Galaxy 2 well before Epic reared its head and offered him an excl0000000000sive.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

When developers that actually do work come out and say that their work life has been noticeably improved due to the Epic 12% cut, then I'll be a bit more supportive of it.

We already know that any such statement would be a crock of shit. Travis Baldree made enough money with Rebel Galaxy 1 on Steam and GOG to develop 90% of Rebel Galaxy 2 well before Epic reared its head and offered him an excl0000000000sive.

if my employer offered me money to make a meaningless statement on social media I'd do it
so, yeah, this post is right

 

[RolePlayer]

I think Steam is one of those platforms that are really easy to take for granted -- that platform is loaded with pro consumer features. My favorite is the user reviews and all of the filters to really drill down to the information you want before purchasing a game. I also LOVE the Steam API that lets you see what games are most active, how long people play them on average, etc. this is all great information to have before letting go of your hard earned money.

The business model of steam is "let's build all the shit customers would want/demand in a platform and let word of mouth marketing drive demand for our product"
The business model of epic is "let's use our capital to strong arm the competition, buy exclusive rights and artificially drive up demand"

If you are on the customer side of this equation you have to be a fucking retard to support the epic business model over that of steams.

 

[what am i doing]

allowing developers to just shut up gamers seems like a stupid move

I think it's actually a fairly clever way of endearing their platform to fellow anti-consumer companies. Any publisher/developer that supports dishonest business practices will be very happy with that sort of feature as it allows them to reduce a user's ability to find out whether a game is actually good or not in advance. Publishers used to be able to very tightly control the image of a game before it came out when they'd just have journalists (bought and paid for) give their game a positive score even if it was total garbage - this paired with a rapid decline in the availability of game demos substantially reduced the ability to determine if a game was good or not before buying. Of course you could find more accurate information online, but for the casual masses the game journalist's lies were quite effective. Steam reviews blew a giant hole in this because now people would see (much more honest) user reviews right on the store page and even if all the journalists rated a shitty game favourably, when the casual user got to the store page on Steam to buy it he'd see negative user reviews and have a chance to be warned that the game was actually shit.

Businesses with anti-consumer attitudes - such as Epic - have been really mad about this ever since it started up, because it reduced their ability to misrepresent their product and effectively cheat people out of their money.

 

[V_K]

Some games are so exclusive to EGS that only EGS can have them and not you.

 

[RolePlayer]

Developers are already starting to decline Epic exclusivity deals because of potential brand damage

So far at least two developers have openly expressed that they have declined or would not accept exclusivity deals for their game. Apparently Epic tried to snatch Rise of Industry, which is currently on Steam, but the company declined the deal because they do not believe in restricting player choice

Factorio is another game that Epic is very likely to have tried to grab as an exclusive. In their latest developer blog, Factorio devs stated that there will be ''no selling-out to big companies that would use the game as cash grab while destroying the brand (we actually declined to negotiate "investment opportunities" like this several times already, no matter what the price would be), the same would be when it would potentially come to any exclusivity deals, which is its own subject... ''

The point of all of this is that the consumer backlash is finally starting to take effect, otherwise developers would not use them declining an exclusivity deal as a source of positive PR that they can share with the public.

Thanks to r/fuckepic for digging out this information.

https://www.reddit.com/r/pcgaming/comments/bkm55m/developers_are_already_starting_to_decline_epic/

 

[Paul_cz]

Factorio devs are great. And I am not saying that just because they are czech.

 

[Rahdulan]

Interesting. Wonder if we'll soon be able to agree on whether the price of burning your company's image and players' goodwill is worth whatever Epic guaranteed to sellout devs.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

Factorio devs are great. And I am not saying that just because they are czech.

They do tick a lot of Czech boxes.

 

[MadMaxHellfire]

Developers are already starting to decline Epic exclusivity deals because of potential brand damage

"potential brand damage" even before the first big hit has been sold on the store. this store has still to fully open but people can already smell its stench from the other side of the street.
amazing.

 

[Viata]