Epic Games Store - the console war comes to PC

[CthuluIsSpy]

Its almost as if the Epic Store client is shit tier.

I mean, Steam is still a bit bullshit in that you can't download an offline installer of the games you bought, so if you can't log into your account due to lack of internet or whatever you can't play the games you own, but at least the client works and actually looks and behaves decently. Epic is just crap. Worst client I have tried, 2/10 would not bang.

 

[Ezeekiel]

Its almost as if the Epic Store client is shit tier.

I mean, Steam is still a bit bullshit in that you can't download an offline installer of the games you bought, so if you can't log into your account due to lack of internet or whatever you can't play the games you own, but at least the client works and actually looks and behaves decently. Epic is just crap. Worst client I have tried, 2/10 would not bang.

You can just copy the game folders for games which don't use any of the drm options and start the games through the executables/make shortcuts.

Edit: there are apparently also workarounds for steamworks titles. Never tried myself, but maybe worth checking out.
See the pcgamingwiki or other such places.


I don't think it's feasible to expect a big store like steam to enforce a no-drm policy... Publishers aren't going to accept it.

Steam's more balanced than truly consumer-focused anyway. It gives consumers, devs and publishers each plenty of options without really favoring one imo.
Epic seemed to want to favor publishers above all in order to attract them and force users to migrate.

I wonder if those publishers are just trying to use epic in order to try and force concessions out of valve or something.

 

[DalekFlay]

You can just copy the game folders for games which don't use any of the drm options and start the games through the executables/make shortcuts.

This only works on rare games, mostly indies. GOG's forum has a list. The vast majority of Steam games require Steam and a verified account to load, making "backups" pointless.

 

[PulsatingBrain]

now even Ubisoft got enough balls to remove their new shit from Steams storefront

Ubisoft released AC Odyssey on Steam last year, and there are loads of AC games on there. Looks like all of them. Or did they announce that they're stopping recently?

 

[Ezeekiel]

You can just copy the game folders for games which don't use any of the drm options and start the games through the executables/make shortcuts.

This only works on rare games, mostly indies. GOG's forum has a list. The vast majority of Steam games require Steam and a verified account to load, making "backups" pointless.

"the game folders for games which don't use any of the drm options" <- this is even in the part you quoted

 

[PulsatingBrain]

"the game folders for games which don't use any of the drm options" <- this is even in the part you quoted

His point was that it's an option for such a tiny amount of games, especially new releases, that it does very little to offset that particular downside of Steam.

 

[Black Angel]

You can just copy the game folders for games which don't use any of the drm options and start the games through the executables/make shortcuts.

I don't think it's feasible to expect a big store like steam to enforce a no-drm policy... Publishers aren't going to accept it.

There's a list of DRM-free games on Steam out there: https://pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/The_Big_List_of_DRM-Free_Games_on_Steam one thing of note though, this list and probably just about any other list out there are incomplete. This list doesn't include Age of Decadence and Tales of Maj'Eyal, both proven to be DRM-free and can be launched straight from their .exe, from my own personal experience.

Meanwhile, another list I checked the other day didn't include Underrail, which is also proven to be DRM-free.

Now, here's the weirdest shit I've ever encountered upon looking at the lists. Fucking Paradox, out of all publishers out there, is maintaining a full-on DRM-free policy for ALL their developed games. If you check another list, they'll also give citation where Paradox proclaimed that the games they developed is and will always be DRM-free. I guess it's to maintain the balance of their DLC policy.

I wonder if those publishers are just trying to use epic in order to try and force concessions out of valve or something.

This is the most likely scenario. To put things into perspective, remember the Adpocalypse that plagued Youtube a few years back? Pewdiepie pointed out that these companies didn't pull ads from Youtube out of integrity and/or moral concern. Instead, they did it to leverage a better deal in the future with Youtube for themselves.

The exact same thing is happening now with Epic's shenanigans. Except these publishers are riding atop of Epic, contrary to those companies riding off of Youtube's mistakes. The big publishers *might* have a slight chance of making Valve budge from high profile games being available only on Epic and their own launcher from day 1, but if Valve is going to ever make a move it's sure as hell not in response to Epic's shenanigans. What's hilarious about this is the small shrimps of snowflakes indie devs who thought they can get anything good out of this other than instant bucks.

"the game folders for games which don't use any of the drm options" <- this is even in the part you quoted

His point was that it's an option for such a tiny amount of games, especially new releases, that it does very little to offset that particular downside of Steam.

Well, my gaming interest mostly aligned with the games listed as DRM-free, so I don't mind Steam's necessary evil of at least have the launcher to download and install the game.

 

[fantadomat]

 

[Jenkem]

This only works on rare games, mostly indies. GOG's forum has a list. The vast majority of Steam games require Steam and a verified account to load, making "backups" pointless.

and "cracking" steamworks DRM is literally a text file

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Since apparently it was 2K's idea to sell it as an epic exclusive first, and now this, I think Randy is really being used as a "face" for Borderlands but actually doesn't even get decide how much sugar goes into his coffee.

 

[DalekFlay]

and "cracking" steamworks DRM is literally a text file

Last I checked it was a lot more complicated than that, but I don't pay much attention since I buy my shit and Steam isn't going anywhere. If it's that easy now though, then good.

 

[Markman]

now even Ubisoft got enough balls to remove their new shit from Steams storefront

Ubisoft released AC Odyssey on Steam last year, and there are loads of AC games on there. Looks like all of them. Or did they announce that they're stopping recently?

They didnt remove any games from the store, just chose to not release any new game on it in 2019.
First game they skipped was Division 2, then Anno 1800 and upcoming new Ghost Recon game wont be on Steam.
Seems they think uPlay install base is big enough to stand on its own and it is pretty big. Just recently they bragged that RS Siege was played by more than 45 million. Its alot of ppl for just one game and then add AC, Farcry crowd.

Bit shitty move tho, dont think there is alot of money difference, if you play any Ubi games you get those club units and can use em to get 20% off anything in their store.

 

[J1M]

All in all, this was Epic showing a suprisingly bad side of themselves, and by that i mean, i thought Epic would be able to do a freaking sale, it's not as if they could have, i don't know, looked at GOG, Humble Bundle, Steam and various other digital stores and seen how they did sales.

Epic is a big company and while they are new at the digital store thing, even i thought they could double check to see if developers knew how the sale would be like, but silly me for overestimating Epic, seriously, the idea that they could do such a bad job that Paradox and Klei would take their games off the store during the sale never even crossed my mind.

Either way, i doubt this won't sour developer's relationships with Epic in some way.

It really undermines consumer confidence in a passive way to see items disappear from the store. What are the chances your games will be there in 5 years? 10? Sure, pulling things from the storefront is different, but the last two products I went to the Epic store to purchase (Anno and Bloodlines 2 sale) were unavailable for purchase because they were pulled down(?) based on poor handling of the store.

 

[PrettyDeadman]

Its almost as if the Epic Store client is shit tier.

I mean, Steam is still a bit bullshit in that you can't download an offline installer of the games you bought, so if you can't log into your account due to lack of internet or whatever you can't play the games you own, but at least the client works and actually looks and behaves decently. Epic is just crap. Worst client I have tried, 2/10 would not bang.

You can play most of steam game you own without internet connection. You just need to download everything and keep it on your hard drive.

 

[PulsatingBrain]

You can play most of the game you own without internet connection. You just need to download everything and keep it on your hard drive.

Don't you have to put it into offline mode first, meaning that an unexpected outage leaves you totally fucked?

 

[Ezeekiel]

You can play most of the game you own without internet connection. You just need to download everything and keep it on your hard drive.

Don't you have to put it into offline mode first, meaning that an unexpected outage leaves you totally fucked?

No, it gives you the option to restart in offline mode once it fails to get a connection.


Edit: To be fair, there was a time when offline mode randomly decided it wanted games to update first before starting them, and thus became useless without a connection :D
Fortunately, that's been long fixed. Haven't had any problems with offline mode in ages.

 

[Drakron]

They didnt remove any games from the store, just chose to not release any new game on it in 2019.

Far Cry New Dawn and Starlink: Battle for Atlas.
(And Anno 1800 pre-order BS)

Not I am not saying you are wrong but they arent EA that supports Origin exclusivity on their titles because of their Sport titles, UbiSoft have nothing for their store to be sustainable on its own, they dont have either EA sport titles or Activision CoD to do it, even AssCreed aint enough.

 

[DalekFlay]

Edit: To be fair, there was a time when offline mode randomly decided it wanted games to update first before starting them, and thus became useless without a connection :D
Fortunately, that's been long fixed. Haven't had any problems with offline mode in ages.

Yeah, I got fucked by offline mode in the past but they made it a lot better. I loved in a rural area for 6 months or so once on an overseas job and kept Steam in offline mode for the whole time and never had a problem. Still against any DRM on principle, but Steam's is definitely the "best" of a bad lot.

 

[V_K]

Wonder why the media didn't pick on this one yet, since I got zero from Googling.

Now they finally caught up: https://kotaku.com/epic-games-store-will-block-your-account-if-you-buy-too-1834905266

 

[LESS T_T]

Actual result from THQ Nordic: https://mb.cision.com/Main/15049/2822061/1049648.pdf

Business area Games – Coffee Stain

Coffee Stain released the following new products in the quarter ended March 2019:

Goat Simulator: The GOATY (Switch)
Satisfactory (Early access) (PC)

Net sales of business area Coffee Stain were SEK 98 million. In the quarter we had a successful early access launch of Satisfactory on the Epic Games store. The game exceeded management’s expectations at the time of our recent acquisition of Coffee Stain.

During the coming year, Coffee Stain Studios in Skövde will focus heavily on continued development and improvements on Satisfactory, which has become one of the Group’s key IP’s. The business has great momentum and has proven their ability to develop and publish quality content in high demand. After the quarter end, Coffee Stain Studios has signed two unannounced Investments and publishing agreements with two different Scandinavian developers.

I don't think Goat Sim sells big at this point even on Switch (otherwise it should be noted there), I guesstimate Satisfactory has sold around 400K~700K copies on Epic.

edit: oops, one more zero.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

All those vague "it sold 45 times as much as that one game we were selling as a boxed version at a halal burger joint in Kazachstan 12 years ago and that never existed" statements sound amusingly

 

[V_K]

I don't think Goat Sim sells big at this point even on Switch (otherwise it should be noted there), I guesstimate Satisfactory has sold around 400K~700K copies on Epic.

Um, check your math. 98 mil sek is roughly 9 mil euro. Satisfactory costing 30 euro per copy, that's at most 300k copies (340k if the 98 mil sek figure is after the Epic took its cut), provided Goat Sim didn't sell anything. Even factoring in regional pricing (I have no idea if Epic does them now), 400k seems more like the upper border of what it could have sold.

 

[passerby]

100% - 30% steam cut - 25% taxes - 5% UE license = 40%
100% - 12% epic cut - 25% taxes = 63%
40/63=0,63

They can sell 40% less copies than on Steam and still be no worse financially.
Unsold copies are also still untapped customers, if Epic will stay, there will be more people coming over time, there are sales and even releasing on Steam eventually, so if they sell in the first months at least 50% of what they would sell on Steam it'll be fine long term.

 

[PrettyDeadman]

100% - 30% steam cut - 25% taxes - 5% UE license = 40%
100% - 12% epic cut - 25% taxes = 63%
40/63=0,63

They can sell 40% less copies than on Steam and still be no worse financially.
Unsold copies are also still untapped customers, if Epic will stay, there will be more people coming over time, there are sales and even releasing on Steam eventually, so if they sell in the first months at least 50% of what they would sell on Steam it'll be fine long term.

What if they only sell ~1% of steam like they did with new Metro?

 

[MuscleSpark]

Net sales of business area Coffee Stain were SEK 98 million. In the quarter we had a successful early access launch of Satisfactory on the Epic Games store. The game exceeded management’s expectations at the time of our recent acquisition of Coffee Stain.

Wonder how much of those 98 million SEK Epic paid upfront, and if management's low expectations are why they took the deal in the first place.