All good CRPG's are rooted in P&P

[Noddy]

Classic crpg's tried to simulate talbetop roleplaying. Kickstarter era CRPG's try to simulate the old games that tried to simulate tabletop roleplaying (exeption being pathfinder). It's my theory that this is what makes them shit and every decent CRPG is tied to pen & paper. Let us investigate through the top 20 codex crpgs:

PST -> Direct adaptation of AD&D
Fallout -> Once removed from GURPS
Fallout 2 -> Once removed from GURPS
BG2 -> Direct adaptation of AD&D
Arcanum-> System heavily inspired by p&p and could easily be adapted to tabletop.
VTMB -> Direct adaptation of VTM
Morrowind -> Walking simulator garbage voted for by morons.
FNV -> Walking simulator garbage voted for by morons.
Gothic 2 -> Possibly walking simulator garbage voted for by morons. I never played it due to the above two games poisoning my mind well against anything that looks like a walking simulator.
Wiz 8 -> Orginal wiz was a fairly straight homebrewed OD&D which makes 6-7 once removed and 8 twice removed from OD&D.
Dues Ex -> Not an RPG
Mask of the Betrayer -> Direct adaptation of 3rd ed
JA2 -> Not an RPG
Dark Souls -> JRPG/not an RPG
Wiz 7 -> Once removed from OD&D.
Betrayal at Krondor -> Based on books. Close enough.
BG -> Direct adaptation of AD&D
Darklands -> System heavily inspired by p&p and could easily be adapted to tabletop.
KOTOR 2 -> Direct adaptation of D20
Ultima Underworld -> Doesn't count but unfortunately i'm running out of space and so can't elaborate.

In conclusion all good CRPG's are based on tabletop except the ones that aren't.

 

[aeroaeko]

my butt smells so bad and all my coworkers make mean faces at me when they pass by how do i fix this?

 

[SniperHF]

Like half these games have shit implementations of their inspirations and several are considered good despite their systems. No one (of sane mind anyway) is recommending KOTOR 2 cause they are all hopped up on D20.

 

[Tavernking]

Now lets look at the top selling RPGs of all time

1. Pokemon - not based on tabletop
2. Skyrim - not based on tabletop
3. World of Warcraft - not based on tabletop
4. Diablo - not based on tabletop
5. Guild wars - not based on tabletop
5. Diablo 2 - not based on tabletop
6. EverQuest - not based on tabletop
7. Witcher series - not based on tabletop
etc.

 

[mondblut]

Now lets look at the top selling RPGs of all time

1. Pokemon - not based on tabletop
2. Skyrim - not based on tabletop
3. World of Warcraft - not based on tabletop
4. Diablo - not based on tabletop
5. Guild wars - not based on tabletop
5. Diablo 2 - not based on tabletop
6. EverQuest - not based on tabletop
7. Witcher series - not based on tabletop
etc.

Incidentally, they all suck.

 

[Sordid MCA/Prosper Hybryd]

Morrowind -> Walking simulator garbage voted for by morons.
FNV -> Walking simulator garbage voted for by morons.

 

[Catacombs]

Now lets look at the top selling RPGs of all time

1. Pokemon - not based on tabletop
2. Skyrim - not based on tabletop
3. World of Warcraft - not based on tabletop
4. Diablo - not based on tabletop
5. Guild wars - not based on tabletop
5. Diablo 2 - not based on tabletop
6. EverQuest - not based on tabletop
7. Witcher series - not based on tabletop
etc.

Pokemon? An RPG? I don't know, man.

 

[Swigen]

my butt smells so bad and all my coworkers make mean faces at me when they pass by how do i fix this?

You’re probably not wiping your ass properly or you’re wiping prematurely. If you’re wiping prematurely ie; before you’re finished crapping, you should probably take a natural diuretic like coffee to help better empty your bowels. If you’re not wiping your ass properly ie; going front to back only, then you need to start incorporating back to front movements into your wiping ASAP. In my experience you can wipe front to back a few times, look at the tissue, it’s clean. But wait! You’re not done yet! Wipe BACK to front, look at the tissue, it’s dirty! You need to go both ways ‘til the tissue is clean!!!

Hope this helps.

 

[Mastermind]

Incidentally, they all suck.

guild wars has better combat than all of your faggot 30 year old turn based rpgs put together

 

[deuxhero]

Your arguments on Arcanum and Darklands are literally that they're "inspired" by tabletop. What about main series Ultima? Zill o'll?

Mastermind

We looked around for role playing games that weren’t all about numbers going up. In our search, we were inspired by Magic: the Gathering. In Magic, the more you play, the more abilities you acquire, but that doesn’t make you strictly more powerful than other players. You pick and choose abilities from your collection, and your choices determine how well you do.

With Guild Wars, we sought to make a Magic-inspired role playing game. The more you play, the more abilities you can choose among, but it’s your choices and strategy that matter.

 

[Ismaul]

you need to start incorporating back to front movements into your wiping ASAP.

Next step: Introduce a finger wrapped in tissue to clean the inner surface of your exit hole.

Next step: Enjoy.

Next slippery step: You're now ready for le D.

 

[aeroaeko]

Hope this helps.

it does a little, ive only been doing front to back
ive started using wet wipes which has helped a bit
i just dont want everyone to know me as the guy that smells like poo, my insecurities are big enough as it is and i already smell bad from smoking a pack a day and working in a casino

 

[Noddy]

How far the codex has fallen to vote the obvious truth 'retarded'. I can only assume it is now populated by the morbidly obese who consider walking to be the height of fantasy roleplaying. Retract these votes immediatly or i will forever think you fat.

Like half these games have shit implementations of their inspirations and several are considered good despite their systems. No one (of sane mind anyway) is recommending KOTOR 2 cause they are all hopped up on D20.

The D20 system provides the basis for everything that KOTOR 2 is. For any character to have meaning in a CRPG you must have a way to interact meaningfully with them, and for them to be able to meaningfully interact with you. Meaning is given by the system.

For example, if my PC makes friends with his companions he can train them to be a Jedi. But what does this mean? It means they are more powerful. I know it means that because they can now use a lightsaber. But what does a lightsaber mean? It's meaning is conveyed by its stats which show it does a meaningful amount more damage. Damages meaning? An abtraction relative to hp, another meaningful stat, of how close to death a character is. Death of course being the ultimate in meangful interactions. To summerise: it all means only what the D20 system allows it to mean.

Do you think that a remake of KOTOR 2 in Skyrim's engine could ever mean as much as the orignal?

DO YOU?

Your arguments on Arcanum and Darklands are literally that they're "inspired" by tabletop. What about main series Ultima? Zill o'll?

What about them?

 

[Ismaul]

Death of course being the ultimate in meangful interactions.

Maybe you need to introduce some meaning in your life.

 

[Dawkinsfan69]

I think what's important is that those games not only adapt mechanics from PnP (stats/dice rolls etc..) but they also adapt the design philosophy behind PnP. In all of the rpgs that you mentioned, there's a central plot, but the progression through that plot is largely decided and influenced by the player, as it would be in PnP. You feel like you're making the story, rather than being pulled through on rails

 

[rusty_shackleford]

a solid 80% of the games on this page are shit: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Dungeons_&_Dragons_video_games

 

[Ismaul]

Noddy to answer seriously to your thread, a good RPG system is one that is tailored to the gameplay experience it is designed to give.

Take Gothic for example, it's not based on an existing PnP system, but every character build choice changes gameplay interactions meaningfully, and there are no attributes or skills that are useless to the gameplay. Hell, it's the only game where putting points in combat skills directly changes the moves/animations available to you in combat. That is a system designed for its medium, PC RPGs, rather than a ported PnP system that was made for different purposes and different methods of interaction (i.e. via talking to a GM and using dice rather than through a UI and using scripted outcomes).

 

[Rhuantavan]

Betrayal at Krondor -> Based on books. Close enough.

Books, which were based on a pen and paper RPG.

 

[J_C]

Classic crpg's tried to simulate talbetop roleplaying. Kickstarter era CRPG's try to simulate the old games that tried to simulate tabletop roleplaying (exeption being pathfinder). It's my theory that this is what makes them shit and every decent CRPG is tied to pen & paper. Let us investigate through the top 20 codex crpgs:

PST -> Direct adaptation of AD&D
Fallout -> Once removed from GURPS
Fallout 2 -> Once removed from GURPS
BG2 -> Direct adaptation of AD&D
Arcanum-> System heavily inspired by p&p and could easily be adapted to tabletop.
VTMB -> Direct adaptation of VTM
Morrowind -> Walking simulator garbage voted for by morons.
FNV -> Walking simulator garbage voted for by morons.
Gothic 2 -> Possibly walking simulator garbage voted for by morons. I never played it due to the above two games poisoning my mind well against anything that looks like a walking simulator.
Wiz 8 -> Orginal wiz was a fairly straight homebrewed OD&D which makes 6-7 once removed and 8 twice removed from OD&D.
Dues Ex -> Not an RPG
Mask of the Betrayer -> Direct adaptation of 3rd ed
JA2 -> Not an RPG
Dark Souls -> JRPG/not an RPG
Wiz 7 -> Once removed from OD&D.
Betrayal at Krondor -> Based on books. Close enough.
BG -> Direct adaptation of AD&D
Darklands -> System heavily inspired by p&p and could easily be adapted to tabletop.
KOTOR 2 -> Direct adaptation of D20
Ultima Underworld -> Doesn't count but unfortunately i'm running out of space and so can't elaborate.

In conclusion all good CRPG's are based on tabletop except the ones that aren't.

Good job contradicting yourself with the opening post. As you have written yourself, not every good RPG is rooted in P&P. Morrowind, FNV, Gothic 2, JA2, Dark Souls, Ultima Underworld are great non-P&P RPGs, action-RPGs, despite your drivel.

 

[Black Angel]

AoD and Underrail are good cRPGs not rooted in P&P. They might draw inspiration from them, but sure as hell not actually rooted in P&Ps.

 

[JarlFrank]

D&D isn't even that great a system for CRPGs. It's great for pen and paper, yes, but CRPG systems are better when they're designed from the ground up.

 

[Duckard]

You are correct, but only because all crpgs are rooted in p&p. Some of them don't know that they are, but they are.

 

[J_C]

D&D isn't even that great a system for CRPGs. It's great for pen and paper, yes, but CRPG systems are better when they're designed from the ground up.

As Pillars of Eternity has shown us.

 

[Circuit the Short]

PST -> Direct adaptation of AD&D
Fallout -> Once removed from GURPS
Fallout 2 -> Once removed from GURPS
BG2 -> Direct adaptation of AD&D
Arcanum-> System heavily inspired by p&p and could easily be adapted to tabletop.
VTMB -> Direct adaptation of VTM
Morrowind -> Walking simulator garbage voted for by morons.
FNV -> Walking simulator garbage voted for by morons.
Gothic 2 -> Possibly walking simulator garbage voted for by morons. I never played it due to the above two games poisoning my mind well against anything that looks like a walking simulator.
Wiz 8 -> Orginal wiz was a fairly straight homebrewed OD&D which makes 6-7 once removed and 8 twice removed from OD&D.
Dues Ex -> Not an RPG
Mask of the Betrayer -> Direct adaptation of 3rd ed
JA2 -> Not an RPG
Dark Souls -> JRPG/not an RPG
Wiz 7 -> Once removed from OD&D.
Betrayal at Krondor -> Based on books. Close enough.
BG -> Direct adaptation of AD&D
Darklands -> System heavily inspired by p&p and could easily be adapted to tabletop.
KOTOR 2 -> Direct adaptation of D20
Ultima Underworld -> Doesn't count but unfortunately i'm running out of space and so can't elaborate.

Only seven of these games are good.

 

[DJOGamer PT]

Morrowind -> Walking simulator garbage voted for by morons.
FNV -> Walking simulator garbage voted for by morons.
Gothic 2 -> Possibly walking simulator garbage voted for by morons. I never played it due to the above two games poisoning my mind well against anything that looks like a walking simulator.
...
Dues Ex -> Not an RPG
...
Ultima Underworld -> Doesn't count but unfortunately i'm running out of space and so can't elaborate.