Eternity Pillars of Eternity + The White March Expansion Thread

[PsychoFox]

Okay super codex bros. what am i doing wrong that has me not enjoy PoE? On the surface this game should be right up my alley but I'm just not feeling it. The combat feels very unsatisfying, the story for all its twists and turns is not gripping me, and the presentation is overall not holding on to me. Is it me or the is the game that's the problem? Normally i'd know right away, but i just can't put my finger on it with this game. All the elements for a great experience (and RPG) seem to be here, but still something intangible is missing. What is it?

Are you playing on PotD? The combat is pointless on lower difficulties.

Try to stick out till White March (immediately after you get your stronghold), if that doesn't interest you drop the game, it won't get better.

That's sad to hear. I guess is should've expected this to be the case. I mean the combat is just okay, the writing is just okay, having a keep is just okay... It just doesn't grab me for some reason. The thing is, i can't say that any of the elements here are done poorly, but the whole somehow ends up being lesser than the sum of its parts.

 

[Lacrymas]

Okay super codex bros. what am i doing wrong that has me not enjoy PoE?

The magical formula to enjoy PoE - skip ALL descriptive text in dialogue, skim through the dialogues just so you can get the gist of what is being said (nobody is saying anything important you can't check in the journal), don't click on golden NPCs, don't click on the tombstone symbols, take only the companion (singular) you like (if any) and fill the other spots with hirelings, treat it as one massive dungeon crawl you play for the combat, turn on disposition markings in dialogue, don't pay too much attention to the setting. Some optional things - put auto-pause on enemy sighting, put slow mode to activate automatically when entering combat, check the box to stop your characters from moving when you engage combat, auto-pause on discovering hidden things with mechanics.

Play on PotD of course. Don't have high expectations. Try to make it up until White March. Base game is incredibly carcinogenic and so, so boring and pointless, so you might as well stop after doing all WM content, base game gets worse and worse.

 

[MajorMace]

It just doesn't grab me for some reason.

I could grab you.

You summed it up basically, it's a bunch of poor-to-okay elements mixed together in a way that doesn't feel really consistent. The writing doesn't help.
Imagine that this is the 3.x version. At release it was even worse.

 

[PsychoFox]

Play on PotD of course. Don't have high expectations. Try to make it up until White March. Base game is incredibly carcinogenic and so, so boring and pointless, so you might as well stop after doing all WM content, base game gets worse and worse.

What does WM do that's so praise worthy? Isn't it basically the same combat system?

I could grab you.

You summed it up basically, it's a bunch of poor-to-okay elements mixed together in a way that doesn't feel really consistent. The writing doesn't help.
Imagine that this is the 3.x version. At release it was even worse.

Glad to know i'm not the only one who thinks so. I'm surprised at how well received this game is considering.

 

[Lacrymas]

Combat is okayish, you wouldn't know what's wrong with it until level 10 or so, and only if you pay attention. What exactly don't you like about the combat?

 

[Butter]

WM has a better story, better encounter design, better items, better companions, and it doesn't overstay its welcome.

 

[Lacrymas]

I wouldn't say better companions, they are all cut from the same cloth, the kind of cloth that doesn't go anywhere. And the barbarian chick from WM is the worst of them all. I rank the companions like this: Durance > Grieving Mother >>>>>>>> Zahua > Hiravias >>>>>>>>>>>>> everyone else. Some of them are worse than others (Pallegina is perhaps the best), but it doesn't really matter, everyone besides these 4 are completely pointless and I'd argue everyone outside Durance is not a good exercise in writing a character in a story. If I was forced to pick a party, I'd go with Durance, GM, Zahua, Hiravias and Pallegina.

 

[Tigranes]

WM is a nice tight sort of IWD ish experience, main campaign suffers from having to be an all rounded lengthy fantasy romp sort of like how NWN2 OC did. I find combat / systems decent - particular strength in the variety of builds it can support - so I guess it depends on why you find it so awful atm and whether that opinion will change.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

I wouldn't say better companions, they are all cut from the same cloth, the kind of cloth that doesn't go anywhere. And the barbarian chick from WM is the worst of them all. I rank the companions like this: Durance > Grieving Mother >>>>>>>> Zahua > Hiravias >>>>>>>>>>>>> everyone else. Some of them are worse than others, but it doesn't really matter, everyone besides these 4 are completely pointless and I'd argue everyone outside Durance is not a good exercise in writing a character in a story.

except eder is the best companion dipshit

 

[PsychoFox]

Combat is okayish, you wouldn't know what's wrong with it until level 10 or so, and only if you pay attention. What exactly don't you like about the combat?

Mostly production quality-wise. I unfortunately went into PoE after PFKM and that has definitely colored my opinion of the game. Firstly, PoE's ruleset is really terrible when you think about all of its inconsistencies and design choices. The animations are low-quality, and so are the effects. It also doesn't have enough punch. It's too fast paced and hectic (i know you can turn on slow mode but still). Also the AI leaves a lot to be desired - specially with pathfinding and engagement/defending. It's a lot of things honestly. I don't HATE the combat, but i don't love either.

 

[PsychoFox]

WM is a nice tight sort of IWD ish experience, main campaign suffers from having to be an all rounded lengthy fantasy romp sort of like how NWN2 OC did. I find combat / systems decent - particular strength in the variety of builds it can support - so I guess it depends on why you find it so awful atm and whether that opinion will change.

Hmm i guess i'm willing to try WM despite what i said before. It's just that base PoE really upset me with how bland it was and i want to know whether people's love of WM is genuine or it's a case of it being held in high regards just because it's compared to the base game.

 

[Butter]

I wouldn't say better companions, they are all cut from the same cloth, the kind of cloth that doesn't go anywhere. And the barbarian chick from WM is the worst of them all. I rank the companions like this: Durance > Grieving Mother >>>>>>>> Zahua > Hiravias >>>>>>>>>>>>> everyone else. Some of them are worse than others (Pallegina is perhaps the best), but it doesn't really matter, everyone besides these 4 are completely pointless and I'd argue everyone outside Durance is not a good exercise in writing a character in a story. If I was forced to pick a party, I'd go with Durance, GM, Zahua, Hiravias and Pallegina.

I liked Maneha's integration in the WM2 story.

 

[AwesomeButton]

Reading IWD's manual is more fun than playing PoE. It took us years to realize this.

 

[DalekFlay]

Hmm i guess i'm willing to try WM despite what i said before. It's just that base PoE really upset me with how bland it was and i want to know whether people's love of WM is genuine or it's a case of it being held in high regards just because it's compared to the base game.

I didn't really find White March to be that different. I guess it's slightly better, but it has the same overall issues PoE does in general. I don't think either are "bad" though, just very average and bland.

 

[Grunker]

I am literally shaking lol

From my review:

you will face off against two dragons AND an archmage (I had to give up on that one and solve it through dialogue – making it the only fight in Pillars I have not beat

Well:

Spoiler

seriously look closely at this screenshot until you realize what's up:

(PotD of course)

Motherfucking christ what a fight. Closest encounter/fight/match I've had in anything in my life. Party was:

Protag: Dagger/Rapier Bleak Walker
Pallegina: Tank
Eder: Estoc
Maneha: St. Ydwen/Firebrand
Durance: General OPness
Aloth: Spellsword

I lost like 20-25 fights and had actually quit to main screen to take a break but decided to take a last shot.

By now my strategy was fairly set in stone - Pallegina to the West with a swarm of summons on her tail, draw the green dragon. Rest of the team fall back for Shackle Prayer, Crown, Devotions. Then summon Concelhaut to Crush of Doom a random mage, kill Llengrath, kill black dragon, kill trash.

At this point usually my team is pretty beat up. Four times before I've gotten to having 4 or 5 guys alive from my team and only the green dragon. This time I use items to escape/dragon leap/charge Llengrath and manage to get a full team facing down the green dragon. However Aloth is at like 20HP (not endurance, health). So he's quickly taken out. I only get one paralyze off on the dragon, it saves against all others, but I switch Durance from buffing to healing and drink Potions of Power on all my guys. Main character uses all three healing chains (her own + 2 from the dagger).

It doesn't work. Dragon gets to 2 hp dots and only durance and eder are left standing despite my other guys using Potions of Major endurance. Eder is a badass with Grey Sleeper though, so with another Crown and Devotion from Durance he manages to take 1 dot off the dragon before going down. I have no 7th level spell slots and only 1 5th level spell slot left on Durance, so no obviousressurections - Durance is all I'm left with. I could ress Maneha or Eder, but they don't have near enough DR or Deflection to deal the remaning damage to the dragon - they will get 2 or 3 shot.

It's over. My heart sinks.

I frantically think if there's anything that can save me - and realize Aloth has 2HP (his portrait being almost grey means I thought he was out) - he can theoretically be rezzed... and I know he has both Hardened Veils left + Llengrath's Safeguard. If he manages to cast those, the dragon can only hit him with lucky shots - though hardened veil will only take one hit.

I ress him. I manage to get the spells off. Use Hardened Veil. Aloth summons the staff. Thinking on my feet, Aloth summons Substantial Phantom as well.

Starts hitting the drake. Drake kills Durance in 1 hit.

I'm now left with 2HP Aloth and the Phantom. Dragon attacks him. Manages to fucking HIT through HV somehow. Luckily through all the buffs, Aloth has enough DR to go down to 1 hit point. He hits the dragon for 6 damage. For 4 damage. For 8 damage. I use all his remaining deflection spells + last hardened veil. Dragon misses. Aloth hits it for 3 damage. 5 damage. Dragon misses. Aloth hits it for 8 damage. During this, the phantom deals a total of 10-15 damage ish to the dragon as well.

Dragon pulls back for a hit. Safeguard has run out. Heart is in my chest. I use the last Hardened Veil. Dragon is about to hit. Aloth hits dragon for 5 damage.

Dragon dead.

Holy what the shit. Whole party down, Aloth survives on 1 health.

Thanks AwesomeButton for spell buff recommendations (I can tell you with the update there's no longer any way to "cheat" the AI, all enemies will join the fight always, including Llengrath - you can bug out the big dragon on a tree stump but I reloaded the one time that happened) as well as Prime Junta for tips.

 

[AwesomeButton]

Glad my advice could be of use.

 

[Prime Junta]

I've seen a lot of close calls but that's got to be one of the closest.

 

[Infinitron]

 

[Lacrymas]

Never had a problem with this fight, two-shot it both times I played through it.

 

[Elephantman]

If anyone ever had questions about the Neutral Positive Disciples, here it is: they are a joke at their own game and want to tell you all about the quality of POE combat xDDDDD

Good God, how do you even lose here with 6 maxed chars? What the fuck? Aloth alone should be able to straight up MELT all the trash including Llen and bring at least one of the dragons to half health by sheer nuking power. And he has a priest and TWO palladins. What kind of larp is this?

 

[PsychoFox]

Just saying that is easy. What's your actual strat for that?

 

[Elephantman]

What strat, breh? He must have 60 base accuracy naked.
Haste, Eldrich Aim +15acc, drop Chillfog -25relfex, twice if must be, and nuke the general area with Fireballs +10acc and nasty Nina fireballs +10acc which Paralyze to boot. And thats Tier 3 and T4 spells... You can Slicken if you get bored.
If you add Devotions +20acc, Bless +5acc, Rest bonus vs Beast +10acc, items vs Beast this becomes an utter joke.

I honestly dont understand how he managed to lose so much HP on his chars. What is he doing? Select all fighter and click dragon and chug potions? Is he larping all-melee and sucking at it?

 

[AwesomeButton]

Post your video hotshot, he will give you his savegame

 

[Grunker]

Wait. You mean to say there are people who are better at abusing PoE-mechanics than me?! brb gonna go kill myself

 

[Lacrymas]

Meh, you are so overpowered by then, I don't really see how you can not have a working tactic memorized by then.