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KickStarter Underworld Ascendant is a disaster

Gunnar

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Jul 10, 2016
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I think that's true for every creative medium, books, movies, comics, whatever

It's true for all big collaborative projects, not sure I'd go so far as to cover books and such with a single author.
 

Grauken

Gourd vibes only
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I think that's true for every creative medium, books, movies, comics, whatever

It's true for all big collaborative projects, not sure I'd go so far as to cover books and such with a single author.

Well, even my favorite authors have only few really great books where every aspect is excellent, it's just easier to get to like a certain style when they manage to remain consistent in their writing

That said, if you think books are not collaborations, a change in publisher/main editor can make a massive change in quality for authors, so I definitely think there's a collaborative aspect to books that's often hidden and underestimated
 

Nano

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Grab the Codex by the pussy Strap Yourselves In
Daily reminder that you want the whole team of game A making the spiritual sequel of game A and not just "guy that worked in game A". As far as we know, this guy may have only worked there as a beta tester.
You don't know Looking Glass's history if you think Tim Stellmach "may have only worked there as a beta tester".
 

Viata

Arcane
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Water Play Catarinense
Daily reminder that you want the whole team of game A making the spiritual sequel of game A and not just "guy that worked in game A". As far as we know, this guy may have only worked there as a beta tester.
You don't know Looking Glass's history if you think Tim Stellmach "may have only worked there as a beta tester".
You don't know how to read if you think I'm talking about Tim Stellmach.
 

Infinitron

I post news
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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
We'll never know for sure how things would have turned out otherwise, but the primary difference between Ascendant and Kingdom Come is that the latter had a budget.

I remember before KCD was Kickstarted there was a period when it looked like it was also struggling to find a budget. I hope that Vavra would have chosen to cancel it if he'd ended up in the same situation as OtherSide.
 

Nyast

Cipher
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Jan 12, 2014
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609
We'll never know for sure how things would have turned out otherwise, but the primary difference between Ascendant and Kingdom Come is that the latter had a budget.

I remember before KCD was Kickstarted there was a period when it looked like it was also struggling to find a budget. I hope that Vavra would have chosen to cancel it if he'd ended up in the same situation as OtherSide.

What was KCD's budget ?

Because UA's budget was like 6 million dollars.

That's fucking insane when you compare it to the end result. And maybe KCD's budget was a bit higher, but not tenfolds either, right ? And while KCD is flawed, it is a real game with actual content. Unlike UA.
 

baud

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RPG Wokedex Strap Yourselves In Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I helped put crap in Monomyth
We'll never know for sure how things would have turned out otherwise, but the primary difference between Ascendant and Kingdom Come is that the latter had a budget.

I remember before KCD was Kickstarted there was a period when it looked like it was also struggling to find a budget. I hope that Vavra would have chosen to cancel it if he'd ended up in the same situation as OtherSide.

What was KCD's budget ?

Because UA's budget was like 6 million dollars.

That's fucking insane when you compare it to the end result. And maybe KCD's budget was a bit higher, but not tenfolds either, right ? And while KCD is flawed, it is a real game with actual content. Unlike UA.

According to wikipedia, KCD's budget was 36.5 M$, including marketing, so actual money spend on the game might be around 20 M$. Also I think it might be cheaper to develop games in Eastern Europe than the US, not by much when you want competent devs that are going to ask high salary, but that still count for something (also cheaper rent for the office and perhaps an EU grant on top of that).

Edit: Ninjaed by zz
 

Curratum

Guest
UA never had any real devs working on it. It's all made by interns and had maybe 500 lines of code from Tim Stellmach before he fucked right off to work on something else.
 

Invictus

Arcane
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Divinity: Original Sin 2
We'll never know for sure how things would have turned out otherwise, but the primary difference between Ascendant and Kingdom Come is that the latter had a budget.

I remember before KCD was Kickstarted there was a period when it looked like it was also struggling to find a budget. I hope that Vavra would have chosen to cancel it if he'd ended up in the same situation as OtherSide.
It is not a question of budget here but the fact of the matter is that the KCD team had a pretty clear idea of what they wanted to produce and what the end product would look like; Otherside spent all this time and effort with their retarded “interactivity” where moving a plate or burning a door seemed “innovative” instead of focusing on making the game fun and hell even functional... this abomination with the KCD budget would still have turned into a even worse disaster because it was mismanaged from the start
 

LESS T_T

Arcane
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Oct 5, 2012
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13,582
Codex 2014
Chris Siegel too?: https://twitter.com/RealChrisSiegel

His Twitter handle was "OthersideSiegel" and he had link to Otherside website on his profile.

He posted on OtherSide forums yesterday two days ago FWIW: https://forums.otherside-e.com/t/this-forum-is-too-dead/10084/18

They removed "OSE Staff" role from Jared (the QA) on Discord but not from Chris.

Looks like he actually left Otherside: https://www.linkedin.com/in/christophersiegel/

Dates Employed Oct 2014 – Jun 2019
Employment Duration 4 yrs 9 mos
Location Boston
 

MasterLobar

Angry OtherSide Refugee
Joined
Feb 17, 2019
Messages
358
Location
Killorn Keep
Good riddance! Any firm that hires this guy should be boycotted by gamers forever.

F*cking up and lying is one thing, mocking your backers in such an arrogant and disdainful way is pretty rare in the gaming industry.

"People expecting a redo of UU are not happy. That was never the plan, its not what we would have built back at LGS after Shock and Thief, and frankly we already built that game 20+ years ago. Maybe we should have just done a remastered for those people."

https://forum.quartertothree.com/t/...ught-to-you-by-zombie-looking-glass/76311/539

ProducktionMalphunkt
Did we miss…yep.
Did we probably overscope, yep.
Are we trying to course correct? yep.
As for ‘did he read what was on the kickstarter page’…I probably wrote it, what 4 years ago. Did design direction change in 4 years…yes for 100 different reasons. I just won’t apologize for that. Good call or bad, that is how development works.

https://forums.otherside-e.com/t/for-the-curious-among-you/9862/16

Untitled.png

"Yep, yep, yep. No apologies for scamming 'those people'. In fact, it was a good idea."
 
Last edited:
Joined
Jan 14, 2018
Messages
50,754
Codex Year of the Donut
What was KCD's budget ?
About 36.5 million dollars including marketing costs according to the Wikipedia.
That + living costs in Czech Republic are somewhat lower than in the US (3-3.5 times, from what I gather).
$36.5m sounds too high. Vavra said the game's development was nearly already paid off 2 days after release with 300k copies sold -- no console sales figures were available to them yet, and he expected it would be paid off the next day. Including various retailer's cuts(was it available on outlets other than Steam?), regional pricing etc., would place that well below $36.5m
 

Mustawd

Guest
What was KCD's budget ?
About 36.5 million dollars including marketing costs according to the Wikipedia.
That + living costs in Czech Republic are somewhat lower than in the US (3-3.5 times, from what I gather).
$36.5m sounds too high. Vavra said the game's development was nearly already paid off 2 days after release with 300k copies sold -- no console sales figures were available to them yet, and he expected it would be paid off the next day. Including various retailer's cuts(was it available on outlets other than Steam?), regional pricing etc., would place that well below $36.5m

Wikipedia quotes that figure as 500K total with 300K on Steam, which puts it closer to what one would expect to recoup $36.6M.
 

MasterLobar

Angry OtherSide Refugee
Joined
Feb 17, 2019
Messages
358
Location
Killorn Keep

So he didn't jump. He was fired. That they laid off QA staff was expected -- nothing to do QA on for a while. But why fire an experienced producer/designer, when they have that mysterious unannounced project (which doesn't exist)?

This is amazing, because unlike the others, he was inner circle. Looking Glass Alumnus, joined Otherside in 2014, even before the kickstarter.

And, well...

"Sorry, but that is like commenting on my family and these people I see just as much as my family."

https://forums.otherside-e.com/t/for-the-curious-among-you/9862/25
 

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