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Jagged Alliance Jagged Alliance 2, Temple of Elemental Evil & Silent Storm Retrospectives

Which game has the best tactics?

  • Jagged Alliance 2

  • Silent Storm

  • Temple of Elemental Evil


Results are only viewable after voting.

Martyr

Arcane
Joined
Jan 28, 2018
Messages
1,102
Location
Bavaria
It is unlikely you meleed them with an arcanist after your spells were depleted, unless you play on easy mode or were grotesquely over-levelled.

I am always grotesquely over-levelled. grinding is a virtue and half the fun of any given game.
 
Self-Ejected

Lilura

RPG Codex Dragon Lady
Joined
Feb 13, 2013
Messages
5,274
So you were grotesquely over-levelled from grinding, with the spell ranges and spell slots that gives you, and you couldn't beat vampire ancients quickly?

Roguey is right on. I think you're a 'tard.
 

Martyr

Arcane
Joined
Jan 28, 2018
Messages
1,102
Location
Bavaria
measuring level of retardation on NWN 2 playstyle.
also acting as if NWN 2 had good gameplay to begin with.
alrighty, then.
 

Efe

Erudite
Joined
Dec 27, 2015
Messages
2,597
that would be suboptimal only when you are metagaming or glued a finger to quick load/save.
killing anything "fast" isnt part of win condition. he killed something you blow half your resources on, in melee with his caster. doesnt that sound optimal resource use wise?
 

Roguey

Codex Staff
Staff Member
Sawyerite
Joined
May 29, 2010
Messages
35,656
that would be suboptimal only when you are metagaming or glued a finger to quick load/save.
killing anything "fast" isnt part of win condition. he killed something you blow half your resources on, in melee with his caster. doesnt that sound optimal resource use wise?

He blew all his resources on it and spent forever whittling it down until it was dead ("I blasted all my remaining spells into him and yet he still wasn't dead, so there was nothing left to do but sit and watch the autocombat."). That isn't optimal by any definition.

My experience with the ancient vampires was that it did take me a while to kill them my first time through because I wanted to prove to myself I was Good Enough, but on the two subsequent playthroughs I held off until much later like you're supposed to if you aren't a D&D systems master. Beat them quickly with no problems.
 

Martyr

Arcane
Joined
Jan 28, 2018
Messages
1,102
Location
Bavaria
that would be suboptimal only when you are metagaming or glued a finger to quick load/save.
killing anything "fast" isnt part of win condition. he killed something you blow half your resources on, in melee with his caster. doesnt that sound optimal resource use wise?

He blew all his resources on it and spent forever whittling it down until it was dead ("I blasted all my remaining spells into him and yet he still wasn't dead, so there was nothing left to do but sit and watch the autocombat."). That isn't optimal by any definition.

My experience with the ancient vampires was that it did take me a while to kill them my first time through because I wanted to prove to myself I was Good Enough, but on the two subsequent playthroughs I held off until much later like you're supposed to if you aren't a D&D systems master. Beat them quickly with no problems.

I blew all my remaining ressources on the vamp, after they've been constantly drained by never ending trash mobs with no proper chance to rest.
also, you've played it three times, I've played it that one time and that's it. you're comparing your three playthrough routine on that game with my one time experience. that's not very
rating_sawyer.gif
of you, Roguey.
 
Self-Ejected

Lilura

RPG Codex Dragon Lady
Joined
Feb 13, 2013
Messages
5,274
killing anything "fast" isnt part of win condition

Actually, it sort of is with vampire ancient monks. Have you played the game? There are six of them. Their collective attack rate, dmg, on-hit effects and AC are off the charts. He didn't melee them with his wizard and a stick. Wouldn't have the BAB, the dmg or the AC even if he had spells left (which he didn't). Probably wouldn't even have the enchanment level on the stick. The 'tard is just making this up as he goes along.

Not to mention the DCs that epic wizards have... What spells was he casting at vampancients? Cantrips?

He said he was grotesquely over-levelled from grinding. The only way to grind to that point without taking days and days on Okku respawns is to provoke, guess what, respawns of vampancients and voidshadows. The very thing he couldn't beat.

I bee-lined Death God's at 21st level, as the write-up proves. To be grotesquely over-levelled on 21st means you're maxed or close to it.

Kaelyn can solo them at that point by inflicting massive positive energy dmg. Gann and Safiya could, too.
 

Martyr

Arcane
Joined
Jan 28, 2018
Messages
1,102
Location
Bavaria
^ assuming a first time player has the same meta knowledge of a sub par game as someone who posts "authoritative write ups" on the same game.

first off, as I've said, the vampires aren't hard. they just have bloated HP. "They are monks and warlocks with DR and regen" that literally is HP bloat. just because there's a reason for them being damage sponges, doesn't make them any less of a HP bloated damage sponge.

and I never said I was grinding in MotB. character import from the base game, bitch.
 

Roguey

Codex Staff
Staff Member
Sawyerite
Joined
May 29, 2010
Messages
35,656
I blew all my remaining ressources on the vamp, after they've been constantly drained by never ending trash mobs with no proper chance to rest.

What trash mobs? You don't get access to the second level of the vault until after you've cleared Act 1. There shouldn't be any enemies between you and the vampires (unless you're going around aggro-ing ghosts in the urns which are placed there so you can feed them on after resting). Additionally, you didn't notice that traveling from Mulsantir Gate to Mulsantir works as a free rest that restores your health and spells without lowering your spirit meter?
 

Martyr

Arcane
Joined
Jan 28, 2018
Messages
1,102
Location
Bavaria
I blew all my remaining ressources on the vamp, after they've been constantly drained by never ending trash mobs with no proper chance to rest.

What trash mobs? You don't get access to the second level of the vault until after you've cleared Act 1. There shouldn't be any enemies between you and the vampires (unless you're going around aggro-ing ghosts in the urns which are placed there so you can feed them on after resting). Additionally, you didn't notice that traveling from Mulsantir Gate to Mulsantir works as a free rest that restores your health and spells without lowering your spirit meter?

nope, I didn't notice that. as I've said, first time player experience and knowledge is not to be equaled with someone who's played the game before.
also, I fought pretty much everything you can fight in Shadow Mulsantir, then entered the vault and fought everything there. you can barely walk two steps in shadow Mulsantir without triggering combat. that's how I almost ran out of spells to use. didn't think that could be a problem/annoyance though, because I wasn't aware of the fact that the game was about to throw HP bloaters my way.
 

Mazisky

Magister
Joined
Mar 8, 2015
Messages
2,082
Location
Rome, IT
Sigh, Ja2 is the only game in history who matched Xcom in both quality and features, providing a strategic and a tactical layer. I cannot think about any other game who did that.
 
Self-Ejected

Lilura

RPG Codex Dragon Lady
Joined
Feb 13, 2013
Messages
5,274
^ assuming a first time player has the same meta knowledge of a sub par game as someone who posts "authoritative write ups" on the same game.

If you went through the OC and Act I MotB, you should know how to deal with undead. These are undead-heavy campaigns.

first off, as I've said, the vampires aren't hard. they just have bloated HP. "They are monks and warlocks with DR and regen" that literally is HP bloat. just because there's a reason for them being damage sponges, doesn't make them any less of a HP bloated damage sponge.

It's not bloat. MotB is an epic campaign. Your character is of epic level. Thus, the undead are epic. The campaign gradually introduces you to uptiered undead as it progresses. What you had trouble with wasn't HPs: it was the fact that the vampancients had monk levels on top of DR, regen and other special abilities. You didn't learn from what you previously experienced because you are not a learning animal.

and I never said I was grinding in MotB. character import from the base game, bitch.

What level were you at the end of the OC, and what did you grind on in the OC to be grotesquely over-levelled on a legitimate 21st?
 

Roguey

Codex Staff
Staff Member
Sawyerite
Joined
May 29, 2010
Messages
35,656
nope, I didn't notice that. as I've said, first time player experience and knowledge is not to be equaled with someone who's played the game before.

I noticed this my first time right away. :M

also, I fought pretty much everything you can fight in Shadow Mulsantir, then entered the vault and fought everything there. you can barely walk two steps in shadow Mulsantir without triggering combat. that's how I almost ran out of spells to use. didn't think that could be a problem/annoyance though, because I wasn't aware of the fact that the game was about to throw HP bloaters my way.

I am puzzled by how this could happen unless you somehow managed to avoid entering shadow Mulsantir entirely before fighting Okku. I only did this on my third run when I was going full chaotic evil; I went to the Wells of Lurue first to get devour soul so I could initiate a fight with Kaelyn in the opening conversation and devour her soul immediately.
 

Martyr

Arcane
Joined
Jan 28, 2018
Messages
1,102
Location
Bavaria
and I never said I was grinding in MotB. character import from the base game, bitch.

What level were you at the end of the OC, and what did you grind on in the OC to be grotesquely over-levelled on a legitimate 21st?

don't know, don't care. I've not touched that game for ~10 years.


nope, I didn't notice that. as I've said, first time player experience and knowledge is not to be equaled with someone who's played the game before.

I noticed this my first time right away. :M
congratz on being a smart doggie
rating_shittydog.gif



also, I fought pretty much everything you can fight in Shadow Mulsantir, then entered the vault and fought everything there. you can barely walk two steps in shadow Mulsantir without triggering combat. that's how I almost ran out of spells to use. didn't think that could be a problem/annoyance though, because I wasn't aware of the fact that the game was about to throw HP bloaters my way.

I am puzzled by how this could happen unless you somehow managed to avoid entering shadow Mulsantir entirely before fighting Okku. I only did this on my third run when I was going full chaotic evil; I went to the Wells of Lurue first to get devour soul so I could initiate a fight with Kaelyn in the opening conversation and devour her soul immediately.
if you had the chance to visit shadow Mulsantir before fighting Okku, then I did that. no reason not to do that, given the chance.
 

Roguey

Codex Staff
Staff Member
Sawyerite
Joined
May 29, 2010
Messages
35,656
if you had the chance to visit shadow Mulsantir before fighting Okku, then I did that. no reason not to do that, given the chance.

Clearly you didn't if all the enemies were still there. They don't respawn.
 
Self-Ejected

Lilura

RPG Codex Dragon Lady
Joined
Feb 13, 2013
Messages
5,274
What level were you at the end of the OC, and what did you grind on in the OC to be grotesquely over-levelled on a legitimate 21st?

don't know, don't care. I've not touched that game for ~10 years.

You are just making stuff up as you go along due to a befogged memory and possibly retardation, too. I don't mean to sound petty, but if you can't go into specifics then it's just not worth talking to you. Specifics are everything.
 

Martyr

Arcane
Joined
Jan 28, 2018
Messages
1,102
Location
Bavaria
What level were you at the end of the OC, and what did you grind on in the OC to be grotesquely over-levelled on a legitimate 21st?

don't know, don't care. I've not touched that game for ~10 years.

You are just making stuff up as you go along due to a befogged memory and possibly retardation, too. I don't mean to sound petty, but if you can't go into specifics then it's just not worth talking to you. Specifics are everything.

my point was that the vampires in shadow Mulsantir were not difficult but fucking annoying and that led to me enjoying the game less. I do remember that they had bloated HP and took little damage - or as you're saying "They are monks and warlocks with DR and regen". they were annoying to me, I named a reason why, no need to go into any more detail than that, since I was not asking for help or anything.
 
Self-Ejected

Lilura

RPG Codex Dragon Lady
Joined
Feb 13, 2013
Messages
5,274
There is a gating encounter outside Death God's Vault; two tough-as-nails Nightwalkers with mega-DR/SR. It's a warning not to go in there unless you're prepared. I think the encounter design in MotB is good, actually. There are some difficulty spikes but nothing outrageous. Especially for someone who imported from the OC.

 

Martyr

Arcane
Joined
Jan 28, 2018
Messages
1,102
Location
Bavaria
There is a gating encounter outside Death God's Vault; two tough-as-nails Nightwalkers with mega-DR/SR. It's a warning not to go in there unless you're prepared. I think the encounter design in MotB is good, actually. There are some difficulty spikes but nothing outrageous. Especially for someone who imported from the OC.
can't remember the Nightwalkers - that means they didn't annoy me as much as the vampires.
and, again: I never complained about MotB being too difficult. I said it's annoying, not difficult.
 

Efe

Erudite
Joined
Dec 27, 2015
Messages
2,597
He blew all his resources on it and spent forever whittling it down until it was dead
as lilura said, specifics are everything and it looks like you arent reading his words correctly.
as someone with "great memory" im inclined to think this is intentional and you have some beef with martyr and trying to piss him off.
please dont do it here
 

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