Baldur's Gate Baldur's Gate 3 Pre-Release Thread [EARLY ACCESS RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Morality Games]

I think you guys are taking canon and role playing in the wrong spirit, and it's bad for the industry and your enjoyment of the hobby.

Whole purpose of different choices and outcomes (role playing) is for the sake of enjoying a convincing sake of self within imaginary environment you are interacting with.

Canon exists to bring structure back to a meta narrative that has branched too far due to these divergent outcomes. You accept the override and then move on to create a new sense of self with a different fictional, role playing identity that is at best a spiritual successor to the one you nurtured before (or totally unrelated if your role playing interests have changed). Benefit of doing this is you can continue exploring the nuances of the imaginary setting, its motifs, and its mysteries.

Part of being allowed to have real interactivity and role playing options is that you have to accept these outcomes will be streamlined out of existence when the canon is created.

Ergo, it would have been a nice role-playing option in DAII if Hawke had been allowed to join the Qunari (and have the additional benefit of ending the game early and sparing the the player from playing Act III) instead of being shoehorned into siding with the residents of Kirkwall, but Bioware didn't want to add a bit of role playing to their game on wheels because nerds would complain that DAIII didn't reflect the Qunari route.

 

[Lacrymas]

Nobody denies the practical application of forcing a canon, but since Descent into Avernus doesn't name Abdel, it isn't automatic to assume he's still canon, especially in the context of BG3. And even if there's only a small minority who are vocal about the forced canon party, it still matters because it's that small minority everyone is going to encounter when searching about this. Only a small minority ever care as much as we do anyway, but devs still cater to that because other people also search on the internet even if they don't have any opinions themselves, and it doesn't paint a pretty picture when every thread, every video and every article concerning the story is about how forcing a canon again is ...not ideal. This is why we still don't have any details about this game at all too, it won't be good PR when everyone on the internet is complaining it isn't isometric or an RPG at all. Since Larian have gone all in on this project, every scrap of bad publicity is to be avoided.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

I'm just going to ask, "Assuming it isn't an amorphous gray blob, who else do you think the canon Bhaalspawn would be?"

Why do we need to know this? Unless we were someone close enough to be traveling with CHARNAME(or a close relative of such), and still alive, we likely wouldn't know much at all about his early life or adventures.
The problem isn't Abdel existing, the problem is that he doesn't have to be CHARNAME. Abdel is going on 140 years old when he dies, various stories could have simply been attributed to him over time due to the shrinking number of Bhaalspawn and his notoriety.

Making Abdel definitely CHARNAME isn't just some small tweak to continuity, it completely sets in stone every single possible choice in BG1 and 2.

 

[Falksi]

OMFG this is gonna be A-W-E-S-O-M-E!

Excited!

Spoiler

 

[Lacrymas]

Why do we need to know this? Unless we were someone close enough to be traveling with CHARNAME(or a close relative of such), and still alive, we likely wouldn't know much at all about his early life or adventures.
The problem isn't Abdel existing, the problem is that he doesn't have to be CHARNAME. Abdel is going on 140 years old when he dies, various stories could have simply been attributed to him over time due to the shrinking number of Bhaalspawn and his notoriety.

Making Abdel definitely CHARNAME isn't just some small tweak to continuity, it completely sets in stone every single possible choice in BG1 and 2.

I think the most telling thing is that Abdel isn't named in Descent into Avernus even though that's the most directly tied book to the events of BG1 or 2 (afaik?) since the novelizations. If he's 100% canon and they are set on that, why wouldn't they name him even once? They've either not made up their minds about that yet or will leave CHARNAME as an amorphous blob with very few confirmed canonical choices (like if Viconia is alive) and name Abdel as one of the most famous Bhaalspawns around who not-so-true legends have sprung up.

 

[Rpguy]

https://www.ign.com/articles/2019/10/30/baldurs-gate-3-dev-reveals-monstrous-new-image-a-ign-first

 

[frajaq]

so this is the level of reveal for this game that warrants a news's article, a fucking picture

 

[Infinitron]

I think an "IGN First" article is often the opening shot in a publicity campaign. It's happening.

https://www.ign.com/articles/2019/10/30/baldurs-gate-3-dev-reveals-monstrous-new-image-a-ign-first

Baldur's Gate 3 Dev Reveals Monstrous New Image — IGN First
"I've got your brains on my mind," — mind flayer, probably.

Larian Studios, the developer behind the recently announced Baldur’s Gate 3, has revealed a new slice of fresh hell from the forthcoming roleplaying game, depicting one of the tentacle-faced, brain-eating psionicists from the race of interplanar slavers called Ilithids — more commonly known as mind flayers.

Though scant on details, the image below reveals an illithid psionically floating through the darkened hallway of a nautiloid ship.

If you caught the Baldur’s Gate 3 announcement teaser during the Google Stadia Connect or anytime thereafter, it should be no surprise that mind flayers will play a central role in the next chapter of the Baldur’s Gate franchise. If you haven’t seen the Baldur’s Gate 3 reveal trailer, you can scroll down the page and watch it right now. And you should. It’s excellently foreboding.

We know Baldur's Gate 3 will take place about one hundred years after the events of the Baldur's Gate 2, and that the players will begin their journey outside the famed city before moving inside and being swept up in the adventure.

What we don’t know is to what extent the iconic race of mind-slurping aberrations will be featured. For example, there are all sorts of fun, horrifying mutations that can occur in the hive-mind collective. Though the creature in the new image appears to have the familiar four-tentacle anatomy, mind flayer tentacles tend to be shorter, ending at approximately chest level — these are clearly longer. However, the mind flayer in the reveal trailer had similar length tentacles, so it's possible this is just the artistic vision for illithids in Baldur's Gate 3.

There are illithid with longer tentacles, called Ulitharid, which can be “born” through some unknown variant during the process of ceremorphosis — the process by which mind flayer's reproduce, implanting a larval tadpole into the cranium usually via the nostril or ear canal where it devours the brain and replaces it, changing the host body into that of a mind flayer. Anyway, on rare occasions, this process spawns an Ulitharid, a stronger, more aggressive version with six tentacles that drape down to the floor. But these tentacles aren’t quite that long, and again, there’s only four of them, so maybe we’re looking at a new subspecies or just a fabulous specimen of the colony.

And what about that protruding, webbed frill cresting around its head and shoulders. It could be genetic and indicative of a new subspecies, but more likely it's one of the augmentations mind flayers are known to don called a Survival Mantle — a piece of carapace-like armor worn about the head, neck, and chest that also has the added benefit of allowing them to breathe normally in any atmosphere or lack thereof. We also see the creature wearing some sort of bracer-like armor about the wrists.

Then there’s the nautiloid, which is a massive conch-shaped ship that can travel between planes. In mind flayer lore, the colonies of the great empire once spanned the planes, and they conquered and subjugated worlds and races until their slave empire eventually rose up and overthrew their masters. But at the height of the illithid heyday, they were able to use these ships to travel the planes and spread their sweet, psychic indoctrination. The problem? Almost all of these ships were lost, supposedly, along with the capability to make more, again, supposedly.

So that leaves us with a once-conquering race of mind-bending, squid-mouthed slavers who have since scattered and gone into hiding as they rekindle the embers of the old empire while stewing in their paranoia-spiked superiority complex.

But with confirmation we’ll be seeing nautiloid ships once again — as we saw at the end of the Baldur’s Gate 3 reveal trailer — one can only wonder if the far-reaching empire that isn’t supposed to exist anymore was ever really gone. Baldur’s Gate 3 could set the stage for a full-scale invasion from a hidden, flourishing illithid colony.

Baldur’s Gate 3 is still a ways off and currently does not have a release date, though it will come to PC at launch. And speaking of platforms, Larian confirmed it doesn’t want to play the exclusivity game and Baldur's Gate 3 won't be restricted to Google Stadia.

In the meantime, you can get your hands on Wizards of the Coast's latest adventure Baldur's Gate: Descent into Avernus and spend time in the famed city — and the first layer of hell — before Baldur's Gate 3 is released.

 

[Delterius]

so this is the level of reveal for this game that warrants a news's article, a fucking picture

going by our standards, this is about 50 more pages of discussions

 

[Dodo1610]

Weird the whole lightning looks like it's from a game.

 

[J_C]

Okay, boys and girls, time for the most autistic person on this topic to speak:

Abdel Adrian, the one that, up to a couple years ago, was peddled by WoTC as the "canon" CHARNAME, is NOT, I repeat, is NOT the same person as from the novels:
- He became captain of the Flaming Fist AFTER the events of the game, not before.
- He travelled with both Minsc AND Coran - the novel Abdel Adrian knew neither of them during the events of BG I.
- The Minsc he knew is the Minsc from the games, not the novels (for those of you who never read these abominations, he is a completely different, very minor NPC).
- His alignment was initially Chaotic Neutral, then changed into Neutral.
- He was initially a warrior, later on this was removed, and his class was unknown as of "Murder in Baldur's Gate" and 5th Edition D&D.
- Despite choosing the "stay mortal" path, he retained the essence of Bhaal, something which directly contradicts both the game AND THE FUCKING NOVEL.
- In conclusion, the WotC version of Abdel Adrian up until "Murder in Baldur's Gate" was one who initially started as a weird amalgamation of the novel protagonist and CHARNAME, and as time went on was turned more and more into "CHARNAME with certain set characteristics". All notions about his romances, his relationship with Bodhi, how the events of BG II occurred, can be safely thrown into the trash (once again, thanks to the Minsc Evidence). Hell, his description in "Murder in Baldur's Gate" doesn't even match his picture in that VERY SAME FUCKING BOOK. In other words, a giant clusterfuck.

Now, we move further along the timeline. The Minsc comics start being released, and they are very, very careful not to say even a word about the Bhaalspawn or CHARNAME. My assumption is that talks with Larian, or at least plans to continue the franchise, began at that point.

Now, several years later, and after the announcement, "Descent into Avernus" came along. And within it we find these glorious retcons:
- There is a RUMOUR that a prominent member of the city nobility is a Bhaalspawn. This is completely and utterly incompatible with both the games AND "Murder in Baldur's Gate" and other sources of canon, where the entire city either outright knew and/or suspected that CHARNAME/Abdel Adrian is a Bhaalspawn.
- When describing the Flaming Fist, not a peep is made about Abdel Adrian.
- ABDEL ADRIAN ISN'T MENTIONED ONCE throughout the whole module.

In other words, WotC are making a soft reboot. Either Abdel Adrian will quietly disappear into the shadows, never to be heard of again, or he will simply be turned into A Bhaalspawn, instead of THE Bhaalspawn.

Am I the only one who doesn't give a fuck about this Abdel guy, or his "canon" story? Never read or heard about him before this thread, and I hope he doesn't show up his stupid face in BG3.

 

[vortex]

Tentacle-faced, brain-eating psionicists ? I know that kind.

 

[Thal]

Okay, boys and girls, time for the most autistic person on this topic to speak:

Abdel Adrian, the one that, up to a couple years ago, was peddled by WoTC as the "canon" CHARNAME, is NOT, I repeat, is NOT the same person as from the novels:
- He became captain of the Flaming Fist AFTER the events of the game, not before.
- He travelled with both Minsc AND Coran - the novel Abdel Adrian knew neither of them during the events of BG I.
- The Minsc he knew is the Minsc from the games, not the novels (for those of you who never read these abominations, he is a completely different, very minor NPC).
- His alignment was initially Chaotic Neutral, then changed into Neutral.
- He was initially a warrior, later on this was removed, and his class was unknown as of "Murder in Baldur's Gate" and 5th Edition D&D.
- Despite choosing the "stay mortal" path, he retained the essence of Bhaal, something which directly contradicts both the game AND THE FUCKING NOVEL.
- In conclusion, the WotC version of Abdel Adrian up until "Murder in Baldur's Gate" was one who initially started as a weird amalgamation of the novel protagonist and CHARNAME, and as time went on was turned more and more into "CHARNAME with certain set characteristics". All notions about his romances, his relationship with Bodhi, how the events of BG II occurred, can be safely thrown into the trash (once again, thanks to the Minsc Evidence). Hell, his description in "Murder in Baldur's Gate" doesn't even match his picture in that VERY SAME FUCKING BOOK. In other words, a giant clusterfuck.

Now, we move further along the timeline. The Minsc comics start being released, and they are very, very careful not to say even a word about the Bhaalspawn or CHARNAME. My assumption is that talks with Larian, or at least plans to continue the franchise, began at that point.

Now, several years later, and after the announcement, "Descent into Avernus" came along. And within it we find these glorious retcons:
- There is a RUMOUR that a prominent member of the city nobility is a Bhaalspawn. This is completely and utterly incompatible with both the games AND "Murder in Baldur's Gate" and other sources of canon, where the entire city either outright knew and/or suspected that CHARNAME/Abdel Adrian is a Bhaalspawn.
- When describing the Flaming Fist, not a peep is made about Abdel Adrian.
- ABDEL ADRIAN ISN'T MENTIONED ONCE throughout the whole module.

In other words, WotC are making a soft reboot. Either Abdel Adrian will quietly disappear into the shadows, never to be heard of again, or he will simply be turned into A Bhaalspawn, instead of THE Bhaalspawn.

Am I the only one who doesn't give a fuck about this Abdel guy, or his "canon" story? Never read or heard about him before this thread, and I hope he doesn't show up his stupid face in BG3.

No, you misunderstand. That is actually what we all hope.

 

[The_Mask]

When an Illithid undergoes ceremorphosis, it can occasionally take on some elements of the absorbed host creature's former mind, such as mannerisms. This typically manifests as a minor personality feature, such as a nervous habit or reaction (e.g., nail-biting or tapping one's foot), although the process that determines the type and number of traits so inherited appears to be stochastic. Some adult Illithids have even been known to hum a tune that its host knew in life. Usually, when a mind flayer inherits a trait like this, it keeps it a closely guarded secret, because, were its peers to learn of it, the Illithid in question would most likely be killed. This is due to an Illithid legend of a being called the "Adversary". The legend holds that, eventually, an Illithid larva that undergoes ceremorphosis will take on the host's personality and memory in its entirety. This Adversary would, mind and soul, still be the host, but with all the inherent abilities of an Illithid.

I think this is what they're going for.

Also...

Their skin is purplish blue to gray-green and covered in mucus, and is very sensitive to sunlight. They loathe sunlight, though it does not actually harm them.

so... this is the closest thing that matches anything this picture offers.


The Adversary: a superior mind with an illithid potential, overcoming adversities such as their sensitivity to sunlight - (maybe) even having his own Nautiloid that allows him to explore the planes.
This would, essentially, be what Chris Avellone wanted to do more in P:T - have more plane exploration.
Is Sven aiming for the king? Lots of questions... lots to reflect upon...





Anyway...




Unless WotC releases some brand new species of Illithid, this is my closest guess.

 

[Elex]

it dosen't matter in the end: because is 100% sure that all the bhallspawn are dead.

 

[Thonius]

Weird the whole lightning looks like it's from a game.

Meh It's quick render in Octane or Redshift. My bet is on Octane. Probably painted over in PS.

 

[Storyfag]

it dosen't matter in the end: because is 100% sure that all the bhallspawn are dead.

1. Imoen is alive in every epilogue. Sarevok is alive in most of his endings.
2. I've said it before and I'll say it again: in one of the early interviews, a PR representative of Larian refused to answer whether we'll be playing a Bhaalspawn. Think about it. Literally 99,9% people would, naturally, expect an answer of "No, their story is already done." That she refused means this isn't the end of that plotline. In the words of Jake Skywalker: "No one's ever really gone."

3. Bhaal is back. What's to stop him from fathering more?

 

[Reinhardt]

I'll take even Saerileth as official companion over beamdog ones any day of the week.

 

[Heroic Liberator]

I'll take even Saerileth as official companion over beamdog ones any day of the week.

Quite a stretch, lad.

Won't pronounce myself on all of Beamdog's companions, but the following one was quite nice:

 

[Reinhardt]

Nigga, it's fucking MALE ELF. There is literally nothing worse than this.

 

[Heroic Liberator]

Nigga, it's fucking MALE ELF. There is literally nothing worse than this.

Elf genocide - best day of my life, but still. Enjoyed his humorous evilness.

 

[Saerain]

 

[Lacrymas]

Ha, joke's on you, there are no male elves.

 

[Saerain]

By the current logic of the LGBBQ community I suppose that's necessarily true.

 

[santino27]

it dosen't matter in the end: because is 100% sure that all the bhallspawn are dead.

1. Imoen is alive in every epilogue. Sarevok is alive in most of his endings.
2. I've said it before and I'll say it again: in one of the early interviews, a PR representative of Larian refused to answer whether we'll be playing a Bhaalspawn. Think about it. Literally 99,9% people would, naturally, expect an answer of "No, their story is already done." That she refused means this isn't the end of that plotline. In the words of Jake Skywalker: "No one's ever really gone."

3. Bhaal is back. What's to stop him from fathering more?

As far as I understand it (and admittedly, I don't pay a lot of attention to FR lore), even if he did have a bunch more children now that he's back, it wouldn't matter much... the reason the Bhaalspawns mattered in the BG series was because Bhaal had died and his godhood was divvied up among his progeny.