Putting the 'role' back in role-playing games since 2002.
Donate to Codex
Good Old Games
  • Welcome to rpgcodex.net, a site dedicated to discussing computer based role-playing games in a free and open fashion. We're less strict than other forums, but please refer to the rules.

    "This message is awaiting moderator approval": All new users must pass through our moderation queue before they will be able to post normally. Until your account has "passed" your posts will only be visible to yourself (and moderators) until they are approved. Give us a week to get around to approving / deleting / ignoring your mundane opinion on crap before hassling us about it. Once you have passed the moderation period (think of it as a test), you will be able to post normally, just like all the other retards.

Linux RPG list

Are you willing to give Linux a chance?

  • I am already on Linux

  • Didn't know so much incline was available on Linux, might consider it

  • There is a game that i really really have to play and is unavailable, else i might consider it

  • I am a Windowsfag, i love viruses, malware, NSA spying on me, DRM, and all that


Results are only viewable after voting.

biggestboss

Liturgist
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Messages
528
Every single bug that has been reported on something I've made always has to do with some bullshit that affects Linux and can only be fixed by either the user themselves or by a developer that gives enough of a fuck about Linux (0% of people that respect themselves and their time).

I'd love to bring back the ovens for Linux users.
 

biggestboss

Liturgist
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Messages
528
To clarify, I don't mind if you use or like Linux. I only hate you if you want to game on Linux and expect to not be treated as the subhuman you are by people that actually make games.
 

Gibson

Learned
Joined
Jun 23, 2019
Messages
331
No one is trying to take away your DRM spyware OS from you.

take away? as I see from this topic, there are a bunch of fags who try to bait people into using Malware Linux and not the other way around.

what will come first: the year of Linux Desktop or will WinRAR become the most sold software?
 

biggestboss

Liturgist
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Messages
528
The difference is I don't expect Linux gamers to stop being tards (they won't) while Linux gamers that report bugs to me expect me to drop everything and learn how Linux operates so I can fix it (otherwise they wouldn't bother reporting it in the first place and understand their place in the industry, like Mac gamers do).
 

Absinthe

Arcane
Joined
Jan 6, 2012
Messages
4,062
Having released software that works on Linux, I second that. A whiny, entitled bunch. The whining stopped after I doubled-down on a position that Linux support exists for developer convenience, code quality and superior debugging.
Linux community's a clusterfuck tbh. You've got everything from Ubuntu users who get mad the moment shit requires the slightest bit of effort to get working to the developer-types who are used to fucking with loads of config files and custom compiling shit and will look down upon you if you can't be fucked to read manpages. I wouldn't really refer to it as a monolithic community. Even different distros have their own peculiarities in their communities.

As such, it took me several years to finish proper Linux hotkey support only to receive a new burst of whining. RTFM or die.
Why would it take years to implement hotkey support? I agree that RTFM is pretty much the right attitude though.

For game development I'd never release Linux or OSX versions in official capacity. Linux users are basement-dwelling contrarians, while OSX has broken GL support with no apparent improvement over the years.
On the upshot of things, support in an official capacity is not really needed. Most Linux users will be happy enough if you just implement some basic compatibility switches so they can get it running on WINE without issues.

The original post is pure disinformation. You can't get comparable performance on any remotely recent title. That includes even Skyrim, not to mention the new Deus Ex games.
Comparable performance is achievable in specific circumstances. Fully functional performance is definitely achievable. But it's true that games tend to run worse on Linux than Windows and require more futzing with settings to boot.

It doesn't matter whether the GPU is NVIDIA or AMD, whether you use gallium-nine or wined3d. You get 70% FPS in a typical case. Newer the game, the worse it gets. As titles come out they use more recent GPU features, hence worse performance.
Actually, GPU does matter, a lot. Some GPUs have much better Linux drivers than others and run much more efficiently. It helps to pick out a good GPU for Linux usage. But that involves digging a bit deeper than just which brand you're using.

The best example is Path of Exile. It runs out of memory without being out of GPU memory. It also works like shit despite not looking any modern. I have 60 FPS in 4K with global illumination enabled, on Windows. The only fault is that PoE uses D3D11. Forget about Disco Elysium for the same reason, at least in 4K.
Path of Exile has some major-league garbage code under the hood. It was a total amateur job from the start, with piecemeal improvements over time and the occasional overhaul. PoE is the kind of game where trying to change the graphics fucks with gameplay mechanics and network performance because it was all written in a monolithic way. IIRC PoE 4.0 will feature a graphics engine overhaul to replace the old abomination with something less shit and more maintainable. Nowadays people look upon Grinding Gear Games as a proper development studio, so a lot of folks tend to miss that PoE at its inception was an amateur project done by hobbyists looking to enter the videogames industry.

And Disco Elysium is Unity Engine trash made by people who are not good at optimization on an engine which is also known for bugginess and inefficiency. Unity also has nominal Linux support, in the sense that it says it does and gives you the tools with which to shoot yourself in the foot, repeatedly, where you can also enjoy many new bugs particular to their Linux release.
 

Bah

Arcane
Joined
Oct 6, 2006
Messages
2,946
Location
Northwest American Republic
And I don't expect windows developers to know how to write portable code.
There's no reason to do so outside of what certain game engines do automatically (Unity, Unreal, Godot, etc.) unless you like wasting a lot of time and money:
https://twitter.com/bgolus/status/1080213166116597760

I agree there. Trying to write your own engine to support multiple platforms from the ground-up is a lot of work. Unity has been a huge blessing for Linux compatibility. And where there isn't native unity support, linux users have wine/dxvk. I've been gaming on Linux for about 5 years, and have never submitted a bug against a game, and I'm able to play every new game I desire. When something doesn't work under wine, I just assume it's a wine issue.

There's nothing I can do to prevent people from reporting bugs on the platform they use though. It's up to the developers to allocate their time properly. If the developer DOESN'T allocate his time appropriately, that's his fault, not the users. That twitter shows a developer who claims he spent hundreds of thousands of dollars for a hundreds of dollars of sales. Well, that's his problem for choosing poorly, and not the fault of any linux user.
 

Twiglard

Poland Stronk
Patron
Staff Member
Joined
Aug 6, 2014
Messages
7,237
Location
Poland
Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut
The original post is pure disinformation. You can't get comparable performance on any remotely recent title. That includes even Skyrim, not to mention the new Deus Ex games.

With the advent of DXVK, that's largely not true anymore.

DXVK has random VRAM exhaustion errors on NVIDIA binary drivers. D9VK for older games isn't even nearly as mature as wined3d.

this statement doesn't hold for 100% of games

That's the point. I don't want to skip on a game just because Wine's implementation is deficient. Especially if it involves skipping Disco Elysium -- an outright heresy.
 

Twiglard

Poland Stronk
Patron
Staff Member
Joined
Aug 6, 2014
Messages
7,237
Location
Poland
Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut
Why would it take years to implement hotkey support? I agree that RTFM is pretty much the right attitude though.

Implementing global-hotkey support (i.e. without the application being focused) required me to make a lookup table for PC keyboard keys in order to translate between Qt (portable) and platform-specific keys (Xlib). There's also a bunch of platform-specific caveats as on any other platform.

Linux lusers like to "request" stuff but in the end won't bother sending code. And "please" or "thank you" don't pay the bills, especially for an open-source project.

Actually, GPU does matter, a lot. Some GPUs have much better Linux drivers than others and run much more efficiently.

Sure, but in some cases even AMD cards don't work right with particular games.

It helps to pick out a good GPU for Linux usage. But that involves digging a bit deeper than just which brand you're using.

Yeah, and sometimes being fucked over like particular AMD R2xx model arbitrarily not getting supported by AMDGPU.

Comparable performance is achievable in specific circumstances. Fully functional performance is definitely achievable. But it's true that games tend to run worse on Linux than Windows and require more futzing with settings to boot.

I don't mind fucking around with settings if I can at least arrive at a working configuration to begin with. The matter is bad performance regardless of the amount of time spent on that.

Path of Exile has some major-league garbage code under the hood. It was a total amateur job from the start, with piecemeal improvements over time and the occasional overhaul.

No, it's the matter of switching to D3D11 and dropping D3D9 entirely.

Disco Elysium is Unity Engine trash

Be very careful here.
 

Silly Germans

Guest
By the way is Win10 still messing with dual boot systems ? I heard that it regularly dumped files on partitions that it isn't supposed to, possibly ruining existing linux installations.
Otherwise i'd recommend to simply go for dual boot, with Win7 it works fine.
 

Gibson

Learned
Joined
Jun 23, 2019
Messages
331
By the way is Win10 still messing with dual boot systems ? I heard that it regularly dumped files on partitions that it isn't supposed to, possibly ruining existing linux installations.
Otherwise i'd recommend to simply go for dual boot, with Win7 it works fine.

I'm Running the latest Debian b2b with W10...it works - but it's debian stable and when those nerds say it's stable it's really fucking stable :D when I'll have enough time to squeeze I'll probably go Testing.
still won't play games on it tho...
 

biggestboss

Liturgist
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Messages
528
I want to apologize to all the Linux users for being a dick. Even though I still thinking dedicated gaming should never occur on the platform, I will still continue to provide a Linux builds for games I develop, even though all I do is press the 'Build for Linux' button in Unity.
 

Jasede

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jan 4, 2005
Messages
24,793
Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Codex Year of the Donut I'm very into cock and ball torture
You rolled a 1...
"Compilation requires a dependency of a specific version that is only hosted on a sourceforge link that no longer works."
 

thesheeep

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Mar 16, 2007
Messages
9,946
Location
Tampere, Finland
Codex 2012 Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Torment: Tides of Numenera Codex USB, 2014 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech Bubbles In Memoria A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
That's why you use Ubuntu(/-based) or Arch(-based). Anything else leads straight down to hell.
Of course, if you are trying to compile some obscure piece of software that was developed 8 years ago and forgotten 7 years ago, some funny stuff can happen...

As a game developer, I genuinely wish for AIDS to be inflicted upon every Linux user on the planet. Mac users get a pass because they complain a lot less and understand that their machines are meant for shit like watching YouTube.

Having released software that works on Linux, I second that. A whiny, entitled bunch. The whining stopped after I doubled-down on a position that Linux support exists for developer convenience, code quality and superior debugging.

As such, it took me several years to finish proper Linux hotkey support only to receive a new burst of whining. RTFM or die.

For game development I'd never release Linux or OSX versions in official capacity. Linux users are basement-dwelling contrarians, while OSX has broken GL support with no apparent improvement over the years.
I'm developing cross-platform since many years and if you do it right, you just don't have a lot of problems with either platform. And Linux users are simply the more helpful userbase due to their knowledge. From Windows you typically just get "this shit doesn't work". From Linux you get "This shit doesn't work. It is probably an X or Y problem, did you try using A or B?", on occasion, anyway.
And I'm also developing cross-platform from Linux, not just launch the Linux executable once in a blue moon to see if it actually runs :lol:

Honestly, you come off as someone having no idea what you are doing if stuff like hotkey support posed a years-long problem to you. Qt is manna from heaven in ease of use. Though I do admit that global hotkeys is one of the things it totally sucks at, I had to do the same in Windows once (took me... a week).
If you know a platform well, you can develop good software for it. Game or not, doesn't matter.
Fragmentation on Linux is a problem, but nobody expects you to support everything. Just go with Ubuntu (and possibly Arch) and you are golden. The few peabrains that use anything else and then expect game devs to support them are beyond reason.

There is one good reason not to bother developing for Linux, and that is the low market share. It is not as low as some statistics would lead you to believe, but still low enough to have "I won't bother" be a legitimate statement.
Of course, it is offset by the vastly superior development & debugging environment, but that's something you don't really believe before you try it... and getting to know the platform takes some time which some are not willing to spend.
Either way, as soon as you officially support a platform, that means you really do have to support it. Just clicking the "Export to linux" button without any proper testing makes as much sense as pressing the "Export to PS4" button without any proper testing.

I much rather run a Windows native game via Proton than dealing with a crappy Linux native build.

How do you think Pathfinder: Kingmaker released on Linux without working save games? :lol:


RPGs playable through the WINE [...] This is a list of games that you can expect to be PLAYABLE, out of the box, or with some minor tweaks.

The original post is pure disinformation. You can't get comparable performance on any remotely recent title. That includes even Skyrim, not to mention the new Deus Ex games.

It doesn't matter whether the GPU is NVIDIA or AMD, whether you use gallium-nine or wined3d. You get 70% FPS in a typical case. Newer the game, the worse it gets. As titles come out they use more recent GPU features, hence worse performance.
It is true that you don't get 100% the same performance. It is a compatibility layer, that will always cost at least some.
But it is equally true that nobody needs 100% of the performance. You need 60fps (or whatever your refresh rate) to play without problems. Who cares if you could have achieved 240fps on Windows, but only 177fps on Linux, if what you need isn't even half that much?

Also, I always urge people to dual-boot.
That way, you can almost always use a wonderfully customizable system that won't get in your way. But you can switch to Windows, too, for that odd game that just won't work on Linux.
 
Last edited:

biggestboss

Liturgist
Joined
Feb 16, 2017
Messages
528
I do 100% of the development myself: design, coding, art, etc. I don't have the time or desire to figure out why data that serializes/de-serializes fine on Windows doesn't work on Linux or Mac (assuming that's what happened to PF:K), so it sounds like I would be better off not making native builds and let interested players just run it through Proton or whatever Mac users use.
 

thesheeep

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Mar 16, 2007
Messages
9,946
Location
Tampere, Finland
Codex 2012 Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Torment: Tides of Numenera Codex USB, 2014 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech Bubbles In Memoria A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
I do 100% of the development myself: design, coding, art, etc. I don't have the time or desire to figure out why data that serializes/de-serializes fine on Windows doesn't work on Linux or Mac (assuming that's what happened to PF:K), so it sounds like I would be better off not making native builds and let interested players just run it through Proton or whatever Mac users use.
What I would do in that scenario is offer an unofficial Linux build and have people test that. If it turns out working just fine (which does happen, even Unity fixes its Linux bugs eventually), I see no reason not to release it.
But if people run into all kinds of problems that don't appear on Windows, I wouldn't bother further.

But releasing without proper testing is what lead to this nonsense narrative of the Linux community being terrible or whatnot.
Developers that didn't develop/test properly leading to bugs leading to way more complaints on that platform.
Which is 100% the developers' fault, yet the community is blamed for it. As if anyone should be thankful that someone made a bad build :lol:
 
Last edited:

Nano

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Mar 6, 2016
Messages
4,649
Grab the Codex by the pussy Strap Yourselves In
I was using Linux for a bit a while back. The best gaming experiences I had on it were with Wine, because Wine provides a similar user experience to Windows. Whenever I tried dealing with native software, everything felt incredibly unintuitive. No wonder Linux users are so dependent on Steam and other launchers to handle everything for them, trying to deal with things by yourself is a nightmare. On Windows all you need to do is double-click the desktop shortcut and the gaming starts.
 

Ranarama

Learned
Joined
Dec 7, 2016
Messages
604
Actually on windows you have to remember which launcher has the game, launch the launcher, wait for updates, then launch the game.

I'd say Lutris is a best first step.

And also, what you mean by "unintuitive" is that it's not what you expect. Because what you expect is windows.
 

As an Amazon Associate, rpgcodex.net earns from qualifying purchases.
Back
Top Bottom