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Underrail: The Incline Awakens

toro

Arcane
Vatnik
Joined
Apr 14, 2009
Messages
14,023
With pistols that is definitely a risk you take. It's what makes a pistol build so awesomely difficult to play. I've done them before and I sooooo want to do them again but I have to try a pure psionic next.

I was mulling over an AR or Pistol build ... and your post made me decide to go for a pistol build.

Now I just need to activate my autism and find a satisfying build.

Bad bad idea.

Only 4 level in: Gunslinger -> Aimed Shot -> Recklessness -> Grenadier.

I managed to save Newton at the cost of all my ammo.
D518048D99D75E62A2CA62EC2816BFF745B93757


Also I've managed to kill the bandits but now I'm really out of ammo.
64AB3DD76DFC1682DADA8063EB4597E460E0A396

The lesson learned it that for a Pistol build Traps are 100% required on Dominating which sadly I wanted to avoid.

Honestly I'm out of money, I sold everything I could sell and ... I will restart.
 

Sheepherder

Augur
Joined
Feb 4, 2014
Messages
657
With pistols that is definitely a risk you take. It's what makes a pistol build so awesomely difficult to play. I've done them before and I sooooo want to do them again but I have to try a pure psionic next.

I was mulling over an AR or Pistol build ... and your post made me decide to go for a pistol build.

Now I just need to activate my autism and find a satisfying build.

Bad bad idea.

Only 4 level in: Gunslinger -> Aimed Shot -> Recklessness -> Grenadier.

I managed to save Newton at the cost of all my ammo.
D518048D99D75E62A2CA62EC2816BFF745B93757


Also I've managed to kill the bandits but now I'm really out of ammo.
64AB3DD76DFC1682DADA8063EB4597E460E0A396

The lesson learned it that for a Pistol build Traps are 100% required on Dominating which sadly I wanted to avoid.

Honestly I'm out of money, I sold everything I could sell and ... I will restart.
You don't need traps. And don't use firearm pistols that early, they're trash up until you can get a rapid reloader so post dep A. Hence the shitty early game. Get either one of the laser pistols from junkyard. Use mk2 frags on the bandits.
I built my pistols with SI so you might want to try that.
 

hell bovine

Arcane
Joined
Sep 9, 2013
Messages
2,711
Location
Secret Level
i got 40 hours into underrail before being too weak as piss to continue through anywhere. maybe i should've done some build research

with the addition of the expansion can you get leveled up more mid-game to make it easier in the last third?
Depends on what type of character you've made. Post your build.

forgot to say i'm gonna also start over for sure. but i'll leave it on the same difficulty if the expansion will help me get a bit more over leveled by the last third, but if they balanced it i'll be a scrub and turn it to easy :)
I'd not say the expansion is that balanced, on classic you level way too fast due to enemy numbers. On oddity it's fine. Also, it's definitely biased towards full psi, so just use that build Goromorg posted and you'll have an easy time.

i got 40 hours into underrail before being too weak as piss to continue through anywhere. maybe i should've done some build research

with the addition of the expansion can you get leveled up more mid-game to make it easier in the last third?

It depends on what you're stuck on.
If you use stealth, you can use grenade distractions and electronic doors to bypass most enemies. If you find Expedition enemies too hard, you can roll with the pirates and fight Black Eels and Protectorate.

If you massacre the Black Eel station, do they get hostile in Junkyard? Stealthed through it.

Same question for protectorate, guessing the stations along the see are fine but killing the warehouse makes them hostile.
No idea what happens if you kill them loudly, but silent kills are ok, won't even turn the shops on the rig hostile.
 

Comte

Guest
With pistols that is definitely a risk you take. It's what makes a pistol build so awesomely difficult to play. I've done them before and I sooooo want to do them again but I have to try a pure psionic next.

I was mulling over an AR or Pistol build ... and your post made me decide to go for a pistol build.

Now I just need to activate my autism and find a satisfying build.

Bad bad idea.

Only 4 level in: Gunslinger -> Aimed Shot -> Recklessness -> Grenadier.

I managed to save Newton at the cost of all my ammo.
D518048D99D75E62A2CA62EC2816BFF745B93757


Also I've managed to kill the bandits but now I'm really out of ammo.
64AB3DD76DFC1682DADA8063EB4597E460E0A396

The lesson learned it that for a Pistol build Traps are 100% required on Dominating which sadly I wanted to avoid.

Honestly I'm out of money, I sold everything I could sell and ... I will restart.

Dude ran out of cash in my pistol build as well. Had to set it aside.
 

Sheepherder

Augur
Joined
Feb 4, 2014
Messages
657
Some videos from the pistol build. No infused rat armor and scrutinous yet. So missing +15% crit chance.
Lunatic mall in one go. most of the video is AI spazzing out at chokepoints when enemies don't have a clear path to me

And Fort Apogee. messy


Pistols are alright. I think their intended gimmick is that they can do most special attacks. However, since pistols don't have any built in mechanics to enhance that, TM psi becomes mandatory.
 

toro

Arcane
Vatnik
Joined
Apr 14, 2009
Messages
14,023
You don't need traps. And don't use firearm pistols that early, they're trash up until you can get a rapid reloader so post dep A. Hence the shitty early game. Get either one of the laser pistols from junkyard. Use mk2 frags on the bandits.
I built my pistols with SI so you might want to try that.

Well, I've restarted my build and I can tell you right now that the traps are the most efficient way to get kills in the beginning of the game. Probably even something around lvl 8 or 10.
 

Sheepherder

Augur
Joined
Feb 4, 2014
Messages
657
You don't need traps. And don't use firearm pistols that early, they're trash up until you can get a rapid reloader so post dep A. Hence the shitty early game. Get either one of the laser pistols from junkyard. Use mk2 frags on the bandits.
I built my pistols with SI so you might want to try that.

Well, I've restarted my build and I can tell you right now that the traps are the most efficient way to get kills in the beginning of the game. Probably even something around lvl 8 or 10.
How early in the game do you mean? All the way up to 8-10?

If you mean explosive traps, than I'd argue frag grenades are better as a crutch until the pistols pick up the pace - they oneshot lurkers in the first two underpassage areas and most bandits in GSM and the skill investment isn't wasted once I stop using damage dealing grenades and only use utility throwing flashbangs, nets, etc.
Bear traps are very useful in a couple situations very early game (Count Ratula at lvl 1 or Vilmer at ~lvl 3, lurkers if you want to be safe) but fall off as soon as I can craft a tazer which can be as early lvl 3.
 

toro

Arcane
Vatnik
Joined
Apr 14, 2009
Messages
14,023
Styg Please explain this crap.

There is something wrong with Psi Beetles and Bear Traps.

Basically this thing happens when I bait a Psi Beetle into a trap:
1) If I'm in the visual field of the beetle then it will trigger the first trap it encounters.
2) If I'm hidden or outside of the beetle's visual field then the beetle will crossover the first trap it encounters (which will simply disappear) and it will trigger the next trap in its way.

This crap made me lose 2xtraps per Beetle in the next building. Weird bug.
7493D002048BF65C5771C888C75636EAD15E958D

Bonus:

Mobs literally on fire don't give Ambush bonus :)
 
Last edited:

toro

Arcane
Vatnik
Joined
Apr 14, 2009
Messages
14,023
You don't need traps. And don't use firearm pistols that early, they're trash up until you can get a rapid reloader so post dep A. Hence the shitty early game. Get either one of the laser pistols from junkyard. Use mk2 frags on the bandits.
I built my pistols with SI so you might want to try that.

Well, I've restarted my build and I can tell you right now that the traps are the most efficient way to get kills in the beginning of the game. Probably even something around lvl 8 or 10.
How early in the game do you mean? All the way up to 8-10?

If you mean explosive traps, than I'd argue frag grenades are better as a crutch until the pistols pick up the pace - they oneshot lurkers in the first two underpassage areas and most bandits in GSM and the skill investment isn't wasted once I stop using damage dealing grenades and only use utility throwing flashbangs, nets, etc.
Bear traps are very useful in a couple situations very early game (Count Ratula at lvl 1 or Vilmer at ~lvl 3, lurkers if you want to be safe) but fall off as soon as I can craft a tazer which can be as early lvl 3.

Bear Traps + Opportunist = Profit for builds with multiple attacks.

Imho it's the best combination for early game (or at least the safest and cheapest way to advance). I could save Newton and remain with ammo. On Dominating.

In fact my build looks like this:

12160898135309EF2688225E017F00D115006079


64BD83A9609E9BAE1CC14AE1EFA80FF4A386C4BC


4FA88166F972E492D6B20A72FAC5639DC06C3D7B

What should I choose between Kneecap Shot, Grenadier or Quick Tinkering?
 

toro

Arcane
Vatnik
Joined
Apr 14, 2009
Messages
14,023
Some videos from the pistol build. No infused rat armor and scrutinous yet. So missing +15% crit chance.
Lunatic mall in one go. most of the video is AI spazzing out at chokepoints when enemies don't have a clear path to me

And Fort Apogee. messy


Pistols are alright. I think their intended gimmick is that they can do most special attacks. However, since pistols don't have any built in mechanics to enhance that, TM psi becomes mandatory.


Please post your build.

I think you went with Survival Instincts while I want to go with Grenadier + Ambush :)

Edit: Also I want to go with Smart Rapid Falchion and no Psi shit except Contraction.

I know. I'm just curious if it works.
 

Sheepherder

Augur
Joined
Feb 4, 2014
Messages
657
You don't need traps. And don't use firearm pistols that early, they're trash up until you can get a rapid reloader so post dep A. Hence the shitty early game. Get either one of the laser pistols from junkyard. Use mk2 frags on the bandits.
I built my pistols with SI so you might want to try that.

Well, I've restarted my build and I can tell you right now that the traps are the most efficient way to get kills in the beginning of the game. Probably even something around lvl 8 or 10.
How early in the game do you mean? All the way up to 8-10?

If you mean explosive traps, than I'd argue frag grenades are better as a crutch until the pistols pick up the pace - they oneshot lurkers in the first two underpassage areas and most bandits in GSM and the skill investment isn't wasted once I stop using damage dealing grenades and only use utility throwing flashbangs, nets, etc.
Bear traps are very useful in a couple situations very early game (Count Ratula at lvl 1 or Vilmer at ~lvl 3, lurkers if you want to be safe) but fall off as soon as I can craft a tazer which can be as early lvl 3.

Bear Traps + Opportunist = Profit for builds with multiple attacks.

Imho it's the best combination for early game (or at least the safest and cheapest way to advance). I could save Newton and remain with ammo. On Dominating.

In fact my build looks like this:

12160898135309EF2688225E017F00D115006079


64BD83A9609E9BAE1CC14AE1EFA80FF4A386C4BC


4FA88166F972E492D6B20A72FAC5639DC06C3D7B

What should I choose between Kneecap Shot, Grenadier or Quick Tinkering?
For bettles use a tazer and a laser pistol, they have high mechanical dr/dt but not much defenses vs. energy. There's two pistols you can get in Junktown. One you can steal from a locker in the tech shop (I think it's guaranteed to spawn), another in Elwoods basements, in a footlocker in the room with the plasma sentry.

Why snooping? There's only a few oddities behind perception that early in the game. There's also the hidden door in Junkyard, but it's, I think, 10 PER.
Kneecap is good throughout the game.
I don't use Grenadier as I see damage dealing grenades as a crutch to help builds going in the early game. It's useful, but not necessary later on.
Never liked Quick Tinkering, traps aren't my thing.

Here's my build, maybe that'll help. http://underrail.info.tm/build/?HgU...QEXHlvChyZLEVnCiAI6wrXCpFDinrsC4qC9BOKnvgnfvw
If you make it to Core City, join JKK, their armor is very good for pistols, excellent stopgap measure until infused rat.
 

toro

Arcane
Vatnik
Joined
Apr 14, 2009
Messages
14,023
Why snooping? There's only a few oddities behind perception that early in the game. There's also the hidden door in Junkyard, but it's, I think, 10 PER.
Kneecap is good throughout the game.
I don't use Grenadier as I see damage dealing grenades as a crutch to help builds going in the early game. It's useful, but not necessary later on.
Never liked Quick Tinkering, traps aren't my thing.

I did not take Snooping - it's just mouse over effect. The only feats I have are Gunslinger, Opportunist and Recklessness.

I will take Aimed Shot because I want Sharpshooter at lvl 10.

This is the partial build until lvl 10: http://underrail.info.tm/build/?CgMKBAMMAwc8HgAAAAA8AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANwAAABcmMQECK8KHM9-_

Here's my build, maybe that'll help. http://underrail.info.tm/build/?HgU...QEXHlvChyZLEVnCiAI6wrXCpFDinrsC4qC9BOKnvgnfvw
If you make it to Core City, join JKK, their armor is very good for pistols, excellent stopgap measure until infused rat.

Thanks. I have to look over it.

Edit:
One thing I can tell you is that 5 STR for Steadfast Aim was wasted. That feat is not great with 15 AP per shot pistols.
In fact your build is overkill for critical chance bonuses: Recklessness + Steadfast Aim + Survival Instincts + Ambush. It's simply too much.
 
Last edited:

Sheepherder

Augur
Joined
Feb 4, 2014
Messages
657
Why snooping? There's only a few oddities behind perception that early in the game. There's also the hidden door in Junkyard, but it's, I think, 10 PER.
Kneecap is good throughout the game.
I don't use Grenadier as I see damage dealing grenades as a crutch to help builds going in the early game. It's useful, but not necessary later on.
Never liked Quick Tinkering, traps aren't my thing.

I did not take Snooping - it's just mouse over effect. The only feats I have are Gunslinger, Opportunist and Recklessness.

I will take Aimed Shot because I want Sharpshooter at lvl 10.

This is the partial build until lvl 10: http://underrail.info.tm/build/?CgMKBAMMAwc8HgAAAAA8AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANwAAABcmMQECK8KHM9-_

Here's my build, maybe that'll help. http://underrail.info.tm/build/?HgU...QEXHlvChyZLEVnCiAI6wrXCpFDinrsC4qC9BOKnvgnfvw
If you make it to Core City, join JKK, their armor is very good for pistols, excellent stopgap measure until infused rat.

Thanks. I have to look over it.

Edit:
One thing I can tell you is that 5 STR for Steadfast Aim was wasted.
In fact your build is overkill for critical chance bonuses: Recklessness + Steadfast Aim + Survival Instincts + Ambush. It's simply too much.
Sharpshooter isn't very good with pistols imo. I find myself moving too much to make use of its +crit dmg bonus. Nice alpha strike feat tho.

I forgot to mention, but I use smart goggles instead of +crit% goggles. So for consistent damage output I needed my crit chance to be as high as possible. It was either get steadfast aim bringing endgame crit% to 89%, or put those two points into PER and instead specialize into recklessness for the same effect. At lvl30, 2 points of PER is around +<5% total damage and +1-3% thc on most enemies. Meh. Especially when Juice stacks with food and lasts 15 min.
And yeah, ambush is a waste. I took it because I wanted to top off my crit chance. But it's too much effort to make it work when I can instead shoot or cc. Metabolism would have been better for QoLl. Doesn't really matter at that point.

Edit: Steadfast aim works off base AP (rapid reloader changes base AP), not modified. It's +8% crit chance.
You getting Execute? It's p. good in arena. Cryostasis helps with that. What Dex are you aiming for and why 4 agility?
If you plant to use hammerer, don't get Gun Nut, it's not worth it. Max damage is good enough as it is, it's min damage rolls you need to worry about and build around.
 
Last edited:

hell bovine

Arcane
Joined
Sep 9, 2013
Messages
2,711
Location
Secret Level
Sheepherder
I think it should be possible to set up ambushes with telekinetic proxy, since it gives light (same as force field). But in general I'd say if you add psi to your build, that lowers the difficulty of the game noticeably, due to how overpowered it is.
 

Blackmill

Scholar
Joined
Dec 25, 2014
Messages
326
I think Ambush is great but maybe it's less useful with shorter range weapons (compared to, say, a crossbow). Here's some notable fights where you can activate Ambush.

Tchort. Many tiles are considered dark, so just throw a flare at Tchort, and enjoy 100% crit chance.

The Faceless Commander. There's a few tiles near where you begin the fight that are considered dark.

Fort Apogee. Even thought it seems fully illuminated, there's dark tiles to ambush the two courtyard Dreadnoughts.

Nearly all of the Black Sea ruins, including all the areas where you fight Nagas.
 

toro

Arcane
Vatnik
Joined
Apr 14, 2009
Messages
14,023
Why snooping? There's only a few oddities behind perception that early in the game. There's also the hidden door in Junkyard, but it's, I think, 10 PER.
Kneecap is good throughout the game.
I don't use Grenadier as I see damage dealing grenades as a crutch to help builds going in the early game. It's useful, but not necessary later on.
Never liked Quick Tinkering, traps aren't my thing.

I did not take Snooping - it's just mouse over effect. The only feats I have are Gunslinger, Opportunist and Recklessness.

I will take Aimed Shot because I want Sharpshooter at lvl 10.

This is the partial build until lvl 10: http://underrail.info.tm/build/?CgMKBAMMAwc8HgAAAAA8AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANwAAABcmMQECK8KHM9-_

Here's my build, maybe that'll help. http://underrail.info.tm/build/?HgU...QEXHlvChyZLEVnCiAI6wrXCpFDinrsC4qC9BOKnvgnfvw
If you make it to Core City, join JKK, their armor is very good for pistols, excellent stopgap measure until infused rat.

Thanks. I have to look over it.

Edit:
One thing I can tell you is that 5 STR for Steadfast Aim was wasted.
In fact your build is overkill for critical chance bonuses: Recklessness + Steadfast Aim + Survival Instincts + Ambush. It's simply too much.
Sharpshooter isn't very good with pistols imo. I find myself moving too much to make use of its +crit dmg bonus. Nice alpha strike feat tho.

I forgot to mention, but I use smart goggles instead of +crit% goggles. So for consistent damage output I needed my crit chance to be as high as possible. It was either get steadfast aim bringing endgame crit% to 89%, or put those two points into PER and instead specialize into recklessness for the same effect. At lvl30, 2 points of PER is around +<5% total damage and +1-3% thc on most enemies. Meh. Especially when Juice stacks with food and lasts 15 min.
And yeah, ambush is a waste. I took it because I wanted to top off my crit chance. But it's too much effort to make it work when I can instead shoot or cc. Metabolism would have been better for QoLl. Doesn't really matter at that point.

Edit: Steadfast aim works off base AP (rapid reloader changes base AP), not modified. It's +8% crit chance.
You getting Execute? It's p. good in arena. Cryostasis helps with that. What Dex are you aiming for and why 4 agility?
If you plant to use hammerer, don't get Gun Nut, it's not worth it. Max damage is good enough as it is, it's min damage rolls you need to worry about and build around.

Well, we agree to disagree :)

1) I will go the Ambush route because I know Opportunist + Ambush + Molotov is a great combination.

At 100 Stealth -> Ambush will give you exactly 50% critical chance. Much more than any other feat. It's easy to reach 100 Stealth.

There are many other sources for critical chance: googles, armor, chips, etc.

2) I think at some point I will take Execute but I'm not looking forward to it.

On the other hand I will take Gun Nut because of INT 7.

3) Agility is 4 because I wanted to have 10Dex/10Per/7Int. I don't plan to increase Dex over 10 because it's enough.

50AP + Adrenaline + Max TContraction = 92 AP for 3 rounds

16AP -> 13 AP Rapid Rel -> 11 Dex bonus -> 8AP Gunslinger -> max 11 attacks per turn
20AP -> 16 AP Rapid Rel -> 13 Dex bonus -> 10AP Gunslinger -> max 9 attacks per turn
25AP -> 20 AP Rapid Rel -> 17 Dex bonus -> 14AP Gunslinger -> max 6 attacks per turn
32AP -> 26 AP Rapid Rel -> 22 Dex bonus -> 19AP Gunslinger -> max 4 attacks per turn
40AP -> 32 AP Rapid Rel -> 27 Dex bonus -> 24AP Gunslinger -> max 3 attacks per turn
I intend to go for Falchion 20AP and max critical damage. I just want to see if it's possible to get 9 criticals in one round.

4) Your build is going for max special attack damage while my plan is going for simple overall max damage (with criticals).

Honestly I want to challenge myself and that's why I will not abuse PSI (except for AP bonus) or use weapons above pistols.

On the other hand, I really don't know if a almost pure pistols firearms build can reach Tchort.
 

Sheepherder

Augur
Joined
Feb 4, 2014
Messages
657
Sheepherder
I think it should be possible to set up ambushes with telekinetic proxy, since it gives light (same as force field). But in general I'd say if you add psi to your build, that lowers the difficulty of the game noticeably, due to how overpowered it is.
Adding psi to builds is a slippery slope too. At first I was only getting TM for contraction and increment, then psychokinesis for the force field, now I'm also getting metathermics for cryostasis. Before you know it, I'll be playing pure psi again.

I think Ambush is great but maybe it's less useful with shorter range weapons (compared to, say, a crossbow). Here's some notable fights where you can activate Ambush.

Tchort. Many tiles are considered dark, so just throw a flare at Tchort, and enjoy 100% crit chance.

The Faceless Commander. There's a few tiles near where you begin the fight that are considered dark.

Fort Apogee. Even thought it seems fully illuminated, there's dark tiles to ambush the two courtyard Dreadnoughts.

Nearly all of the Black Sea ruins, including all the areas where you fight Nagas.
Arena too, if you go into either of the corners behind pillars.

Why snooping? There's only a few oddities behind perception that early in the game. There's also the hidden door in Junkyard, but it's, I think, 10 PER.
Kneecap is good throughout the game.
I don't use Grenadier as I see damage dealing grenades as a crutch to help builds going in the early game. It's useful, but not necessary later on.
Never liked Quick Tinkering, traps aren't my thing.

I did not take Snooping - it's just mouse over effect. The only feats I have are Gunslinger, Opportunist and Recklessness.

I will take Aimed Shot because I want Sharpshooter at lvl 10.

This is the partial build until lvl 10: http://underrail.info.tm/build/?CgMKBAMMAwc8HgAAAAA8AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANwAAABcmMQECK8KHM9-_

Here's my build, maybe that'll help. http://underrail.info.tm/build/?HgU...QEXHlvChyZLEVnCiAI6wrXCpFDinrsC4qC9BOKnvgnfvw
If you make it to Core City, join JKK, their armor is very good for pistols, excellent stopgap measure until infused rat.

Thanks. I have to look over it.

Edit:
One thing I can tell you is that 5 STR for Steadfast Aim was wasted.
In fact your build is overkill for critical chance bonuses: Recklessness + Steadfast Aim + Survival Instincts + Ambush. It's simply too much.
Sharpshooter isn't very good with pistols imo. I find myself moving too much to make use of its +crit dmg bonus. Nice alpha strike feat tho.

I forgot to mention, but I use smart goggles instead of +crit% goggles. So for consistent damage output I needed my crit chance to be as high as possible. It was either get steadfast aim bringing endgame crit% to 89%, or put those two points into PER and instead specialize into recklessness for the same effect. At lvl30, 2 points of PER is around +<5% total damage and +1-3% thc on most enemies. Meh. Especially when Juice stacks with food and lasts 15 min.
And yeah, ambush is a waste. I took it because I wanted to top off my crit chance. But it's too much effort to make it work when I can instead shoot or cc. Metabolism would have been better for QoLl. Doesn't really matter at that point.

Edit: Steadfast aim works off base AP (rapid reloader changes base AP), not modified. It's +8% crit chance.
You getting Execute? It's p. good in arena. Cryostasis helps with that. What Dex are you aiming for and why 4 agility?
If you plant to use hammerer, don't get Gun Nut, it's not worth it. Max damage is good enough as it is, it's min damage rolls you need to worry about and build around.

Well, we agree to disagree :)

1) I will go the Ambush route because I know Opportunist + Ambush + Molotov is a great combination.

At 100 Stealth -> Ambush will give you exactly 50% critical chance. Much more than any other feat. It's easy to reach 100 Stealth.

There are many other sources for critical chance: googles, armor, chips, etc.

2) I think at some point I will take Execute but I'm not looking forward to it.

On the other hand I will take Gun Nut because of INT 7.

3) Agility is 4 because I wanted to have 10Dex/10Per/7Int. I don't plan to increase Dex over 10 because it's enough.

50AP + Adrenaline + Max TContraction = 92 AP for 3 rounds

16AP -> 13 AP Rapid Rel -> 11 Dex bonus -> 8AP Gunslinger -> max 11 attacks per turn
20AP -> 16 AP Rapid Rel -> 13 Dex bonus -> 10AP Gunslinger -> max 9 attacks per turn
25AP -> 20 AP Rapid Rel -> 17 Dex bonus -> 14AP Gunslinger -> max 6 attacks per turn
32AP -> 26 AP Rapid Rel -> 22 Dex bonus -> 19AP Gunslinger -> max 4 attacks per turn
40AP -> 32 AP Rapid Rel -> 27 Dex bonus -> 24AP Gunslinger -> max 3 attacks per turn
I intend to go for Falchion 20AP and max critical damage. I just want to see if it's possible to get 9 criticals in one round.

4) Your build is going for max special attack damage while my plan is going for simple overall max damage (with criticals).

Honestly I want to challenge myself and that's why I will not abuse PSI (except for AP bonus) or use weapons above pistols.

On the other hand, I really don't know if a almost pure pistols firearms build can reach Tchort.
What do you mean by Opportunist + Ambush + Molotov? Opportunist does no get enabled by either ambush or molotovs.
You plan on using a 7.62mm falcion for 10 AP attacks? I did some testing with a crafting save and CE by using pistol frames other than .44 hammerer and their damage was too low for my liking. You might run into trouble past Dep A. Gun Nut might help with that a little bit, but it's only an extra 5-10% total damage.
Unlike most other weapon types, firearm pistols don't have any exclusive +damage feats which could carry them. The easiest sources of additional damage to get are opportunist, crit damage and special attack damage. Opportunist alone will not be enough. Pistol low base damage and poor synergy with Critical Power (frames other than hammerer don't have crit damage over 100%) means their crits are meh. So to get good damage you'll want special attack damage bonus too.

If you insist on using firearm pistol for the early game, then prepare to suffer :lol:. It's not going to be a challenge but a chore.
As for racial build purity, metathermics is not necessary if you don't intend to use Execute much. Psychokinesis is also not mandatory, but force field is just soooo convenient. And it's not going to be a very Übermensch build if you exchange the taint of psi for the crutch of quick tinkering/grenadier.

For early money, there's an unlocked footlocker in Junkyard casino surveillance room with +200 charons. Lure away the guard with a noisy grenade and grab that $$$, buy molotovs, frags, bear traps and caltrops. Kill Vilmer, get another +200. There, money problem on Dominating solved as early as lvl 3. gg ezpz

Edit: This got me to thinking. Any idea how a 5AP pistol build with a 5mm frame would turn out? 18 attacks per round. Might be okay.
 
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Joined
Jan 24, 2020
Messages
16
I'd not say the expansion is that balanced, on classic you level way too fast due to enemy numbers. On oddity it's fine. Also, it's definitely biased towards full psi, so just use that build Goromorg posted and you'll have an easy time.

that sounds like it might be my solution. I played on oddity when I got stuck, and I also didn't go anything psi at all as far as I can remember. mainly went melee stealthy type character. cheers!
 

toro

Arcane
Vatnik
Joined
Apr 14, 2009
Messages
14,023
What do you mean by Opportunist + Ambush + Molotov? Opportunist does no get enabled by either ambush or molotovs.

I mean Bear Trap + Molotov + Opportunist + Ambush :) Nothing survives this combination.

You plan on using a 7.62mm falcion for 10 AP attacks? I did some testing with a crafting save and CE by using pistol frames other than .44 hammerer and their damage was too low for my liking. You might run into trouble past Dep A. Gun Nut might help with that a little bit, but it's only an extra 5-10% total damage.

I already had 5 criticals in a row and I'm pretty sure that the overall damage/ammo ratio is better than both AR and Sniper. (brainfart)

If you insist on using firearm pistol for the early game, then prepare to suffer :lol:. It's not going to be a challenge but a chore.

Surprisingly, the chore is over after GMS compound and I killed those bandits also.

Found Hammerer .44
23AE76BA1B52761BB765C4A10F2A21D0491D5CD4


Crafted Hammerer .44
B533D2F11C136888F8E2AA3C9560181DF180D5DE


218 critical with the new Hammerer .44
17C7C3D89BA7FDD92DBAC987E0FC0D338C8E4D24


Basically the crafting has started to kick in at lvl6. I love this game
love.png
 
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hell bovine

Arcane
Joined
Sep 9, 2013
Messages
2,711
Location
Secret Level
The annoying thing is that from what I remeber the additional damage from special bullets (like the exploding .44) doesn't get multiplied by criticals. Even though pistols could really use such a damage boost.

Meanwhile my current cave wizard has reached the 1k mark now with neural overload crits. :roll:
 

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