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Colony Ship update #41: begun the closed beta has

Deleted Member 22431

Guest
You mean KoTOR?
No, I meant MotB. Although both KotORs have this problem too, but I didn't find their voice-overs that good to begin with.
 
Joined
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Messages
425
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Georgie's shitter
Vault Dweller - I would like to apply for the beta, if possible at this point. I'm probably the oldest shithead on this forum (70), same age as that piece of ass Joyce DeWitt in fact, God Bless her tail. I'd be the ideal candidate to take an objective look at Colony Ship.
May I inquire as to why you're even interested in the game? If I recall correctly, you absolutely hated AoD and Dungeon Rats. While I'm overjoyed to see such rare open-mindedness about Colony Ship, I'm afraid you will end up being disappointed again.[/QUOTE]

Vault Dweller - you bring up great points, lad. I hated both AoD and Dungeon Rats, they were both shit to my mind. But Colony Ship looks like a completely different animal, and besides -- Sci-fi is my first love, well, next to Jayne Mansfield's tits that is.
 
Joined
Nov 3, 2016
Messages
425
Location
Georgie's shitter
Vault Dweller - I would like to apply for the beta, if possible at this point. I'm probably the oldest shithead on this forum (70), same age as that piece of ass Joyce DeWitt in fact, God Bless her tail. I'd be the ideal candidate to take an objective look at Colony Ship.

What's your story, mr. Oldfag, sir? Do you remember Woodstock?

I certainly do remember it. Woodstock ? 19 years old and part of the fucking massive traffic jam trying to get into Max's Farm. What a deal. So much drugs over those few days and so much tail. Over the years people have asked me what stood out and its not the music, its that everybody there was shitting like racehorses. Strange, I know. But it might have been the dope doing that.
 

AbounI

Colonist
Patron
Joined
Dec 2, 2012
Messages
1,050
Can you Stick as melee late game. Also if you choose mixed since this time Is more Morrowind style (more you use a skill more It will improve) rather than aod style (you can use daggers only but for no reason hoard your points for weapons you will never use) will you get good melee early game but later only ranged because better better ranged weapons and skills make you avoid melee?
Well, it's definitly doable. Goral and I went with 2 different builds as melee fighter & lone wolf, and we did it.

I went for a full dodger like in AoD, only 2 fights were very very hard. With a lightly ajusted RNG mod (the same one as AoD/DR), one of these was mostly impossible (tried more tan 10 times with diffrent tactical approach). Then I changed for a hevily adjusted RNG, and this same fight only took me 2 attempts, maybe I was in good day. I never accept a meatshield party member, strictly lone wolf. Of course, knowing your ennemies was a great help (who to defeat first, pattern and things like that), but name me a game where it's not the case. On a side note, it's still easy to fuck your build though.
 
Joined
Dec 12, 2013
Messages
4,229
The game is fun.

VD, it's still very early in me trying the game, but I have two questions (both in case of playing single character):

1)Weapon exp gain is weapon damage dealt after graze/hit/ critical before damage reduction + 33% rounded down?

2)There is a limit how much you can get defensive (evasion/ amour) experience from each opponent during combat? My counting says it's 100 per enemy combatant I am right?


If 1) is true then the system is somehow exploitable.:
-You always gain more by doing criticals, finishing opponents on low HP with critical is recommended if you are able to afford it as it gives extra weapon exp.
-Damage reduction is more exploitable. If you want to do a hybrid fighter you should target people having projectile damage reduction with projectiles and those with melee damage reduction with melee weapons. For best results take both weapons with bonus to critical.
- Another tip for hybrid is to use the weapon that deals more damage to finish up dying enemies:
- Which also means that weapons that deal more damages should level up faster the same applies to weapons with bonus to critical.
- System penalizes using poison grenades as poison chips away enemy HP without giving player skill points.


If 2) is true then a lot of silly things ought to happen during playthroughs. Dalton brothers know something about it. I managed to get higher evasion just before getting Billy (5 level and 68 exp) than in first playthrogh that ended up on Naughty Family (4 level and 80 exp). Stats were the same, with the difference of a single extra point in evasion in the second build. (low skill levels improve quickly, so the extra point doesn't explain this)

My super early recommendation: Give a fixed amount of exp per fight. Distribute it proportionally among skills used in an encounter. If one had won battle doing 2 pistol attack and 2 evasion and there is 100 exp for battle, then give 50 to pistol 50 to evasion. If someone won doing 70 pistol attacks and 30 evasion then give 70 exp for pistols and 30 for evasion.

However, gaming the system may be fun and my idea would make it less so.
 

Elhoim

Iron Tower Studio
Developer
Joined
Oct 27, 2006
Messages
2,878
Location
San Isidro, Argentina
The game is fun.

VD, it's still very early in me trying the game, but I have two questions (both in case of playing single character):

1)Weapon exp gain is weapon damage dealt after graze/hit/ critical before damage reduction + 33% rounded down?

Yeah, except for the 33% part. That's probably your tag + INT bonus. Also some hard enemies give a bit more, around 10% more on all LP gain.

2)There is a limit how much you can get defensive (evasion/amour) experience from each opponent during combat? My counting says it's 100 per enemy combatant I am right?

Yeah, around that, depends on the enemy.

If 1) is true then the system is somehow exploitable.:
-You always gain more by doing criticals, finishing opponents on low HP with critical is recommended if you are able to afford it as it gives extra weapon exp.

Critical range is quite small (around 20-25 max), so it's not something you can count on. Plus attacks that give you criticals cost more AP. If you want to use them, it's a trade-off.

- Damage reduction is more exploitable. If you want to do a hybrid fighter you should target people having projectile damage reduction with projectiles and those with melee damage reduction with melee weapons. For best results take both weapons with bonus to critical.

You lost me here, DR is not taken into account. If you make 10 damage to a guy with 0 DR and 10 damage to a guy with 10 DR, you always get 10 points.

- Another tip for hybrid is to use the weapon that deals more damage to finish up dying enemies:

That's not really a given. Damage ranges are all pretty close inside the same category, and most overlap. So maybe the difference is 1 or 2 points at best.

- Which also means that weapons that deal more damages should level up faster the same applies to weapons with bonus to critical.

Just a bit, and the only difference is made in the last shot, so maybe, 3-4 points.

- System penalizes using poison grenades as poison chips away enemy HP without giving player skill points.

Yeah, using poison grenades doesn't give you LP, but many times it's the only way to win a fight, as you can see on the forums.

This gaming of the system kinda possible with low level enemies. But as you can see on the reports, you won't have much leeway to game the system. You will be getting a bit more LP with better weapons and criticals, but not something that will matter very much in the long run. We made the LP levels "small" for the demo, so you can reach a high level after 12 fights, but in the game it will level up much more slowly (especially after level 3-4). The real difference will be made by tags, INT and also extra training.

If 2) is true then a lot of silly things ought to happen during playthroughs. Dalton brothers know something about it. I managed to get higher evasion just before getting Billy (5 level and 68 exp) than in first playthrogh that ended up on Naughty Family (4 level and 80 exp). Stats were the same, with the difference of a single extra point in evasion in the second build. (low skill levels improve quickly, so the extra point doesn't explain this)

Well, that's a case of low level enemies, it's the second fight and quite easy. This kind of metagaming might give you an extra level when you are level 1-2, but as we increase the level requirement it flattens out. Plus a single level difference in combat it's not very powerful (5 more THC or 5 to evasion).

However, gaming the system may be fun and my idea would make it less so.

Yeah, even if it doesn't make a real difference in the long run some people might fight it fun to toy with some low level enemies to farm a bit of evasion (until they get unlucky and get an axe on the head.)
 
Joined
Dec 12, 2013
Messages
4,229
You lost me here, DR is not taken into account. If you make 10 damage to a guy with 0 DR and 10 damage to a guy with 10 DR, you always get 10 points.

If you do 10 damage to a guy with 10 DR, you do 0 effective damage, but get 10 skill exp points. If you can allows yourself to keep the guy with high DR alive long enough you can theoretically grind him as long as you are able to evade/reduce his damage. If there is a low level enemy with some DR reduction somewhere in the actual game, you can wait until the middle game when you have good defense stats and grind him with the worst weapon you have. Going for grazes could help in keeping the victim alive. However how feasible it would be depends on how cheap ammo is, you would effectively trade a bullet for 2-3 skill points, which may be a bad deal. Sword with critical bonus wouldn't work either, but maybe hammers?

I am a greedy bastard and I see enemy HP as a pool of potential exp.

That's not really a given. Damage ranges are all pretty close inside the same category, and most overlap. So maybe the difference is 1 or 2 points at best.


Plying more I see you are right. Was the choice to make all weapons do similar damage, a measure against munchkins or do you just wanted players to consider weapons based on abilities/ other advantages they posses rather than boring raw damages? Would bet on the second option.

This gaming of the system kinda possible with low level enemies. But as you can see on the reports, you won't have much leeway to game the system. You will be getting a bit more LP with better weapons and criticals, but not something that will matter very much in the long run. We made the LP levels "small" for the demo, so you can reach a high level after 12 fights, but in the game it will level up much more slowly (especially after level 3-4). The real difference will be made by tags, INT and also extra training.

Reasonable.

Been trying to force my level gaining abuses on more difficult encounters, but enemies don't let me bully them. It even somehow backfired because I was taking only defensive perks just to sustain my monkey lifestyle :)

(until they get unlucky and get an axe on the head.)

That's a beautiful lifestyle choice of an adventurer.


I enjoy demo greatly. Fights are challenging and I have a few competing ideas on how to build a character.
 

Tigranes

Arcane
Joined
Jan 8, 2009
Messages
10,350
Enemies have a skill point pool so you can't sit there and grind on him for 800 years. I've been playing 'normally' and I don't think I've ever exhausted the pool, so I don't know how big/small it is. I could try later.

Yes, I suppose theoretically you can sit there calculating which enemy has the right amount of DR versus your particular attack with the right amount of damage to keep him alive and torture him for a bit of extra XP. Doing that, though, it seems to me that you're intent on playing in a miserably boring and pointless way, and there's only so far a game can go to stop you.
 
Joined
Dec 12, 2013
Messages
4,229
Yes, I suppose theoretically you can sit there calculating which enemy has the right amount of DR versus your particular attack with the right amount of damage to keep him alive and torture him for a bit of extra XP. Doing that, though, it seems to me that you're intent on playing in a miserably boring and pointless way, and there's only so far a game can go to stop you.

Agree. Wanted to try how far I can go trying to break a dreaded learn by doing system, especially considering that feedback on that may be useful.
 

Elhoim

Iron Tower Studio
Developer
Joined
Oct 27, 2006
Messages
2,878
Location
San Isidro, Argentina
If you do 10 damage to a guy with 10 DR, you do 0 effective damage, but get 10 skill exp points. If you can allows yourself to keep the guy with high DR alive long enough you can theoretically grind him as long as you are able to evade/reduce his damage. If there is a low level enemy with some DR reduction somewhere in the actual game, you can wait until the middle game when you have good defense stats and grind him with the worst weapon you have. Going for grazes could help in keeping the victim alive.

Yeah, I see what you mean. But we keep defensive/offensive levels in line, so you won't find an enemy that won't make your life miserable if you keep him alive. 10-11 DR is around the max you can get, so an enemy with those stats has firepower to match.

Thing is, let's say he has 7 DR, and the worst weapon has 10-14 damage. Grazes are not guaranteed, and your hits will damage him. He will be killed eventually. Even if you keep yourself alive with distortion field, grenades, etc, maybe you'll "farm" what, 10, 20 points more than fighting him normally? When leveling up after the first ones takes hundreds.

I see fighting some lower level enemies as a good opportunity to level up side weapon skills. If I'm very good with guns, but want some shotgun practice, I use it to quickly gain a few levels.

However how feasible it would be depends on how cheap ammo is, you would effectively trade a bullet for 2-3 skill points, which may be a bad deal. Sword with critical bonus wouldn't work either, but maybe hammers

The idea is to make it not cheap at all.

Playing more I see you are right. Was the choice to make all weapons do similar damage, a measure against munchkins or do you just wanted players to consider weapons based on abilities/ other advantages they posses rather than boring raw damages? Would bet on the second option.

First we even made all guns with the same ammo do the same damage, but made it kinda boring. But yeah, the goal was to make 2-3 different weapon types that function quite differently, and then a 3 tier linear progression inside the categories (with modifiers to make them a bit more unique). Damage gets a bit of an increase when moving up tiers, but it's about a 4-5 dmg difference between the lowest and the highest. Plus it makes balancing armor easier.

Been trying to force my level gaining abuses on more difficult encounters, but enemies don't let me bully them. It even somehow backfired because I was taking only defensive perks just to sustain my monkey lifestyle :)

Yeah, I just did the Clayton fight and thank god for poison damage. Keep your filthy LP, Salomon, I'll keep my life.

I enjoy demo greatly. Fights are challenging and I have a few competing ideas on how to build a character.

Awesome!

We are very happy with how it's shaping up. We are including some implants and stims in the next update, and doing a balance pass on AP. Working on a few more feats as well.
 

Castozor

Scholar
Joined
Nov 12, 2014
Messages
151
Great to hear things are shaping up to your expectations. i enjoyed DR and AoD a lot so if you need more testers let me know. I probably wont be as useful lads like Eyestabber and Goral on account of not being that good, but I´d love to see what you have in store for us with Colony Ship.
 

Black Angel

Arcane
Joined
Jun 23, 2016
Messages
2,910
Location
Wonderland
I'm such a goddamn scrub. Can't seem to find a reliable way to defeat Big Jim and the gang as a Lone Wolf bladed-evasion char with 8/8/8/6(7 with implant)/6/4. Just when I think the odds are finally stacked in my favor, fucking Big Jim just keeps on scoring some lucky critical hit that render my Artful Dodger useless or multiple successive graze that chipped my HP little by little down to zero. Not to mention he also got Tough Bastard feat that limits my crit chance down to 5%.

I've tried everything I could think of, from using smoke 'nades, gas 'nades, flashbangs (both low-grade and mid-grade variant), even selling everything I got for that high quality axe. I can't get both mid-grade flashbang and axe, so it's one or the other. I tried rushing , I tried backing of and luring them in, nothing can carry me to victory.

Also, it seems shotguns are going to be really OP, or at least the one Big Jim is using that is (Desperado). Seemingly low AP cost, coupled with not only high graze chance but ALSO decent graze damage, it's the bane of every melee char. I probably gonna try making the char in VD's screenshot (berserker blunt melee) and see how it goes.
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
Jan 7, 2003
Messages
28,024
I've tried everything I could think of, from using smoke 'nades, gas 'nades, flashbangs (both low-grade and mid-grade variant), even selling everything I got for that high quality axe. I can't get both mid-grade flashbang and axe, so it's one or the other. I tried rushing , I tried backing of and luring them in, nothing can carry me to victory.
Distortion field?

Also, it seems shotguns are going to be really OP, or at least the one Big Jim is using that is (Desperado). Seemingly low AP cost, coupled with not only high graze chance but ALSO decent graze damage, it's the bane of every melee char.
Players wanted shotguns to be more powerful, unwisely forgetting that it would make enemies' shotguns more powerful too.

I probably gonna try making the char in VD's screenshot (berserker blunt melee) and see how it goes.
Email us your save game first, we'd like to take a look at your blademaster. info@irontowerstudio.com
 

Black Angel

Arcane
Joined
Jun 23, 2016
Messages
2,910
Location
Wonderland
I've tried everything I could think of, from using smoke 'nades, gas 'nades, flashbangs (both low-grade and mid-grade variant), even selling everything I got for that high quality axe. I can't get both mid-grade flashbang and axe, so it's one or the other. I tried rushing , I tried backing of and luring them in, nothing can carry me to victory.
Distortion field?
Had that too. I even upgraded its power cell to make it last 1 turn longer. I also tried turning it on at the start and try turning it later.

Players wanted shotguns to be more powerful, unwisely forgetting that it would make enemies' shotguns more powerful too.
It's okay. I'm not complaining about Desperado or even shotguns in general. Just saying that it seems Big Jim's quite a lucky guy to possess such powerful stuff.

Email us your save game first, we'd like to take a look at your blademaster. info@irontowerstudio.com
Aight, wait.
 

Black Angel

Arcane
Joined
Jun 23, 2016
Messages
2,910
Location
Wonderland
Can't seem to find a reliable way to defeat Big Jim and the gang as a Lone Wolf bladed-evasion char with 8/8/8/6(7 with implant)/6/4.
Did you bring along a meat shild? Which game rng mod did you chose?
A meat shield would render my Lone Wolf useless. Though I did try bringing one since I noticed upon their death, Lone Wolf would re-activate.
 

jackofshadows

Magister
Joined
Oct 21, 2019
Messages
4,488
I noticed upon their death, Lone Wolf would re-activate.
Exactly. I haven't tried current patch yet but in previous one I wasn't able to beat Gim and Muta w/o it as a lone wolf. Also sometimes I did relax rng settings at least to mid one and after establishing tactics, well, just reload 2-3 times for positive outcome. I consider this appropriate enough for lone wolf case.
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
Jan 7, 2003
Messages
28,024
Checked my email and got some bad news.

From Department of Justice (FBI) <rep_trackteam18@fbicrmemonitor.us>
^ Trackteam18? These guys don't fuck around.

Federal Bureau of Investigation
Field Intelligence Groups J. Edgar Hoover Building
935 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW Washington, D.C.

Attention:

I am Christopher A. Wray from the Federal Bureau of Investigation ( FBI ) Field Intelligence Groups (FIGs). We intercepted two consignment boxes at JFK Airport, New York. The boxes were scanned and they contained large sums of money ($10 million), also some backup documents that bear your name as the Beneficiary / Receiver. An investigation was carried out on the diplomat that accompanied the boxes into the United States and he stated that he was to deliver the funds to your residence as an overdue payment owed to you by a foreign country.

After cross-checking all legal documents in the boxes, we found out that your consignment was lacking an important document and we can't release the boxes to the diplomat until the document is found, we have no other option than to confiscate your consignment.

According to Internal Revenue Code (IRC) in Title 26 also contain reporting requirements on a Form 8300, Report of Cash Payment Over $10,000 Received in a Trade or Business, money laundering activity may violate 18 USC §1956, 18 USC 1957, 18 USC 1960, and provision of Title 31, and 26 USC 6050I of the United States Code (USC), this section will discuss only those money laundering and currency violations under the jurisdiction of IRS, your consignment lacks proof of ownership certificate from the joint team of IRS and IRC, you're requested to reply back immediately for direction on how to procure the fund ownership certificate to avoid being charged for evading the law, which is punishable offense in the United States.

You are required to reply within 72hours or you will be prosecuted in a court of law for money laundering, you are instructed to desist from further contact with any bank(s) or person(s) in any part of the world regarding your payment because your consignment has been confiscated by the Federal Bureau of Investigation here in the United States.

Yours In Service,
Agent Christopher A. Wray
Regional Deputy Director

^ the text was bolded to show how serious the situation is.
 

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