UnderRail review at RPS - and it's negative!

[AndrewCC]

I'm over 30 and a game wasting my time is unforgivable.
I don't mind difficulty if you explain your game systems adequately beforehand. But letting the player trap himself into a sub-par or even unwinnable build with no warning is a sign of poor design.
No, gamedevs, I don't wanna restart the game 3 times until I have enough meta-knowledge to know what to expect and build my character accordingly. No, I don't want to savescum fights because you make adapting on-the-fly impossible.
Either get your balance right, or err on the side of too easy if you can't do QA.

 

[Sykar]

I'm over 30 and a game wasting my time is unforgivable.
I don't mind difficulty if you explain your game systems adequately beforehand. But letting the player trap himself into a sub-par or even unwinnable build with no warning is a sign of poor design.
No, gamedevs, I don't wanna restart the game 3 times until I have enough meta-knowledge to know what to expect and build my character accordingly. No, I don't want to savescum fights because you make adapting on-the-fly impossible.
Either get your balance right, or err on the side of too easy if you can't do QA.

JGEDYD

Spoiler

Just
Go
Easy
Difficulty
You
Dumbfuck

 

[680x0]

Is Andrew Sin Vega's "deadname?"

*coof coof*

 

[Drowed]

I don't mind difficulty if you explain your game systems adequately beforehand. But letting the player trap himself into a sub-par or even unwinnable build with no warning is a sign of poor design.

And this is how a disciple of Sawyer is born.

 

[AndrewCC]

Angry mouth farts

You retards posture all this tranny hate, but don't make any effort to know your enemy. No tranny would deadname xirself.

And this is how a disciple of Sawyer is born.

Like I said I don't have time to restart a game 3 times because the dev can't give me info about which skills are useless and which are essential. Do you realise how long my fucking backlog is? One playthrough per game is all I can spare, unless it's an absolute masterpiece, and drop any game that's wasting my time with bullshit.

 

[Higher Game]

There should be "safe" builds like paladins or pure rogues etc. Things like battlemages or cleric/thief mixes should be allowed too, and allowed to fail. I do think science fiction games where everything is weird should be more forgiving, of course.

 

[Drowed]

I have 800+ games on Steam, 150+ games on GOG and all that free shit that Epic is giving each week (because why not). I'll probably never have time to play 30% of all that. And I still think that if you think it's the developer's role to babysit players to make sure they don't make mistakes, you're following Sawyer's logic.

Underrail is an easy game, ffs. And it makes the mechanics very clear from the start. If you managed to put yourself in an impossible situation to win while playing it, I can't even imagine how much you would cry trying to play Age of Decadence. Or even any D&D-based game for that matter.

 

[Sweeper]

can't give me info about which skills are useless and which are essential.

Underrail does though.
You can show all feats on character creation and go down the list looking at each.
Do you want the devs to tell you which feats are broken and which are useless? What the best builds are? Can't you theorycraft for yourself?
If not there are plenty of places online to find good builds.
I'm pretty sure this is bait, but there's your alert.

Underrail is an easy game

Ehhhh, every RPG is easy when you have a good build.
Underrail and PF:KM were a rude awakening for a lot of Larianfags, let alone other, lesser fanboys.

 

[Metronome]

Meta-gaming and save-scumming are serious problems with Underrail. I wouldn't go so far as to say they make the game a waste of time, but they are major flaws. Some of it could be fixed by including a manual, but I don't know how much. Maybe you can guess what the developer intends for you to do if you play a lot of games like this, but what they value seems arbitrary to me.

 

[AndrewCC]

Giving me the list of of all perks is like throwing the D&D player handbook at me and telling me to come up with a full build, and then throwing me into encounters meant for 2 levels above me.
Theorycrafting is for PvP games games and MMOs. I play some of the former, but I'm done with the latter, it's all just a grindfest.
All these problems with having unwinnable builds would be solved by giving tje player the option to respec his character (excluding story choices/rewards ofc).
"B-but no you'll abuse the system to craft items then respec for combat"
The only thing the dev should care is if the player has fun, balance in single-player is for schmucks. If i feel the game is easy I'll raise the difficuly myself, or impose my own restrictions.

 

[Sykar]

Giving me the list of of all perks is like throwing the D&D player handbook at me and telling me to come up with a full build, and then throwing me into encounters meant for 2 levels above me.
Theorycrafting is for PvP games games and MMOs. I play some of the former, but I'm done with the latter, it's all just a grindfest.
All these problems with having unwinnable builds would be solved by giving tje player the option to respec his character (excluding story choices/rewards ofc).
"B-but no you'll abuse the system to craft items then respec for combat"
The only thing the dev should care is if the player has fun, balance in single-player is for schmucks. If i feel the game is easy I'll raise the difficuly myself, or impose my own restrictions.

JGEDYD

 

[Sweeper]

It's just really obvious bait at this point.

 

[Sykar]

Might be some RPS escapee. Maybe someone should tell them that one of their brain damaged sheep escaped.

 

[MpuMngwana]

Underrail is an easy game, ffs. And it makes the mechanics very clear from the start. If you managed to put yourself in an impossible situation to win while playing it, I can't even imagine how much you would cry trying to play Age of Decadence.

Actually I found out making a viable combat character is easier in AoD than Underrail. Even if it is more or less smooth sailing past Depot A, getting to that point required a few false starts for me to get there. Character building, especially for a combat-focused character, is way more straightforward in AoD (no feats, no stealth, no psi, crafting covered by one skill).

 

[*-*/\--/\~]

Well they actually displayed some good taste for once. Shittons of randomly generated trash belong in MMORPGs and should stay there.

 

[Sykar]

Underrail is an easy game, ffs. And it makes the mechanics very clear from the start. If you managed to put yourself in an impossible situation to win while playing it, I can't even imagine how much you would cry trying to play Age of Decadence.

Actually I found out making a viable combat character is easier in AoD than Underrail. Even if it is more or less smooth sailing past Depot A, getting to that point required a few false starts for me to get there. Character building, especially for a combat-focused character, is way more straightforward in AoD (no feats, no stealth, no psi, crafting covered by one skill).

I managed the game on hard on an unoptimized PSI sniper without crafting on my first playthrough. There is no excuse for restarting multiple times when you can just lower the difficulty.

 

[Parabalus]

Underrail is an easy game, ffs. And it makes the mechanics very clear from the start. If you managed to put yourself in an impossible situation to win while playing it, I can't even imagine how much you would cry trying to play Age of Decadence.

Actually I found out making a viable combat character is easier in AoD than Underrail. Even if it is more or less smooth sailing past Depot A, getting to that point required a few false starts for me to get there. Character building, especially for a combat-focused character, is way more straightforward in AoD (no feats, no stealth, no psi, crafting covered by one skill).

I managed the game on hard on an unoptimized PSI sniper without crafting on my first playthrough. There is no excuse for restarting multiple times when you can just lower the difficulty.

Cmon, you know the game well enough to know that stealth and PSI are at the top of the food chain.

If you started with release xbow or mech pistols without stealth on Hard you'd rightfully be pissed.

 

[Sykar]

He is not talking about a single restart but multiple. If I had struggled mightily I would have had no problem playing normal or easy. Use the difficulty you enjoy, not what you think you have to play for meaningless pride.

 

[overly excitable young man]

I'm over 30 and a game wasting my time is unforgivable.
I don't mind difficulty if you explain your game systems adequately beforehand. But letting the player trap himself into a sub-par or even unwinnable build with no warning is a sign of poor design.
No, gamedevs, I don't wanna restart the game 3 times until I have enough meta-knowledge to know what to expect and build my character accordingly. No, I don't want to savescum fights because you make adapting on-the-fly impossible.
Either get your balance right, or err on the side of too easy if you can't do QA.

WTF!? I don't get those complains about the difficulty of creating a build.
Maybe on dominating you need meta-knowledge.

But just with knowing what attributes influence what you should be capable to create a viable build in hard difficulty without meta-knowledge.
My first build (high dex and guns) worked just like i expected it and let me complete the game.
Also there are grenades and traps and shit to make harder passages easier.

 

[Parabalus]

He is not talking about a single restart but multiple. If I had struggled mightily I would have had no problem playing normal or easy. Use the difficulty you enjoy, not what you think you have to play for meaningless pride.

That's just an entirely different point.

The balance between builds is way off, you could randomly click at lvl up with fist or PSI and have an easier time than a meticulously planned xbow or pistol.

 

[Sweeper]

The balance between builds is still way off

And that's a good thing Mr. Sawyer.

 

[Parabalus]

The balance between builds is still way off

And that's a good thing Mr. Sawyer.

It's not like Styg didn't throw massive nerfs at the outliers, nerfed the enemies and buffed the underperforming builds.

 

[Sweeper]

It's not like Styg didn't throw massive nerfs at the outliers, nerfed the enemies and buffed the underperforming builds.

Funny you should mention that, I just checked patch notes and PSI is still unnerfed. Locus of Control was broken on the drawing board, but it's still in, cause it's fun.
All complaints of

muh difficulty
muh restarts

are meaningless when all they had to do was realize that Locus of Control was in the game and read up on Thought Control abilities, and it ain't even like that's the only powerful option, just the most broken one imo.

Not providing a manual with the game? Fair enough, valid criticism.
You still got the wiki though, that's without counting build guides.
What's not valid criticism is crying about balance and requiring meta knowledge.
Expecting to play an RPG without knowing the mechanics is like expecting to play a board game without knowing the rules.
Kinda dumb.

 

[Parabalus]

It's not like Styg didn't throw massive nerfs at the outliers, nerfed the enemies and buffed the underperforming builds.

Funny you should mention that, I just checked patch notes and PSI is still unnerfed. Locus of Control was broken on the drawing board, but it's still in, cause it's fun.
All complaints of

muh difficulty
muh restarts

are meaningless when all they had to do was realize that Locus of Control was in the game and read up on Thought Control abilities.

Not providing a manual with the game? Fair enough, valid criticism.
You still got the wiki though.

LoC is just convenient, you can easily pop a bullhead. It's the cherry on top, not what makes PSI op.

No wiki or manual will help you gauge build strength against each other. You need them to make a build, but you won't figure out just how comparatively powerful your build will be.

 

[Sweeper]

No wiki or manual will help you gauge build strength against each other.

It's not supposed to. On a first playthrough you're simply supposed to theorycraft something that you think will be powerful.
How it compares to other builds comes after spending dozens or even hundreds of hours on the game.

You need them to make a build, but you won't figure out just how comparatively powerful your build will be.

Now we're approaching munchkinism. I'm not opposed to it, but if you want to be a munchkin right off the bat just look up a build guide. The two alternative to this I see is making the various builds (near) perfectly balanced in comparison to one another, or making the game so easy anything can work. We've seen the former in Pillars of Eternity, and it was boring. Most other RPGs nowadays go the latter route, and they're even more boring.

We see two fucking RPGs that don't follow the norm in this regard and the chorus of shriekers start their wailing with

This game ain't like all the others

I fucking need everything to work, I hate spending time to figure shit out

I'm like good. Right up my alley.