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KickStarter ATOM RPG - Wasteland Soviet style! - now with Dead City update

Discussion in 'General RPG Discussion' started by Atomboy, Oct 1, 2016.

?

Will you back?

Poll closed Nov 28, 2017.
  1. I will consider it!

    39 vote(s)
    54.9%
  2. No! I would never!..

    9 vote(s)
    12.7%
  3. kingcomrade

    23 vote(s)
    32.4%
  1. Politician Lurker King

    Politician
    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2016
    Messages:
    1,852
    The strength of the game is in the side quests, especially the ones that are in chains, like the thief quests in the factory. The main quest... most people forget what is after a few hours of gameplay.

    It's negativity bias. We are easily impressed by fuck ups. 10% is a lot actually. Weapons that never jam feel incredible in comparison.

    Since we are talking about it, does luck affect jam chances and critical hit chances? Anyone tried a character with 10 in luck?
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2019
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  2. RK47 collides like two planets pulled by gravity Patron

    RK47
    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2006
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    Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
    Well, shouldn't have robbed caravans...

    Show Spoiler

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Too bad dual super stimpack is OP

    :mlady:


    IMO they should just lock me out of Krasno / Peregon and give me one last chance to redeem myself. At least that would've made me care more than just running like hell constantly.

    e.g:
    If I don't take out a bandit lord after 7 days, they'll simply hunt me down with a bigger squad or something.
     
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  3. Commissar Draco KKKodex WCDS Commissar Patron

    Commissar Draco
    Joined:
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    Location:
    Привислинский край
    Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Divinity: Original Sin 2
    There is perk to make it not jam and another one reducing ap cost for pistols...you craft two of those and clean the place eastern style. Second best weapon for begging at least good old :obviously: Tzarist army Nagant revolver.
     
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  4. Politician Lurker King

    Politician
    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2016
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    Maybe a silly question: Is Dragunov the best sniper rifle?
     
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  5. murloc_gypsy Arbiter

    murloc_gypsy
    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2014
    Messages:
    318
    Show Spoiler
    Loved the Factory questline. That one provided the only really satisfying slide for me: I chose to have Katya as the leader with backing from Dan. It showed a slide of pretty green Otradonye, saying the village becomes prosperous. Glory to the common working man!
     
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  6. Politician Lurker King

    Politician
    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2016
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    1,852
    So the best rifle is R700M!
     
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  7. Van-d-all Learned

    Van-d-all
    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2017
    Messages:
    475
    Location:
    Silesia Superior
    Crit chances yes. There's also a bug? that pops Crit Chance up if you take Cursed Sniper with 1-2 LCK.
     
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  8. Gaius maximus Arbiter

    Gaius maximus
    Joined:
    May 25, 2015
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    Halls of Moria
    So rk47 melee is viable in normal with its 2 per lvl ability points
     
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  9. RK47 collides like two planets pulled by gravity Patron

    RK47
    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2006
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    27,219
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    Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
    Already said it before. And I'll say it again. Don't ever rely solely on melee for combat. Some shit are just not meant to trade blows with.
    Melee is only reliable when you're clearing trash like tiny bugs and rats that cannot knock you down or burst you.
    So let's drop this idea of being 'pure melee', such a thing is silly.

    Already outlined that you need defensive perks first, Knockdown resist, Oak Skin, Think like the Enemy for DT enchancements. Assuming you're not playing 'smoke the elevator guy' style that means you have to slowly build up your DR & DT from scraps. Since the melee damage bonus is per attack, that means the more strike you can do, the more bonus damage you deal. This is especially true when you use the Shiv (2AP) to deal 5 strikes per turn. Let's say your bonus damage is +4 that's 5 x 4 = 20 bonus compared to a wooden club that costs 4 AP per swing.

    It is for the above reason why I can't get that excited over high AP melee weapons, no matter how awesome they sound. The system needs a revamp. It's just not rewarding to go for melee build. You will not be that unkillable fighting machine. More like a guy who jams Superstim needles constantly. My lone wolf run was hopeless when I started to get hunted for robbing caravans. I spent 99% of my time equipped with super stim on each hand and just running away. Do not underestimate your enemy as melee! I had one 'easy' encounter with doomsday cult that nearly ended with death because they 'allah akbar'd' right on my face. That's right. They blew up. 36 damage. Left with 3 HP. One cultist left with a zip gun. I took no chances and just ran out of the map.

    Until they patch something new to balance things out, Close combat purist will not survive long.
     
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  10. Politician Lurker King

    Politician
    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2016
    Messages:
    1,852
    Well, to be honest, it would be hopeless either way because you were underleveled to fight these guys. The result would be the same with guns. But yeah, meele sucks. They need new perks and improvements yesterday.
     
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  11. Atomboy Atom Team Developer

    Atomboy
    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2016
    Messages:
    398
    It's not!

    Basically what happened there was the result of removing level scaling. It means that every level has a chance to meet such a crew especially if he walks in a certain direction, like far east from Otradnoye or south east, or north. But on levels 1-3 they should have a pretty low encounter %. Like 5%-10%! But on the bright side you might encounter a caravan with end-game goods with the same %!
    Well that's retarded! I'll look through the files. It should not be this way. The VSS is scoped, the AS VAL is not.
    Well... Basically what the new combat will be is old combat, with a bit of better pathing, and also every enemy will have a chance to be crippled in some way prior to the battle. Like have one eye or something. So nowadays you can meet 5 mercenaries, let's say. But now you'll get to meet 5 mercenaries one of which doesn't have a hand (thus only uses pistols even if level % tells him to use a heavy machinegun) and the other has one eye (-30% to hit) and 3 normal mercenaries. That is going to be of great help to the casual players and those who are unlucky enough to meet a high tier crew early on. Other addit
    Hi! The Peregon slide miiiight have been a bug. Or not. I'll look into it.
     
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  12. krilcebre Novice

    krilcebre
    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2018
    Messages:
    86
    Crippled mercenaries aside, what are you doing to balance pistols and melee. Currently they are super underpowered and not useful in any way or form after level 10 or so, since by then we are able to get some decent ARs or rifles. I mean most of the guns burst shots cost the same as a pistol aimed shot (sometimes even a normal shot), which is terrible since burst is 3 bullets at least, each of those dealing more damage than a single pistol bullet (meaning more than 3x damage for the same AP cost, while maintaining bigger distance and not having any defense penalty, since shields are crappy). Not to mention the problem of not being able to cover the distance for melee, lack of defense, and so on. After trying out multiple builds, the only once i found viable are the ones either focusing on ars or rifles and shotguns. Smgs are poor man's ARs, requiring to be much closer and doing lower damage, while having the same AP cost.
     
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  13. Atomboy Atom Team Developer

    Atomboy
    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2016
    Messages:
    398
    Well, we're adding the recipes for new zip guns, including the 2AP pistol, as well us around 4 new fist weapons. Are you sure you are using the right skills from the skill tree? We're having a large inside debate around melee. I have no problem using it until the late game, for example, but some die very quickly. There might be some additions to the melee skillset.
     
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  14. Yaar Podshipnik Arcane Patron

    Yaar Podshipnik
    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2011
    Messages:
    1,931
    Codex 2012 Codex 2013 Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Codex USB, 2014 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech Bubbles In Memoria A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    Atomboy Just finished the game. ATOM RPG is a real gem, if a bit rough at the edges. I feel that the two "additional" maps could use some more content though. I played in Russian, quite liked the writing. Was a bit disappointed that I got no slides for Caravansarai. I'm also curious whether KRZ has a happier ending than
    Show Spoiler
    withering due to being complacent in its safety (mushroom ending was downright scary)
     
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  15. Atomboy Atom Team Developer

    Atomboy
    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2016
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    Thanks, man! We'll polish the hell out of it yet. After the balance fixes we'll start the dlc work. Also yeah, it does have a kind of a happy ending :D
     
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  16. krilcebre Novice

    krilcebre
    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2018
    Messages:
    86
    Game is fucking awesome, I'm just trying fulfill my wish of playing melee only brute while being able to finish a game, without having to abuse speechcraft. :D

    Atomboy, my suggestion for melee and pistol balance is that you should actually change shield mechanics. Shields should work like dodge, as in you have a chance to block 100% damage (it's a shield after all). While dodge is tied to dexterity, shield block chance should be tied with strength or endurance, or even both, along with that perk you already have. Change the second perk in melee tree to increased chance to block while adjusted to someone, be it friend or enemy, or for spent APs like it already works, since dodge is currently useless against gun wielding enemies, meaning you have a useless perk, and it's overridden by armor which you have to wear anyway. That way you get to be more defensive when using pistols and melee, which is balanced by the fact that they have lower offensive power anyway. So you are trading good offense and carrying capacity for good defense. I think that's a fair trade, and it's not too deep into perk trees, so you can get them with both pistols and melee builds.
     
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  17. Atomboy Atom Team Developer

    Atomboy
    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2016
    Messages:
    398
    I think what you wrote is kind of a good idea, so I'm gonna copypaste it to the guy who made shields, hoping he will make sense out of it. I just lose brain cells when I think about shield mechanics. Can't seem to use them with my melee build without making it worse unless I buy 3400 shield skills, so early skills might solve the problem of shields somewhat hopefully. What I can add though is that dodge will now actually work against shooters some times! Actually yeah, doing stuff with shields might do the trick. I'll start up the conversation.
     
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  18. Atomboy Atom Team Developer

    Atomboy
    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2016
    Messages:
    398
    Okay, so how would you guys feel if that one perk that gives +2 hp regeneration when you're at 50% health would give you 5% DR and +25% to HtH attacks (both with knuckles and melee)? It's pretty much useless as it is, and it's in the melee branch of the tree. Be honest!

    Also, I got into the shield mechanics and found out that the best shield already has 99% chance of complete absorption if shots are fired from the front, so how about using up AP would add DR% instead of absorption chance?
     
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  19. RK47 collides like two planets pulled by gravity Patron

    RK47
    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2006
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    27,219
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    Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
    The First Melee ability , a generic +10 to both should be changed to 'Serbian Headstomp'.
    A stunned / knocked down enemy takes triple melee damage.

    For your HP upon losing 50% Health call it: 'Last stand'
    When an attack is supposed to kill you, you regain 50% HP and +2 AP, this only happens once per battle so this can be very OP for the already OP ranged attacker or a suicide TNT bomber. :smug:

    For good offensive, remember those annoying Bloodroots? Copy that shit. I would suggest replacing the 'Spend AP to get Dodge' with 'Crippling Strike'. Every melee strike you land removes 2 points of Dexterity from the target for one turn. This would stop those bursting bastards for sure with -3 AP in melee. Just stop giving your LMG guys DEX 10 to let this happen, yeah?

    I would also restructure your tree a bit since Monster Lore & Witcher seems to be connected to Rifles for no good reason. Put that thing elsewhere, somewhere neutral so people don't waste time getting +10 Rifle just to gain access. I'd take away the '+10 Survival' and replace it with Monster Lore instead.

    Someone suggesting pistol/melee & shield off hand is actually quite a nice idea. I always wonder how people wield shield while carrying a sniper rifle.

    If you want to be mean and more annoying to rifle users, add a DEX penalty to carrying a heavy rifle around.
    Big Rifle -2 DEX, the rest -1 DEX. That would actually make those sniper AI that loves to play peek-a-boo around tree less annoying. And some guns are of course light-weight (no penalty), and more expensive. Make it special!

    Scoped Rifles should also get like 95% to hit penalty at close range (0-5 tiles)
    Non scoped Rifles get 50% penalty
    Shotguns are the exception to this.
    To make the snipers less whiney, we give them something back: Rifle Butt, 5 AP, 1-5 damage as an alternate attack because we know they love to carry a super stim on the other hand.
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2019
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  20. Technomancer Educated

    Technomancer
    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2018
    Messages:
    60
    What is that?
     
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  21. RK47 collides like two planets pulled by gravity Patron

    RK47
    Joined:
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    Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
    Hand to Hand
     
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  22. Van-d-all Learned

    Van-d-all
    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2017
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    475
    Location:
    Silesia Superior
    Speaking of ability tree, I think all the +10 skill ones seem like a needless point sinks...
     
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  23. Gaius maximus Arbiter

    Gaius maximus
    Joined:
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    2,117
    Location:
    Halls of Moria
    Perks should not be linked but lvl based,still need more points per perk but not linked.
     
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  24. RK47 collides like two planets pulled by gravity Patron

    RK47
    Joined:
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    Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
    I somewhat agree with this.
    Like I've said before, taking Rifle on the way to Monster Lore (HP knowledge) and Witcher (Double damage vs Animal / Monsters) is worth it, but it makes people wonder what is the point of doing that.
    Likewise, taking 10 survival on the way to better grenade range and no jams on crafted pistols? Not very intuitive.
    In fact, if you just take all of the +10 skills away from the tree, no one would miss them.

    The current ability tree system restrains creativity in builds and makes a niche perk, even more unreachable. A lot of unarmed perks suffer from this.
     
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  25. jaydee2k Learned

    jaydee2k
    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2016
    Messages:
    385
    Where's the GOG version? I want to finally be able to buy this game.
     
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