Interview Brian Fargo on crowd-sourcing

[hiver]

yup. (i wasnt directly responding to you - but to that issue in general, that davaris wrote)

 

[kaizoku]

If the game is good, I have no problem with him doing another KS.
Although I would still prefer for him to invest his profit money, and leave the KS for the needy.

However, If W2 sucks I doubt he'll be able to pull it off again.

And remember kids, everytime a KS fails to deliver, science raises the bar on the requirements for future project funding.

 

[mindx2]

You are making the assumption, they haven't already reached most their market, using crowd funding. Additional sales may not be that great, because the majority of people that want this game, may have already pledged. This is not an EA mainstream targeted game, with a massive advertising budget, it is niche, so crowd funding may be the only significant income they get, even if the game is good.

Yeah, that's the worst case scenario for them. We get a good game and they get their wages for the next 2 years. After that, they come back to us to fund the development of their next game and the cycle repeats. I don't have a problem with this approach. Quite the contrary, I would prefer it this way.

That's how I see this as well. We fund (pre-pay/pre-order/whatever) the type of game we want and they get wages for a few years. I see it as a win/win situation. Plus, I like being able to get the physical rewards like CE boxes, posters, survival bags, patches, coins, soundtracks, etc. in today's soulless "digital only" world!!

 

[mikaelis]

We will have our time evaluating if the money we donated are spent properly. Afterall, if he is talking about coming back to Kickstarter, it will have to be AFTER, W2 is released. If it is utter shit, he won't get the money for the next project, or?

 

[Black]

Yes, WL2 is getting dev'ed at a kickass speed with no publisher interference and stuff. Kickass. It's gonna be awesome.

How awesome exactly?

 

[tuluse]

 

[Vault Dweller]

We will have our time evaluating if the money we donated are spent properly. Afterall, if he is talking about coming back to Kickstarter, it will have to be AFTER, W2 is released. If it is utter shit, he won't get the money for the next project, or?

Utter shit by what standards?

 

[skuphundaku]

We will have our time evaluating if the money we donated are spent properly. Afterall, if he is talking about coming back to Kickstarter, it will have to be AFTER, W2 is released. If it is utter shit, he won't get the money for the next project, or?

Utter shit by what standards?

By the standards of the Kickstarter donor community. It's not like there are ISO gaming standards that need to be met. Everybody has his/her own standards and holds different aspects of a game in high regard. Some are combatfags which don't give a shit about story and C&C means what armor to wear and what weapons to use, other are storyfags and they need to be deported to the BSN, others are C&Cfags... etc. Hell, some are so TB starved/obsessed that even the shittiest of shit games is a revelation if it has TB combat. Bottom line: there is no universal standard when it comes to games, so it will all come down to the preferences of the KS community.

 

[Vault Dweller]

We will have our time evaluating if the money we donated are spent properly. Afterall, if he is talking about coming back to Kickstarter, it will have to be AFTER, W2 is released. If it is utter shit, he won't get the money for the next project, or?

Utter shit by what standards?

By the standards of the Kickstarter donor community.

It was a rhetorical question. Why? Because:

Some are combatfags which don't give a shit about story and C&C means what armor to wear and what weapons to use, other are storyfags and they need to be deported to the BSN, others are C&Cfags... etc. Hell, some are so TB starved/obsessed that even the shittiest of shit games is a revelation if it has TB combat.

Precisely. Therefore, the game will not fail and the majority of the backers will be quite happy with it.

 

[mikaelis]

Makes sense.

I was thinking about the hypothetical situation, where combat is mediocre, story half-assed, game bug-ridden on the release and graphics/music is bland. Press-media will not save such a game with high marks, because there is no publisher behind. And Kickstarter community will remember.

But I highly doubt this could be the case for W2 or P:E. Though it could happens to smaller, unknown developers that overhyped their future products beyond their capabilities.

 

[mikaelis]

I know. They have what is needed there. They should be able to deliver. I was pulling off those "what if?" cases not directly at Inxile, but more towards any succesful kickstarter. The point was that if they fail the first time there won't be a second time, I hope.

 

[FrancoTAU]

Yeah I really dont envy Fargo, I mean the Eterninty guys might have it easier in comparison since if they do an updated and tweaked Baldur´s Gate with some Torrment dialogue and choices most gamers will be happy....but the Fallout crowd that funded Wasteland 2 are going to be might tought to please, all in all in it a great time to be an old skool RPG fan

What you're saying seems like it's true at first sniff, but a lot of guys here will stick up for shoddy games that made a good try at a C&C and/or TB combat type of game. If Wasteland 2 is merely as good as Fallout 2 with better graphics than half the people here will be singing it's praises. Not that Fallout 2 sucked, it was a good but flawed game based on a great game. If the same thing ends up being said about Wasteland 2 than I think it will be a success in many eyes.

 

[TwinkieGorilla]

If Wasteland 2 is merely as good as Fallout 2 with better graphics than half the people here will be singing it's praises.

Yes.

Not that Fallout 2 sucked

It sure didn't.

it was a good but flawed game based on a great game

Personally, I'd call it a great but flawed game based on a better game.

If the same thing ends up being said about Wasteland 2 than I think it will be a success in many eyes.

You kidding? I'd nearly sell my soul for such a game.

 

[FrancoTAU]

I was kind of trying to be objective with my last post, but I'd be thrilled with a Fallout 2 level of quality game. If they blow our minds with a new standard for which all cRPGs are too be judged than even better.

 

[St. Toxic]

Being objective means riding F2 for kodex kool kredz.

 

[Jarpie]

If Wasteland 2 sells 500 000 copies and they get 20 dollars per copy, they make 10 000 000 profit on Wasteland 2 since it was basicly pre-paid, and I don't think 500k in sales is impossible to pull with W2 unless it's a total failure.

For potential Wasteland 3 I can see them funding half of the budget through Kickstarter and half from the sales of W2.

 

[catfood]

If Wasteland 2 sells 500 000 copies and they get 20 dollars per copy, they make 10 000 000 profit on Wasteland 2 since it was basicly pre-paid, and I don't think 500k in sales is impossible to pull with W2 unless it's a total failure.

For potential Wasteland 3 I can see them funding half of the budget through Kickstarter and half from the sales of W2.

So what you're saying is the Wasteland 3 has the potential of being a first person cover shooter with full voice acting and a 5 hour long campaign?

 

[Jarpie]

If Wasteland 2 sells 500 000 copies and they get 20 dollars per copy, they make 10 000 000 profit on Wasteland 2 since it was basicly pre-paid, and I don't think 500k in sales is impossible to pull with W2 unless it's a total failure.

For potential Wasteland 3 I can see them funding half of the budget through Kickstarter and half from the sales of W2.

So what you're saying is the Wasteland 3 has the potential of being a first person cover shooter with full voice acting and a 5 hour long campaign?

I am? I don't think I wrote anything like that.

 

[catfood]

If Wasteland 2 sells 500 000 copies and they get 20 dollars per copy, they make 10 000 000 profit on Wasteland 2 since it was basicly pre-paid, and I don't think 500k in sales is impossible to pull with W2 unless it's a total failure.

For potential Wasteland 3 I can see them funding half of the budget through Kickstarter and half from the sales of W2.

So what you're saying is the Wasteland 3 has the potential of being a first person cover shooter with full voice acting and a 5 hour long campaign?

I am? I don't think I wrote anything like that.

Yeah, you're probably right. I assumed that 10 mil was enough to make a popamole shooter nowadays.

 

[Zeronet]

I'd assume any pitch he makes assuming Wasteland 2 makes a few million, would be along the lines of "We can fund the next game ourselves, but if you chip in and help us raise X amount of dollars, we can make the game even bigger and add A, B and C to the game". It'd basically be a kickstarter that starts at a stretch goal of sorts. You'd basically put up a series of goals, with the kickstarter funding needing to hit the first goal to get funded, so maybe 250,000 for the first goal and then going up by 100,000 or something.

If you think about it, it's not that different to pledging to a project that's already funded in order to meet the extra goals.

 

[Sitra Achara]

I'd assume any pitch he makes assuming Wasteland 2 makes a few million, would be along the lines of "We can fund the next game ourselves, but if you chip in and help us raise X amount of dollars, we can make the game even bigger and add A, B and C to the game". It'd basically be a kickstarter that starts at a stretch goal of sorts. You'd basically put up a series of goals, with the kickstarter funding needing to hit the first goal to get funded, so maybe 250,000 for the first goal and then going up by 100,000 or something.

If you think about it, it's not that different to pledging to a project that's already funded in order to meet the extra goals.

My bet - 1$ starting goal ("yeah we can fund the game, now it's up to YOU! to see how far we can take it")

 

[crafthack]

I think Fargo is just keeping WL2 fresh in the minds of gamers by dropping something to the press every few weeks, until the game comes out. The game has no marketing budget beyond the internet hype machine spread by fans/websites, so he's using that. Traditional publishers/developers do this too, they keep dropping breadcrumbs all the way to launch day, there's nothing inherently wrong with it because that's how consumers behave.

 

[l3loodAngel]

I just wish that Fargo would shut up and make the game he was paid to make. The PR bullshit after you have the money is retarded. Also, the more he speaks that he cares the more he sounds like a grifter to me.

 

[Monocause]

I just wish that Fargo would shut up and make the game he was paid to make. The PR bullshit after you have the money is retarded. Also, the more he speaks that he cares the more he sounds like a grifter to me.

Why do *you* care about the "retarded PR bullshit"? I don't even read what he says, I just see the headlines, see that no real news are available yet and ignore them. On the other hand it's perfectly fine for me that Fargo, as the project's frontman, tries to keep folks interested in the game and build up some modest hype.

Judging from many posts made on the 'Dex about WL2 it seems to me that it's easy to forget that KS donors aren't the game's only recipients and the game will be sold in the usual channels as well, meaning that it's obviously important for the devs to keep the ball spinning and generate/maintain interest through whatever means are available at hand.

Come to think of it, that's kinda a threat of the kickstarter model when it comes to such endeavours as video games. After all, when people fund your development they are already paying customers so one might imagine that at some point a kickstarter project might be tempted to make the game actually tailored for different groups to increase profit.

An even bigger threat would be if the publishers could get their grubby fingers on the kickstarter pie (like they already tried with Obsidian IIRC). If a publisher was the silent overlord of a KS project you can be sure as fuck that the people who've already paid through donations would be screwed due to the publisher wanting to maximise sales.

 

[l3loodAngel]

1. Why do *you* care about the "retarded PR bullshit"? I don't even read what he says, I just see the headlines, see that no real news are available yet and ignore them. On the other hand it's perfectly fine for me that Fargo, as the project's frontman, tries to keep folks interested in the game and build up some modest hype.

2. Judging from many posts made on the 'Dex about WL2 it seems to me that it's easy to forget that KS donors aren't the game's only recipients and the game will be sold in the usual channels as well, meaning that it's obviously important for the devs to keep the ball spinning and generate/maintain interest through whatever means are available at hand.

3. Come to think of it, that's kinda a threat of the kickstarter model when it comes to such endeavours as video games. After all, when people fund your development they are already paying customers so one might imagine that at some point a kickstarter project might be tempted to make the game actually tailored for different groups to increase profit.

1. Don't use things like shit I ignore and keep people interested in same paragraph if you want to be taken seriously.

2. The difference from KS is that you actually have to have a product to sell and Fargo is a bit lacking in that department. The drowning boy dilemma, the WL2 color of choice poll that ended up having all the colors in the game. I am starting to think the C&C in the game will be to eat a meat loaf or veggie salad.

3. To even attract other crowd you would have to show something, so at this point it's safe to say that the integrity is not compromised.