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Did Souls "no reload" spoiled other games for you?

Deathsquid

Learned
Joined
Jan 18, 2018
Messages
382
Serious answer: controller has TWO non binary input sticks. K+M has only mouse for non binary input. Which means for games of this nature they need to either remove aiming or camera control for the user making the other automated. Controllers can have you control both camera and aim at the same time without a problem.
But it works in DS3 all of a sudden, what gives?
 

SkiNNyBane

Liturgist
Patron
Joined
Dec 13, 2017
Messages
1,090
Location
NY
Grab the Codex by the pussy
Your reply is too tryhard for me bruv.

But real talk your way overreacting. I played ds1/2 on fucking ancient pc and by ancient i mean hamster wheel cooling. It ran fine. I understand you could have individual problems with your particular cpu/windows version/graphics card but most people don't. I never played ds1 without a controller but ffs just get controller stop bitching. DS2 I played M&K just fine with autohotkey fix 100s of hours.

Also yea it is inexcusable behavior for companies to do ports without proper fixes but welcome to capitalism where its all about making $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ no surprise here.
 
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SkiNNyBane

Liturgist
Patron
Joined
Dec 13, 2017
Messages
1,090
Location
NY
Grab the Codex by the pussy
Serious answer: controller has TWO non binary input sticks. K+M has only mouse for non binary input. Which means for games of this nature they need to either remove aiming or camera control for the user making the other automated. Controllers can have you control both camera and aim at the same time without a problem.
But it works in DS3 all of a sudden, what gives?

The game was designed with pc in mind from getgo.
 

Harpsichord

Arcane
Joined
Dec 29, 2011
Messages
1,822
You don't know anything about losing progress until you've played this:
2000426-mordor_box.jpg
 

Deathsquid

Learned
Joined
Jan 18, 2018
Messages
382
Serious answer: controller has TWO non binary input sticks. K+M has only mouse for non binary input. Which means for games of this nature they need to either remove aiming or camera control for the user making the other automated. Controllers can have you control both camera and aim at the same time without a problem.
But it works in DS3 all of a sudden, what gives?

The game was designed with pc in mind from getgo.
Yes, but see, here's the thing: The game still plays on controller with analog sticks as well. So it's not so much the game being designed around being a game for a gamepad as much as they couldn't (time? effort? budget? engine? hell if I know) untangle the controller scheme and properly rebind it for PC.

The other cardinal sin of the DS1 port was it being impossible to rebind keys, and yes, I know there was a fan patch that fixes that, but seriously, a fan needs to fix a game for free for a company that sells this for money? Codex shits on Bethesda for it, but From is immune? I think not. And the fan kinda sorta fixed it too! So probably they were capable of that as well. I guess. Maybe. Unless that fan is a computer god or something but then maybe they should hire him.

Still, I guess it's cool enough they released DS1 on the PC, it wasn't really planned so I guess the budget was close to zero for it. Fine. Fine! But why did they do such a shit job with DS2? They already knew they have a player base on PC. Was it a case of "Fuck it, they'll lap it up anyway, look at 'em defending us everywhere"? Maybe it was, I don't know. All I know is that first two parts have horribad input ports and I guess I kinda find it a bit inexcusable.

Anyway, this is neither here nor there, in your world it'll always remain designed for a gamepad while in my world it'll be a lazy port job, I see your point, hope you can see mine as well.
 

lukaszek

the determinator
Patron
Joined
Jan 15, 2015
Messages
12,621
deterministic system > RNG
 
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fantadomat

Arcane
Edgy Vatnik Wumao
Joined
Jun 2, 2017
Messages
37,087
Location
Bulgaria
Fuck off you whiny console cunt!
IF a shitty jap game like souls managed to spoil the rest the games for you,then you never liked games in first place.
 

Master

Arbiter
Joined
Oct 19, 2016
Messages
1,160
Shitty game. Once I saw you can't even skip the intro, I uninstalled that POS immediately
:brodex:
 

Gerrard

Arcane
Joined
Nov 5, 2007
Messages
11,927
As for Nier fans, they're not even a thing. The game definitely has a fanbase and you can trigger some Nietzsche-quoting keyboard philosophers by saying the game's story is paced badly, but I've never seen Nier fans spam the shit out of some game's board or a Twitch stream's chat about how game X is not like Nier and is thus inferior and how Nier is God's gift to man.
Tell that to all the people who thought Automata was a GOTY.
 

Silva

Arcane
Joined
Jul 17, 2005
Messages
4,778
Location
Rio de Janeiro, Brasil
On a serious note, I find it reasonable that a lot of people (me included) find Souls series "no reload" characteristic remarkable, if one considers that's a pretty rare quality in AAA games, specially RPGs, since a long time, AND completely absent from the cornerstones of the genre from the 90s up to now (PS:Torment, Fallouts, Darklands, Ultimas, Gothics, etc). The fact it made such an impact on the industry as to spawn a bunch of clones and inspirations is proof of its value, even if some crop of games 40 years ago did something similar. I don't see what the fuss is about with the local neckbeards.

Btw, what are some representatives of those 80s games that are playable nowadays? I tried Wizardry 8 once but found it too linear and kinda gonzo. As I bought it together with Arcanum at the time, I dropped it fairly quickly. Is there some SNES version or something that makes the interface usable and gfx minimally pretty? Or at least something on par with Might & Magic 6/7 gfx-wise ?
 
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Suicidal

Arcane
Joined
Apr 29, 2007
Messages
2,208
As for Nier fans, they're not even a thing. The game definitely has a fanbase and you can trigger some Nietzsche-quoting keyboard philosophers by saying the game's story is paced badly, but I've never seen Nier fans spam the shit out of some game's board or a Twitch stream's chat about how game X is not like Nier and is thus inferior and how Nier is God's gift to man.
Tell that to all the people who thought Automata was a GOTY.

Well as I said, they do exist, and they have the right to think whatever they want, but I've never seen a forum thread or comment section to some video about a game being invaded by Nier fanboys bitching how the game being displayed is shit and cannot match the genius of Nier, never seen any game with robots being compared with Nier or called a Nier ripoff. I don't think I've ever caught myself thinking "man, these Nier fanboys should shut the fuck up".
 

RoSoDude

Arcane
Joined
Oct 1, 2016
Messages
727
Just because I feel the need to shill Methanhydrat's excellent mod at every opportunity and also advocate the superior M+KB control method for Dark Souls, here's the relevant part of my post on the Dark Souls Discussion thread:

Not that anyone cares, but I just did my first playthrough of Dark Souls with the help of the Dark Souls Input Customizer It has a number of nifty features, chief among them being the implementation of proper mouse+keyboard controls by way of the (included) mouselook mod.

It's funny -- I read through the first page of this very thread, and there were a number of people espousing the typical view that M+KB just makes no sense for Dark Souls, game isn't designed for it, etc etc. That's obviously true of the PC port, which featured perhaps the worst version of mouselook I've ever experienced (and the original DSMfix unfortunately wasn't much better, since interpolating mouse movement as joystick input leads to negative mouse acceleration) but it isn't true of the actual game design. I'd even go as far as to say that using proper M+KB almost amounts to cheating, as it has several obvious benefits:
  • Direct camera input allows for improved navigation especially on precarious cliffs and ledges, as well as improved versatility in combat -- locking onto enemies is now purely optional, as circlestrafing and dodging can be done effectively if not better with ordinary movement. Aiming a bow is now effortless as well.
  • No need to claw grip a controller or some other such nonsense to perform any action -- I can attack, aim, dodge, cycle through equipment, and so on without ever moving my hands from their resting position
  • Dedicated inputs for kick/dash/jump/leap attack make every option easily accessible in combat
There is only one legitimate drawback, which is that you only have 8-way movement on WASD. I can see why a lot of people might be more comfortable with a gamepad, but that's not an actual advantage, that's just personal preference. As someone far more used to M+KB, I found the game played flawlessly with that control scheme, no worse than any other 3D action game. Pretty much exactly what JarlFrank said years ago

The original PC port is unforgivably garbage (and I was so butthurt about the default M+KB "support" that I gave up on the game for years after two attempts playing on gamepad), but that shouldn't dissuade anyone with half a brain capable of installing fan patches from getting it on sale and giving it a go. Checkpoint saving is pure :incline:, as with much of the rest of the game's hardcore design. The game has some rough edges that aren't purely technical, but it's still one of the best games I've ever played. This is as a person who barely gave a damn about the lore -- its gameplay and level design are what shine to me. The setting and worldbuilding that people praise endlessly are secondary.
 
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yyuse

Literate
Joined
Feb 5, 2018
Messages
21
Location
oregon
yes but in reverse, and of my own making.

used to quicksave in doom a lot. now i quicksave too little. kind of ruined the game for me.
 

RoSoDude

Arcane
Joined
Oct 1, 2016
Messages
727
yes but in reverse, and of my own making.

used to quicksave in doom a lot. now i quicksave too little. kind of ruined the game for me.

???

Doom is way better when played with only the autosaves at the beginning of the levels. Even and especially on the higher difficulties. Makes resource management meaningful and keeps every enemy encounter tense and weighty. I just went through all of Doom 1 on Ultra-Violence like this only a month ago.
 

yyuse

Literate
Joined
Feb 5, 2018
Messages
21
Location
oregon
oh of course, you can play original doom like that fine, no problems

but when it comes to much harder mods released more recently... you can run into a lot of problems. like with epic 2
 

Lyric Suite

Converting to Islam
Joined
Mar 23, 2006
Messages
56,164
You can consciously play any game you want in iron man mode, but some games were designed with save scumming in mind and that can be an issue.
 

DragoFireheart

all caps, rainbow colors, SOMETHING.
Joined
Jun 16, 2007
Messages
23,731
You can consciously play any game you want in iron man mode, but some games were designed with save scumming in mind and that can be an issue.

As a rule I don't do irom man mode because I'm paranoid about power outages.

Anyways:

The reason souls games are good is because they don't allow save scumming, are hard, and are fair (usually).

Games that are too easy are boring and are not fun.

Games that are too hard and are not fair about the challenge are frustrating and are not fun.
Ex: challenges outside human limits, heavily luck based, poor design, etc.
 

GrainWetski

Arcane
Joined
Oct 17, 2012
Messages
5,080
Serious answer: controller has TWO non binary input sticks. K+M has only mouse for non binary input. Which means for games of this nature they need to either remove aiming or camera control for the user making the other automated. Controllers can have you control both camera and aim at the same time without a problem.
What?
 

SkiNNyBane

Liturgist
Patron
Joined
Dec 13, 2017
Messages
1,090
Location
NY
Grab the Codex by the pussy
Serious answer: controller has TWO non binary input sticks. K+M has only mouse for non binary input. Which means for games of this nature they need to either remove aiming or camera control for the user making the other automated. Controllers can have you control both camera and aim at the same time without a problem.
What?

Binary = 0 or 1 = keyboard press.

Modern controller has two ways to give gradual input as in states between on/off with two sticks. Mouse does it differently by you controlling speed with your hand. Keyboard has no way to control speed or anything of that nature. You either press key or don't.
 

Max Stats

Liturgist
Joined
Nov 26, 2016
Messages
1,091
No, it didn't spoil me, it led me to work around the limitiations by copying the save to USB so it would't be autosaved over and i could reload by copying it back from USB whenever I wanted. Most useful for not wasting resources in boss fights if you need to redo it.
 

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