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Do you prefer loot heavy RPGs?

Discussion in 'General RPG Discussion' started by Safav Hamon, Aug 9, 2018.

?

Do you prefer loot heavy rpgs?

  1. Yes

    26.5%
  2. No

    73.5%
  1. Shadenuat Arcane

    Shadenuat
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    - make enemies drop 1000 used swords
    - do not make anyone buy them, thus making 1000 swords useless
    why add 1000 swords of loot to begin with? :shittydog:

    To answer the question why someone would buy: to sell them later at the fair to a merchant who was buying weapons for some lord's military campaign, for example.

    If weapons & armor are good, to really sell well; or you can scrap gold parts of expensive arms and weapons and take that gold.

    If you looted 50 halberds, sell them to traveling jew marketender who probably is following an army with his whores and booze for some of that booze. He then sells them to a dude arming a squad of mercenaries into new campaign/crusade on better terms. Profit.

    So sure, you won't sell all that anywhere and at any time, but looting was always a thing.

    And in a setting where adventurers are constantly fighting monsters?

    That would be a whole different economy, since the amount of 1st level adventurers entering the game and dying terribly to unlucky crits should be incredibly big, having 1000 swords to sell to them is great idea. :shittydog: then they all die, other adventurers loot dead adventurers, sell you swords back, you re-sell them, infinite money :shittydog::shittydog:

    You want realism and immersion?
    Then average bandit group should drop 1 old sword, 1 pair of boots (changed wearers 7 times) and a 0.03% Korean chance of a 1 gold tooth.
    And after that if you get more shit, your average adventuring party should be holding barony at that point, having their own levies; not killing rats in sewers.

    Funny enough, Witcher was one series of games which could have avoided loot problem as you mostly fight monsters... and ended with Geralt killing hundreds of bandits who all drop swords and plate armor, lmao.
     
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2018
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  2. Riddler Augur Patron

    Riddler
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    Sure bro


    Learn how to read.

    Your claim was that you couldn't do a loot-heavy campaign in DnD and then started talking about weapons. I responded to your primary claim, not your secondary example.
     
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  3. Great Deceiver Arcane

    Great Deceiver
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    The games with the best loot were, IMO, Diablo 1, Icewind Dale (not HoW) and Might and Magic 2.

    Might and Magic 6 also had some neat artifacts that were huge power spikes.

    These days, I mostly don't care about minor stat boosts and itemization that is incremental. It just makes me want to stop playing - which is, in fact, what I do with most games.

    Items should be meaningful and scarce. It's a hard thing to balance. Most games seem to have gone down the full OCD rabbit hole of inundating players with 99% garbage. I don't feel like playing shit janitor most of the time.
     
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  4. Sigourn Arcane Village Idiot

    Sigourn
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    I prefer RPGs with few, but good items I have an use for besides "sell for cash".

    Vagrant Story was good in that you didn't have shops to sell items to (nor a currency to speak of), so you only looted that which you found useful, and you were never actually swimming in shit.
     
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  5. Cael Ask me about Pathfinder Dumbfuck Edgy

    Cael
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    Wrong.

    You brought up various types of special effects, which I said is impossible to achieve using the wealth-by-level table of 3.x:
    In fact, some of the stuff you threw out do not even have rules for in the 3.x system, which means you are throwing out the wealth-by-level table entirely.

    I can, however, see where you are coming from. If you want to play Diablo on paper, try 4th Ed.
     
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  6. Ranarama Learned

    Ranarama
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    Bigger numbers isn't really that interesting.
     
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  7. Riddler Augur Patron

    Riddler
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    I'm starting to see how you earned that dumbfuck tag.. You could at least ghost-edit your post to make that backtracking a bit more believeable.
     
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  8. Darth Canoli Learned

    Darth Canoli
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    Exactly my thought and as someone else said it's also about how easy it is to manage inventory, infinite loot with 5 inventory spots is quite dumb, if you have enough space and the inventory is made easy to manage, there's no problem at all.

    Still, useless junk is useless, i don't mind a few useless items just to confuse hoarders (like myself) but if half or even 90% (it happens) of the loot is useless and isn't even worth selling, then, we have a problem.

    So, the best loot system is unlimited loot inventory, limited junk and auto-loot after battle with a screen showing the loot after a battle, Wizardry 8 like.
    Well, actually, except for having to hoard heavy stones to throw at your ennemies, Wiz 8 loot system is one of the best i've experienced.
     
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2018
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  9. Tiospo Novice

    Tiospo
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    I just finished Wizardry 8 and thought could try to start another playthrough since the charm seems to manage to hold. I was just let down by the very easy difficulty of the end game.
     
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  10. Cael Ask me about Pathfinder Dumbfuck Edgy

    Cael
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    Yeah, I thought as much. No real argument, so hides behind shillarytron's revenge. You are a joke.
     
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  11. Darth Canoli Learned

    Darth Canoli
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    Yeah, that's a common problem, careful if you replay it with mods, some of them makes the game even easier, just use the speed mods, if you didn't already, to speed up the battles.

    The problem with playing Wizardry 8 is once you did, you can't discover it anymore, it's over and you know there's no wizardry 9 and 10 coming.
     
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  12. steel legion Novice

    steel legion
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    Yeah man, i love it when i find a weapon that looks exact the same but it is stronger cause of it's level or colour.
     
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  13. mondblut Arcane

    mondblut
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    When I see an enemy wielding a weapon or flashing a piece of armor in battle, I expect to find it on his dead body, period. Anything less than that is for sawyerite balancecucks.
     
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  14. M. AQVILA Cipher

    M. AQVILA
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    I don't care whether it's loot heavy or not as long as it has unique and interesting loot. Also if I fight an enemy with a cool sword then I expect to be able to loot it and use it myself.

    I'm also highly opposed to infinite inventory (stash) like in PoE, the old games were far better.

    Edit: Basically I favor the old DnD CRPGs like Baldur's Gate, when you loot a soldier you find what a soldier is usually equipped with ie. sword, chainmail, etc. And when you loot the hoard of a Dragon I expect unique items and one or two legendary items.
    No +5% damage shit by the way. I hate that. I like creativity not balancetardism.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2018
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  15. Micormic Augur

    Micormic
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    Depends if it's worthwhile and not a picking up garbage to pawn simulator.
     
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  16. someone else Arcane

    someone else
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    Poor UI is a factor.
    Playing Dead State and I'm clicking on 50 containers & bodies per map to loot.
    Also moving stuff to the car or container near the exit if there is not enough space to take all in one trip.
    The game does not have a move all items to container so I have to click one item at a time.
    Then have to deposit one at a time again at the base for non-resource items.
    Then take items from container again after I came back from base.

    :rage:
     
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  17. DraQ Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    DraQ
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    Coincidentally 99% of everything is shit.
    Your point?

    That shit is shit? Well, you haven't exactly discovered America here.

    They hardly just prevent looting garbage tier trash and for just that a combination of some of them should be perfectly sufficient. Nevertheless having all or most of them is good, because they are good mechanics reinforcing good gameplay:
    • Limited inventory limits waste of time from excessive inventory management and puts bounds on player's available resources at any time.
    • Good economy that can meaningfully react to player's shenanigans mitigates any economical exploits that might be discovered
    • Dropped item cleanup helps memory management and prevents save bloat and late game stability issues
    • Stat inflation in general is shitty, leading to shitty combat, severe railroading and lack of meaningful relations between gameplay mechanics and gameplay presentation
    • Costs and other forms of resource sinks help control resource accummulation and prevent trivial and pathological gameplay cycles - in particular most forms of farming
    Surprise! Different mechanics tend to interact and you actually need to consider that when trying to design a game. You can't just throw a bunch of random shit together and loudly proclaim "I ARE TEH GAYM DESIGNER! I MAEK GAYMPLAY MECHANICS FOR TEH RPG GAYMES!!!1".

    Don't want to think? Tough fucking luck - even digging ditches (which I would recommend as a more reasonable alternative should you ever consider getting into game design) requires some rudimentary understanding - for example you need to know which end of the shovel goes into the ground.

    See the first point above.

    Can you read?

    How is it relevant?
    Stuff generally doesn't exist until someone decides to make it. This has no bearing whether the idea is good or bad. If all good ideas were obvious and readily implemented we would have all the nice things - which we don't.

    Butthurt detected.


    No, you simpleton. Cause muh consistency.
    The guy has sword, so he can:
    • hit people and other things with his sword.
    • damage or break his sword or have it damaged or broken
    • have his sword noticed by an outside observer who can then plan accordingly
    • have his sword bought if he is willing to part with it
    • have his sword stolen even if he does not
    • have his sword looted if he is dead or incapacitated
    It shouldn't matter whether this guy is a PC or NPC, the system should not care.
    Presentation should be consistent with mechanics and mechanics should be consistent with itself.

    Similarly, if a game features doors, I will expect to be able to open and enter them, If a game features climbing I will expect everything that looks reasonably climbable to be climbable, If a game features containers I will expect all the containers to be searchable. If the game is any good it should not resort to highlighting or other UI mechanics merely to tell player what they can and cannot frob.
    Similarly, if the game is any good it should not feature invisible walls across what looks like traversable terrain; if a game is any good and allows tactical preparation, it should not feature cutscenes nullifying it.

    Caveat (open)

    If a game features a more or less fixed protagonist (e.g. Witcher, most non-RPGs out there) it can disallow actions that make no sense for that protagonist - for example looting full plate off everyone and carting it to town, but for a typical pick your race/class/sex/background RPG this is a non-option. If you really want you might try to codify such mechanics on a chargen level, so that, for example a monk character won't be able to *take* anything they cannot use according to their vows, unless they switch class, but this will probably not work well and is definitely an extra (note: this still won't be a legitimate way to prevent wizards from using weapons and such, but this could be used to prevent characters from violating norms they feel bound by).
     
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  18. Cael Ask me about Pathfinder Dumbfuck Edgy

    Cael
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    Only games I know of that do this is Ultima 6, 7 and Underworld 1 and 2.
     
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  19. Background Character Learned

    Background Character
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    I like to thing I prefer "meaningful" loot, nothing turns me off more than finding a "magical" sword called "Quick sword of flames+2" then walking 5 feet and finding a "Resourceful mace of shredding+1"

    You can guess I don't play many hack'n'slash games and you would be right
     
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