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Epic vs Steam - the console war comes to PC

Discussion in 'General Gaming' started by LESS T_T, Dec 4, 2018.

  1. Black Angel Arcane

    Black Angel
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    :mlady:
     
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  2. Tehdagah Arcane

    Tehdagah
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    He's right.
     
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  3. Dickie Arcane

    Dickie
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    Dang, Griftlands would've been the perfect name for a game that went Epic exclusive with no refunds.
     
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  4. DalekFlay Arcane Patron

    DalekFlay
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    He's right that developers and publishers should want a bigger cut. However whether he's right that that outweighs the possible ill will of excluding Steam is another question. I have no answers, because despite the internet rage we really have no idea just how many people care THAT much. If it's a sizeable number though, you may end up losing more than you gain from the higher revenue split. Borderlands 3 and other "big" releases should give us more information.
     
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  5. Blaine Cis-Het Oppressor Patron

    Blaine
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    Grab the Codex by the pussy
    Reneging (AKA going back on your word) is never the right choice, unless the original circumstances have changed such that it's clearly necessary to do so—for example, if you've promised people Oreos, but in the interim Nabisco starts using poop in the Oreo batter.

    Reneging due to additional circumstances introduced after you've made your promises is disrespectful, unethical, and just plain faggy. Making promises to people in exchange for their donations and then reneging because someone bribed you to do elsewise, while arrogantly proclaiming you refuse to offer refunds no less, is solidly in reneging faggot territory.
     
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  6. Belegarsson Savant Patron

    Belegarsson
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  7. Jenkem Cipher Patron

    Jenkem
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    strange how "people" on twitter saying shit like "STEAM SHOULD LOWER THEIR PERCENTAGE" never mention Xbox or Sony, which has the same percentage.
     
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  8. Metro Arcane Beg Auditor

    Metro
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    Fuck that. If developers and publishers want more money maybe they should start making good games and profit via volume sales rather than percentages.
     
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  9. Drakron Arcane

    Drakron
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    I was expecting this when I noticed who was the publisher.

    I will say this whole situation will impact crowdfunding because people will look at a project and think if they arent going to sell to Epic or whoever comes with money and ignore the backers entirely, that backers just exist as a pitch for investers that I suppose many knew deep down that was true but this is hard to ignore because the way they act.

    I am however interested what happens when the other shoe drops because people have memories and its obvious that EGS isnt going to overtake Steam any time soon and what Steam response will be because eventually they do have to say "you cannot use us for marketing and forums for a game we arent allowed to sell" and then they will be reduced to the EGS ecosystem that is right now ... non-existing because there is no EGS community, I also wonder what happens not if but when Epic starts cutting their losses and stops these exclusive deals with these publishers now having to face backlash of having to sell their games on Steam and other platforms.

    The whole "its a business" ... well when people go to a doctor they dont expect to have their organs removed to be sold because the doctor needs to make money, there are limits and they are really walking that line.
     
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  10. Reinhardt Arcane

    Reinhardt
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    Lower percentage FROM WHAT? It's crowdfunded game. People already "bought" it for full price and more on kickstarter. Without steam cut.
     
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  11. SionIV Erudite Patron

    SionIV
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    It seems like most publishers/developers don't care about their reputation nowadays, and neither does The Epic Games Store.
     
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  12. Reinhardt Arcane

    Reinhardt
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    It seems like all those old japanese developers really needed big japanese boss to keep them in check and force them to make games. Every kickstarter from retired big japanese names ended in disaster.
     
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  13. Ismaul Arcane Patron

    Ismaul
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    Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
    Reputation with gamers? Like, who cares? Gamers are toxic, didn't you know?

    The store is not for gamers, it's for their money only. Little do they know that one comes with the other.
     
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  14. Hobo Elf Arcane

    Hobo Elf
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    Pretty weird watching Valve and Kickstarter let Epic ravage their customers' anuses like this, especially since this kind of inactivity is just going to hurt Kickstarter's own business. No one is going to want to crowdfund anything anymore at this rate f you can't be guaranteed at least some level of security.
     
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  15. V_K Arcane

    V_K
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    The way I see it, the complaints are just stupidly worded. The legal issue here is not the change of platform, but rather the refusal of refunds.
     
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  16. Silentstorm Educated

    Silentstorm
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    Valve is allowing it because, well, they don't own all the developers, they are allowed to say anything they want and then do anything they want, if they sell Steam keys and say the game is going on Steam before becoming Epic exclusive?

    Well, it's bad PR, but for the other guys, not Valve, they aren't stopping people from going to Epic because they are, in a way, giving everyone more freedom than Epic, they don't want any exclusive, the bad PR goes for everyone else, and the games will eventually come to Steam anyways.
     
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  17. Dexter Arcane

    Dexter
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    "Watching Valve let", "Valve is allowing".

    How is Valve even involved here? The game isn't even on their platform yet. The parties here are YS Net (developer), Deep Silver (publisher) and possibly KickStarter as store/platform facilitating this and the customers. What they're doing (promising one thing, then changing the deal without any form of redress) is pretty much illegal in most of the Western world. Backers need to man up, file official complaints with the respective agencies in the US/EU/Australia etc. and possibly file a Class Action/get a law firm to do it on their behalf.
     
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  18. cosmicray Educated

    cosmicray
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    I don't like how backing a game became synonymous to "pre-ordering". It never should have been. On the other hand, I would prefer developers giving projects for free. The initial asking price would have been bigger, but at least it would be seen as a proper patronage rather than a several years long pre-order.

    But either way, why the fuck is it that hard for them to simply offer steam keys to all backers? If the game was already "bought", why Epic gives a shit if backers got their game via Steam?
     
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  19. Cromwell Arcane

    Cromwell
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    because its not about money but user numbers. If I back on KS and then they bait and switch it and I end up on the Epic store its one more "sale" on epic, regardless if I didnt even want it on epic.
     
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  20. Hobo Elf Arcane

    Hobo Elf
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    Valve is involved in the whole Epic thing in general because their platform is being used as free ad space to hoodwink their userbase at the last minute.

    https://store.steampowered.com/app/878670/Shenmue_III/
     
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  21. Ismaul Arcane Patron

    Ismaul
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    Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
    Steam is not about to remove the ability for devs to put up a page before a game is released. That'd be bad for the store.

    They can't say, "if you're going to go with an Epic exclusive, you can't put a page up", Steam can't know in advance and enforce it. They also can't close pages when the exclusive is announced, because that would hurt their community waiting for the game on Steam, and hamper a future release on their platform.

    The same can be said for forums. Sure, others use Steam to exploit advertising and outsource their community, but if Steam removes those features for the games that go exclusive after the page is up and the forums have activity, then it's Steam users getting shafted by Steam. Steam can't block Epic / devs from fucking users, but it would be really bad if Steam started to take action that hurt its own users directly. It is morally better to suffer harm / not act to prevent it than to commit it directly.

    Anyways, for Steam, users coming to Steam for the Epic games ads or for their forums means those users are Steam users first. It's also free PR when Epic users must come to Steam for support. Plus, Steam has the moral high ground doing nothing.

    I don't forsee at thing changing in how Steam deals with this.
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2019
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  22. Infinitron I post news Patron

    Infinitron
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    Grab the Codex by the pussy Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    Yep: https://www.pcgamer.com/quite-a-few...e-surprisingly-coming-to-the-microsoft-store/

     
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  23. fantadomat Dumbfuck! Dumbfuck Edgy

    fantadomat
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    This is pretty illegal in most countries LoL,do hope they get their assess sued.
     
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  24. Ismaul Arcane Patron

    Ismaul
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    Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
    It'd be funny if Epic allowing their exclusives to be on the Microsoft Store just made MS a bigger player, rather than boost Epic.
     
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  25. Hobo Elf Arcane

    Hobo Elf
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    No real store is going to allow someone to advertise, for free, a product in their facility without the intention of selling it there, or at the very least make it a timed exclusive. It's asinine to think that this is acceptable. In Shenmue's case it's less of a problem since iirc it didn't have a set date (if it did then that's bad), but this still sets a poor precedent for Steam.
     
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