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Epic vs Steam - the console war comes to PC

Discussion in 'General Gaming' started by LESS T_T, Dec 4, 2018.

  1. Ismaul Arcane Patron

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    Gotta admit that not having this clause in a contract only helped to show how shitty Epic and some devs are and how much they don't care about customers. Right now losing those games has even been good press for Steam.

    Such a clause wasn't needed before and might still not be now, but we'll see how or if Steam does something in reaction.
     
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  2. fantadomat Dumbfuck! Dumbfuck Edgy

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    I was surprised how Paradox stood by their partners. There is no way a swede could have taken that decision.
     
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  3. Belegarsson Savant Patron

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    Wait until Epic store has proper DLC support :M
     
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  4. passerby Learned

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    I was thinking the same when Metro Exodus debacle started, but then I witnessed steamtards kneejerk and realised my own strong preference to keep library on Steam if possible. I see now that Epic really had no choice. They either had to pay for exclusives, or don't bother at all:
    1) If they just sold 15% cheaper, there would be no incentive for publishers to care, since you can't just increase the price on Steam over the current standard, this is not how maximising sales revenue works.
    2) 98% of gamers would still buy only on Steam: either pay more, or buy a key from reseller, or got butthurt and wait for a sale.

    I also think, they've made a huge mistake by announcing exclusives as timed, they could always release on Steam after a year if Epic turned out to be a failure, without announcing it in advance.
    When it is known it's timed, a lot of people who would eventually buy on Epic full price if they weren't given a choice, will instead wait for a super duper complete edition on 25-50% off Steam sale.

    People who run a bussiness want to maximise profit, by reducing middle man cut, companies that actually create the product *want an even bigger cut*! Imagine that :roll: What a douche bags !!
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2019
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  5. GrainWetski Arcane

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    Clearly Epic couldn't have done anything different at all. What a perfect company run by a perfect man oppressed and assaulted by "steamtards"
     
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  6. Reinhardt Arcane

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    Why stupid gaymers don't just listen to smart people who want them all dead?
     
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  7. passerby Learned

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    It's not about who is a cool guy and which platform is better. It's about a simple reality that Steam is great, close to perfect really and almost everyone have already most of their games there.
    So, from the game producing/publishing company point of view the only way to try fighting back for a part of its 20-30% digital PC game sales revenue, is to give gamers no choice to buy on Steam.

    The only other possibilities are game industry simply accepting that Steam is entitled to 25% of digital sales revenue forever, or Steam reducing their cut to remove incentive for seeking alternative platforms.
    For the record, I don't want Epic to dominate the market, I want it to pressure Steam into cut reduction and then fall into obscurity. Neither is going to happen though.
     
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  8. Reinhardt Arcane

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    Yeah, especially if they want that cut RIGHT NOW!!1
    Like games, big business should include easy mode for people who don't want to work, improve and satisfy fucking entitled customers. Why we can't just skip to dem dolla bills? Stop ableism!
     
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  9. Pretty Prophet

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    Stupid goymers!
     
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  10. passerby Learned

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    Stupid suits !
     
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  11. passerby Learned

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    Except EA, Activision, and others are satysfing normie gamers needs well enough that they were willing to spent 10 minutes to install a client and register an account on yet another service.
    Imo industry should concentrate on satysfying gamers needs through games quality well enough, that they want to support them even outside of Steam.
    Devs/publishers are Steam clients too, how about Steam stopping playing monopoly easy mode and satysfy their needs too, so they don't find it worthwhile inconveniencing gamers, by starting yet another inferior and unnecessary platform ?
     
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  12. Black Angel Magister

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    Oh God, you're one of those people.

    Look, games that still needs Steam to be installed and played, even though they're bought physically is a form of DRM, NOT 'exclusivity', no matter how much you want to twist and turn definition of the word just to justify your hateboner for Steam. When games you bought at your local store suddenly needs Steam to be installed, that's not Steam signing a contract with the devs/publishers for the game to need Steam, that's the devs/publishers utilizing Steam DRM as part of what they could use because they sell their games on Steam.
    If you bought a game from somewhere else, a reseller site like Green Man Gaming, and then suddenly it still needs Steam, that's because the game is actually a Steam key that devs/publishers generated for free, and not a single %cut gone to Valve if you buy that key.
    Now, if this is really a problem for you, you could always stick to GOG or lookup if the games you want to play is self-published on a devs website, chance are they don't need Steam/GOG and they're DRM-free, but if devs/publishers wants to utilize Steam DRM, why blame Valve for it? You should spat in the devs/publishers face for utilizing DRM at all.

    Besides, you completely forget that without Steam many indie games simply wouldn't exists, especially considering GOG has questionable curation system that prevented games mentioned by Jarl Frank (Vigilantes, Grimoire, and Das Geisterschiff) from even getting a release there. Or are you trying to say this is 'exclusivity', and that Steam paid the devs to exclusively release on Steam? Just needing Steam to at least install the games is a necessary lesser evil for these indie games to exists, and it's fine because from my experience they're DRM-free on Steam (Underrail and Age of Decadence can be launched from their .exe in Steam folder just fine, without ever launching Steam). Hell, you need internet connection anyway to download the installers from GOG, and if you're speaking in terms of physical copies....
    ....mind you, indie games mentioned above has zero chance of appearing on a local store in third world country like mine, so, once again, needing Steam to at least install the games is a necessary evil. Yeah, you could simply grab GOG copies of games like Underrail and Age of Decadence, and all will be fine. Still, it's for more """"obscure"""" games like Vigilantes, Grimoire, and Das Geisterschiff that Steam is a literal godsend, for BOTH the devs and the consumers.
     
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  13. passerby Learned

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    The fuck are you on about ? Half, of new Steam games can't be purchased in any other form than as a Steam key, or directly on Steam.
    Epic exclusive games are available in physical retail and there are key resellers selling Epic keys and in both cases Epic doesn't get a cut from these sales. It's exactly the same as with Steam exclusive games.

    Since Epic cut, unlike with Steam, is smaller than retail/reseller cut, publishers are not interested in throwing unlimited keys on the market, so the availabilty of these keys is small and prices are not attractive, but the possibility to do that is there.
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2019
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  14. Reinhardt Arcane

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    Because Steam forced them or because developers are lazy fucks?
     
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  15. passerby Learned

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    Did Epic forced anyone ? Everyone is free to sell on Epic not exclusive and don't take the sales guarantee deal, if they are offered such a deal at all. Everyone is also free to set the price there smaller than on Steam.
     
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  16. J_C One Bit Studio Patron Developer

    J_C
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    No, they just bribed them.
     
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  17. Infinitron I post news Patron

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    It's interesting to view the Epic vs Steam struggle in the context of the narrative of a broader rejection of the Web 2.0 paradigm.

    The younger generation that's abandoning the feature-heavy, full-scale social networking platform Facebook in favor of simpler platforms like Instagram, supported by a cadre of left-leaning elites rebelling against the reactionary hordes in the comments section.
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2019
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  18. Plaguecrafter Novice

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    To be fair, younger generations are leaving Facebook because their parents are on Facebook.
     
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  19. Black Angel Magister

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    Same logic to these half new games coming out on Steam. They're free to self-publish on their own website like Pierre Begue did with Knights of the Chalice or try to get in contact with GOG. But is it Steam's fault that GOG rejecting games with their curation system so the game is now only on Steam? Why is it Steam's fault that the devs are either too lazy to make the game playable without Steam, or GOG with their questionable curation system prevented them from releasing their games on GOG?

    And if you're talking about physical copies, as far as I know indie devs wouldn't be able to afford manufacture in the long run because it's far, far more expensive and takes larger cut that Steam's 30%.
     
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  20. J_C One Bit Studio Patron Developer

    J_C
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    I heard this argument with my own ears from a younger person, that is actually a real reason. Somehow they see Instagram as a no-Mom zone. At least for now.
     
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  21. passerby Learned

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    Do I complain about games being Steam exclusive ? Nope. Also no one had any incentive not to sell outside of Steam since the cut was the same and yet half of industry does that for the convenience alone.

    It's not that and Epic is loosing this uphill battle, while gamers are on the Steam side. It's just another chapter of game industry vs Steam battle over revenue cut, like Blizzard, Uplay and Origin before.
     
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  22. GrainWetski Arcane

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    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
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  23. Reinhardt Arcane

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    So what? Why should we care?
     
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  24. Black Angel Magister

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    Also, I personally didn't imply that you're, in anyway, """""complaining"""""", at all. It's mildly amusing how you Steam-haters bring up all these problems to paint Steam in bad light, and when people call out on your shit you try to shift your arguments and spew out some stupid bullshit like, "dO 1 c0mPl4iN 4b0uT gAem5 b3in6 5t34M 3xcLooo5iv3 ? nOPe."

    I'm merely pointing out all the facts, and apply your logic of "Did Epic forced anyone ? Everyone is free to sell on Epic not exclusive and don't take sales guarantee deal, if they are offered such a deal at all." to these devs releasing half new games coming out only on Steam. They ARE free NOT to sell on Steam, but as you said, why would they? But you missed one important detail about devs not wanting to not sell on Steam. It's not that the cut is the exact same as other stores, but selling on Steam expose their games to a bajillion paying customers.
     
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  25. GrainWetski Arcane

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    You should be happy. The sooner they abandon PC yet again, the better.
     
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