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Fucking ToEE, how does it work

Phelot

Arcane
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Flame wars are what drives threads to great numbers, no one wants to talk about stuff we all agree with.

How about this: What is the most important thing lost from TB to RTwP?
 
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So whats the deal with non player party members any way? More specifically concerning loot. I get the whole idea that they "get a share of the loot" but the issue is that they just grab a bunch of shit until they get ridiculously encumbered. So how do I make them sell their stuff or whatever else the solution to the problem is. So far it's only become a problem once after the bugger grabbed some elven chainmail, but since he had an "accident" I looted that stuff and then resurrected which solved the problem. :M
 

Phelot

Arcane
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Messages
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So whats the deal with non player party members any way? More specifically concerning loot. I get the whole idea that they "get a share of the loot" but the issue is that they just grab a bunch of shit until they get ridiculously encumbered. So how do I make them sell their stuff or whatever else the solution to the problem is. So far it's only become a problem once after the bugger grabbed some elven chainmail, but since he had an "accident" I looted that stuff and then resurrected which solved the problem. :M

I have to admit, I've stopped playing with NPCs... I know I know!

Anyway, this was horribly bugged in vanilla, but I assume you have some sort of Co8 patch? They should sell the stuff when you enter a barter screen IIRC. You can also install that humble NPC mod, which I believe is now included as an option in Co8 frontend (the launcher.)

If they aren't selling stuff, you can load their inventory with weightless or low weight items.
 

Roguey

Codex Staff
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Darth Roxor's comments on shitty encounter design make me hesitant about downloading this game. Should I ?
Sure, just don't take anyone lawful good and use the robes in the temple to avoid fighting all those bugbears he hates.
How about this: What is the most important thing lost from TB to RTwP?
For me it's the feeling of comfortably being in control of what's happening. You can pause all you want but you still have to divide your attention every which way when not paused.
 
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No playing vanilla as it is my first time playing the game, and I did attempt to use the barter screen in the hope that they would sell their stuff however that did not work. Thanks for the tip with weightless items though, I'll give that a try. Should stop them form carrying around to much shit and grabbing the best items.
 

Quetzacoatl

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No, Darth has had an irrational problem with this game for long :smug:

Honestly, while Roxor is right in some of his criticism, it doesn't take away from the fact that this game has some great encounters and the best D&D-engine in the history of gaming. PLAY IT NOW FAGGOT
Name me these great encounters and I'll commence download.
 

Lonely Vazdru

Pimp my Title
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For me, Emridy meadows, the broken tower, Fire temple, Earth node and I loved Hickory Branch in Co8 New content.

Now download it faggot !
 

Phelot

Arcane
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Mar 28, 2009
Messages
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No playing vanilla as it is my first time playing the game, and I did attempt to use the barter screen in the hope that they would sell their stuff however that did not work. Thanks for the tip with weightless items though, I'll give that a try. Should stop them form carrying around to much shit and grabbing the best items.

Hmmm. I'd really recommend you install Co8 for the bug fixes alone. You don't have to install the New Content patch if you don't want to. Vanilla ToEE has some frustrating bugs, some of which are game breaking. I'd hate to hear you rage about it later on, but of course installing the mod means restarting. I'd imagine they've fixed the NPC inventories by now, though I don't know for sure. You can also install the humble NPC mod which prevents NPCs from looting. You'll be swimming in gold either way.
 

Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
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Name me these great encounters and I'll commence download.

Some of the ones I like best are Lamias, Giants when you're still low-leveled, some of the bugbear-encounters where the enemy's strength lie in numbers (a rare chance in modern games to use AoE effects and abilities), the water temple construct, and four boss-monsters I won't spoil for you.

But there are lots more.
 

Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
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Oh and everyone playing should install Co8, regardless of whether they want a vanilla experience or not.
 

made

Arcane
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Some of the ones I like best are Lamias, Giants when you're still low-leveled, some of the bugbear-encounters where the enemy's strength lie in numbers (a rare chance in modern games to use AoE effects and abilities), the water temple construct, and four boss-monsters I won't spoil for you.

But there are lots more.
Like the one at Imerys Run with the giant frog and the lizardmen. I think they are supposed to aggro separately but I always got them all at once, and the giant eel on top of that sometimes. Took dozens of attempts and different tactics but felt extremely rewarding when I beat it in the end; prolly my fav fight in the whole game.
 

MetalCraze

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Some ToEE encounters are indeed beyond retarded.
Those shitty ambushes which seem to be the only way for Troika to provide ass-raping challenge.

What I mean is

1. You go to a cave. Game loads. BLAM you are standing in the middle of it and all enemies start next to you around you.
2. You open a secret door. Game loads. BLAM you are being surrounded by 20 undead who are all over you.
3. You enter a tower. Game loads. BLAM there's a filler dialogue while 20 enemies buff and get ready to rape you.
etc.

What the fuck is this shit with ambushes? Troika cannot into encounter design only some 6 years after Fallout?
If some DM was to pull this kind of crap constantly he probably would've had to visit his dentist.
 

made

Arcane
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You're complaining that, in a game that's all about combat, you enter a room and there is combat waiting for you? Or are you complaining about monsters spawning on top of you out of thin air? Because I don't remember that happening, except while resting in the wilderness.
 

desocupado

Magister
Joined
Nov 17, 2008
Messages
1,802
Ok, I installed the game with Co8 NC, but I have a couple of questions:

1 - How do I skip the Hommlet?
2 - The mouse speed is atrocious, any way to improve that? Maybe playing in a window, is it possible to do so?
 

Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
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holy shit skyway asking for popamole

The original adventure is designed that way Skyway. Me and some buddies are playing through the Pen&Paper Cormyr Trilogy which is even more skanky in its attempt to bring down the players.

If some DM was to pull this kind of crap constantly he probably would've had to visit his dentist.

awwww, skyway needs hand-holding

Seriously dude, there's no other way to see this. You're asking for less legitimate challenge. How are ambushes implicitly bad encounter-design? You'd baffle quite a bit of the best adventure-designers with that statement.
 

Roguey

Codex Staff
Staff Member
Sawyerite
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Some ToEE encounters are indeed beyond retarded.
Those shitty ambushes which seem to be the only way for Troika to provide ass-raping challenge.

What I mean is

1. You go to a cave. Game loads. BLAM you are standing in the middle of it and all enemies start next to you around you.
2. You open a secret door. Game loads. BLAM you are being surrounded by 20 undead who are all over you.
3. You enter a tower. Game loads. BLAM there's a filler dialogue while 20 enemies buff and get ready to rape you.
etc.

What the fuck is this shit with ambushes? Troika cannot into encounter design only some 6 years after Fallout?
If some DM was to pull this kind of crap constantly he probably would've had to visit his dentist.
... I don't remember any of this. Except the part with the tower and that was fun.

Also a) I'd hardly call Fallout encounter design stellar and b) they only had 19 months and fewer than 20 people to make this, in the post-mortem Tom Decker admitted that they had virtually no time in the schedule for monster placement/balance.
 
Unwanted

Kalin

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Ok, I installed the game with Co8 NC, but I have a couple of questions:

1 - How do I skip the Hommlet?
2 - The mouse speed is atrocious, any way to improve that? Maybe playing in a window, is it possible to do so?

1. I think you need someone to tell you the location of the Moathouse. As far as I know, you can get directions from a mage in the Hommlet inn (that guy will also join you if you want another companion, but he will steal scrolls as payment) and also Burne in the eastern tower. Rannos can tell you as well if you have a Chaotic Evil party.

2. I had the same problem. If you go to the options menu and change the scroll speed from 5 to 0, and then back up to 4, your mouse should behave normally. It sounds silly, but it really works.
 

MetalCraze

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How are ambushes implicitly bad encounter-design? You'd baffle quite a bit of the best adventure-designers with that statement.
You mean retarded adventure-designers?

You really don't find anything wrong with the game dropping you in a middle of enemies right away even though entrance is like 30m away not letting you to position yourself?
The thing is those aren't even real ambushes which you walk into like in well designed encounters.

IWD always has the player in control, you won't find yourself being dropped in the center of the room upon entering it with enemy fighters being in the next square from your mages. You will enter ZOMG through a door and will use formations for that. Can you imagine this dumbed down shit? I just want my mages to die before they even get to move cuz it's Trv3 Hardkkk0r3 not that popamole player-having-control bullshit
 

Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
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You really don't find anything wrong with the game dropping you in a middle of enemies right away even though entrance is like 30m away not letting you to position yourself?

Not if it makes for interesting encounter where I have to think out of the box, no. And I can't remember a single encounter in ToEE that put me into a situation that was so unfair I couldn't pull myself out of it.

As Vazdru says, never play KotC if QQ at ambushes.
 

Phelot

Arcane
Joined
Mar 28, 2009
Messages
17,908
Ok, I installed the game with Co8 NC, but I have a couple of questions:

1 - How do I skip the Hommlet?
2 - The mouse speed is atrocious, any way to improve that? Maybe playing in a window, is it possible to do so?

1. As Lonely Vazdru said, talk to the smith and ask for something different. This will allow you to speak to the captain and will allow you to do a more combat related starting quest that should get you to around the same experience as completing all of Hommlet's stuff. Then the metagamer in you will realize that you can still do the Hommlet quests, and you'll force yourself to go through all that agony simply because they're there and must be done.

2. Eh? I could have sworn there was a mouse speed setting in options, is that what you mean?


EDIT: I can sort of see where Skyway is coming from to a certain extent. I think it's just an engine limitation and how they decided to handle the changing of areas. When you go through a door that leads to that Tower encounter, it's as if your entire party ran through the door all at once and didn't see the enemy standing all around, kind of like a cartoon or something. Honestly, I don't see it as being that bad and I absolutely LOVE that encounter. Didn't really notice it until mentioned.

I think the random encounters could have been handled better. I haven't tested this, but does survival determine enemy placement? In any case, it does suck that you're apparently walking along and suddenly 3 pirates are intermingled with your party for some reason. I'm normally able to avoid them and I don't like grinding on them anyway so...
 

Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
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it's as if your entire party ran through the door all at once and didn't see the enemy standing all around, kind of like a cartoon or something.

This is what made the encounter challenging. This is what made you think out of the box. Had you been able to do "realistic" stuff you could spied through window and sent five fireballs in simultaneously reducing the encounter to ashes.

Stop fucking about, dear sirs.
 

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